From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.6 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,HTML_FONT_LOW_CONTRAST,HTML_MESSAGE, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [50.116.15.146]) by inbox.vuxu.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B132822359 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2024 21:54:36 +0100 (CET) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10352427D3; Tue, 5 Mar 2024 06:54:35 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-ua1-x932.google.com (mail-ua1-x932.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::932]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A2A07427D2 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2024 06:54:29 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-ua1-x932.google.com with SMTP id a1e0cc1a2514c-7d5bbbe592dso2790634241.0 for ; Mon, 04 Mar 2024 12:54:29 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ccc.com; s=google; t=1709585668; x=1710190468; darn=tuhs.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=8lL/ZXYe2JgZ4S5Fu4aWQEzI4XBwS2Sgnx+IinZP18M=; b=jOLQSY+K79UXfnI+V2yTBnYJzAnpfR77rLntNDgMsd/2gx2vPpMR/V3MagNDHcyis1 ni40AfgmXTQRJIyzNeHJsgcbTMdyta6ma2HHP9AZoPPNbtvmr6mUmK4vI79yvKmlYGx0 ev1gS5Eig1i9fLhUWV6F063JJSMPe7U7Iqt+o= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1709585668; x=1710190468; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=8lL/ZXYe2JgZ4S5Fu4aWQEzI4XBwS2Sgnx+IinZP18M=; b=tRJWITQ0/vO7P01bn431zb/liDD4Ys/rZT1v/DYVx72TKbTg9jtqWU+nRkcu59sEO6 B3RQC3pYCBksNs3O/KEZE+Ags/drZxLiyRGSmHKvj61PvAn1kcbZYQemAX3xRB2C3zyK CrcuZC+vdvInmwPx49tGZllz1Lwx+Qsg5eSOSAeiqjzUqglzngH2rePXcExYKtaf/93k uDSQmHWc7FaCdtfwv7qHG+TNHCnCHMY4ZdYIYXrpE7VDD9Ugha5am9waAKN96NnCspD1 cziw+da4NjKo4JmLHot3W/Nwn4aenn22rE7ZEqjTnQjmAutZ/GXlwI9KD7UGoxFpLXHm 7FiQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yy+/vSngFl5wQUZ3SMqCYjlEb2CkbZFEF9mf0k9sE2YUdQpOAGl nFFB5K12kshjWiwWjWOpyScjjOh+UjBGkSsNs6IEWneMPtTZjVUt8DP+iNq90ZpPUzSzyTGrCkf aQ30+0LmakL/7vyZLGZFyMm2gASLyzyUS3jiznSKj5BsxIbo= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFCvxj7iH/LH2U0VxiH0S02yvFCZ1uAvFEwfeeNoqIkCLjltEALl82ru4FTrK17J4HzEIyITtSyP/6yX8W4agM= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6122:2685:b0:4d3:313b:902a with SMTP id eh5-20020a056122268500b004d3313b902amr7289912vkb.12.1709585668172; Mon, 04 Mar 2024 12:54:28 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <13abd764-984a-4c9f-8e3e-b1eb7c624692@gmail.com> <7w7cih7nfd.fsf@junk.nocrew.org> In-Reply-To: <7w7cih7nfd.fsf@junk.nocrew.org> From: Clem Cole Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2024 15:53:52 -0500 Message-ID: To: Lars Brinkhoff Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000077154e0612dbee83" Message-ID-Hash: D2C3TRAQ3HPK7GP44ZIFZYW35CBG4N46 X-Message-ID-Hash: D2C3TRAQ3HPK7GP44ZIFZYW35CBG4N46 X-MailFrom: clemc@ccc.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: coff@tuhs.org, Will Senn X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [COFF] Re: [TUHS] Re: regex early discussions List-Id: Computer Old Farts Forum Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --00000000000077154e0612dbee83 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Mar 4, 2024 at 3:27=E2=80=AFPM Lars Brinkhoff wro= te: > > > I'd like expand on this, since I never heard about STOPGAP or SOS on the = MIT > PDP-6/10 computers. Hmm, you are undoubtedly right. STOPGAP and SOS might just have been at DECisms. I initially used SOS on the CMU PDP-10s to prep BLISS, Macro-10, and SAIL for a small job I got. It was the most like the editor used on other job on the Computere Center's TSS system (whose name I forget, which I learned first). I wanted to get stuff done, not learn a new editor, so that was fine. It also worked on VMS 1.0, IIRC, as I had a job moving some BLISS-10 code to BLISS32 on the first Vax. At some point, I was shown TECO and EMACS on the PDP-10s, but I had started to work on PDP-11 UNIX by then, and ed(1) was all that was on V5. At the time, learning something fancier for the PDP-10 seemed like a wrong time investment since I was not getting paid to work on that system, and I was getting paid to hack on UNIX. Truth be known, as a UNIX person, I got pretty adept with ed, so even when vi mode of ex showed up a few years later, I was actually slow to bother. Any the CMU SOS doc I have says STOPGAP was DEC/MIT-ism but I bet that's wrong -- it was probably just DEC. Jargon file says: *SOS n.,obs. /S-O-S/ 1. An infamously {losing} text editor. Once, back in the 1960s, when a text editor was needed for the PDP-6, a hacker crufted together a {quick-and-dirty} `stopgap editor' to be used until a better one was written. Unfortunately, the old one was never really discarded when new ones (in particular, {TECO}) came along. SOS is a descendant (`Son of Stopgap') of that editor, and many PDP-10 users gained the dubious pleasure of its acquaintance. Since then other programs similar in style to SOS have been written, notably the early font editor BILOS /bye'lohs/, the Brother-In-Law Of Stopgap (the alternate expansion `Bastard Issue, Loins of Stopgap' has been proposed). 2. /sos/ n. To decrease; inverse of {AOS}, from the PDP-10 instruction set.* > TECO was ported over to the 6 only a few weeks after delivers, and that > seems to have been the major editor ever since. > Did you think of the SAIL PDP-6? > Maybe. I don't know. =E1=90=A7 =E1=90=A7 --00000000000077154e0612dbee83 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On Mon, Mar 4, 2024 at 3:27= =E2=80=AFPM Lars Brinkhoff <lars@nocrew.org> wrote:


I'd like expand on this, since I never heard about STOPGAP or SOS on th= e=C2=A0MIT PDP-6/10 computers.=C2=A0
Hmm, you are=C2=A0undoubtedly=C2=A0right.=C2=A0 STOPGAP a= nd SOS might just have=C2=A0been at DECisms.
=C2=A0=
I initially used SOS on the CMU PDP-1= 0s to prep BLISS, Macro-10, and SAIL for a small job I got.=C2=A0 It was th= e most like the editor used on other=C2=A0job=C2=A0on the Computere Center&= #39;s TSS system (whose name I forget, which I learned first).=C2=A0 I want= ed to get stuff done, not learn a new editor, so that was fine.=C2=A0 It al= so worked on VMS 1.0, IIRC, as I had a job=C2=A0moving some BLISS-10 code t= o BLISS32 on the first Vax.=C2=A0= =C2=A0At some point, I was shown TECO and EMACS on the PDP-10s, but I had s= tarted to work on PDP-11 UNIX by then, and ed(1) was all that was on V5. At= the time, learning something fancier for the PDP-10 seemed like a wrong ti= me investment since I was not getting paid to work on that system, and I wa= s getting paid to hack on UNIX.=C2=A0

Truth b= e known, as a UNIX person, I got pretty adept with ed, so even when vi mode= of ex showed up a few years=C2=A0later, I was actually slow to bother.

Any the CMU=C2=A0SOS doc I have says STOPGAP was DEC/MIT-ism but I bet= that's wrong -- it was probably just DEC.

Jargon file says: SOS n.,obs. /S-O-S/ 1. An infamously {los= ing} text editor. Once, back in the 1960s, when a text editor was needed fo= r the PDP-6, a hacker crufted together a {quick-and-dirty} `stopgap editor&= #39; to be used until a better one was written. Unfortunately, the old one = was never really discarded when new ones (in particular, {TECO}) came along= . SOS is a descendant (`Son of Stopgap') of that editor, and many PDP-1= 0 users gained the dubious pleasure of its acquaintance. Since then other p= rograms similar in style to SOS have been written, notably the early font e= ditor BILOS /bye'lohs/, the Brother-In-Law Of Stopgap (the alternate ex= pansion `Bastard Issue, Loins of Stopgap' has been proposed). 2. /sos/ = n. To decrease; inverse of {AOS}, from the PDP-10 instruction set.


=C2=A0
TECO was ported over to the 6 only a few weeks=C2=A0after delivers, and that seems to have been the major editor = ever since.
Did you think of the SAIL PDP-6?
Maybe. I don't know.
3D""=E1=90=A7
3D""=E1=90=A7
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