From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.6 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED, DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED,FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN,FREEMAIL_FROM, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [IPv6:2600:3c01:e000:146::1]) by inbox.vuxu.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 214A125EB2 for ; Fri, 15 Mar 2024 08:00:41 +0100 (CET) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51DDC43107; Fri, 15 Mar 2024 17:00:32 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-ua1-x936.google.com (mail-ua1-x936.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::936]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D093143100 for ; Fri, 15 Mar 2024 17:00:24 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-ua1-x936.google.com with SMTP id a1e0cc1a2514c-7de12bcec8bso815382241.1 for ; Fri, 15 Mar 2024 00:00:24 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1710486023; x=1711090823; darn=tuhs.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=U/k60IDpmS05W5EMH33vTjIjm+ko8J3CMhjS9Qw9exM=; b=YkD0Z+3dNzmwGGZhhd/zY27SGRRtz9l2LQDcKcwqGh4uDi1Vqi5WbH2/b9nD/oXI4x FRRD7m0ALKjcZK5ddvijyPMKVdvP2rlOqWzEv1JQyF4mc7F4/F6XRrs6lEKm6CgyiXbd Lh5zeYvebMMleFeLfStC8BNdf1xNQ8QdxAwETIQ89vzgeD6mMGhrNMRnvysp0ae0CwpQ 99UE68yOH0pfbAhOdGKBmEM9PWGN38oIigic4DDm6BvjBNQP3+tebBzJKiUZCzcFrkru HaEmvapM9S5iGHH/unXAVbQqEDagd1ZByYxl6e3mmF9T7AL4FfrfPDIymidKAt9gjNdu 86fg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1710486023; x=1711090823; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=U/k60IDpmS05W5EMH33vTjIjm+ko8J3CMhjS9Qw9exM=; b=obnOd56fPY7cFpPwCqCFnnRewVrWIlnDhsqiQrGBlwqyYRwZOapy9c/npe4YK/e4Iq 7t7BzO4cIfk2wcc8+QjgkIda22wSfu6+U5VOPAofWC0AFsHc4wOYz9BK5RZH0bqO7swp pJ72NFvQwtuOnWbyn0q/GI68B93B03tnOzD2LyFsg6Wu9JeFqTdEzamfXEsxGoeYm6RU DpHD7QQocm9M+f3E2FvaNWn+JsZZsQmNttahxMIE96c+YP6WCnaFDsCGyf0HCc+6lPFP MJ/+DHYBXqgJbHICDJXksHKz8JiqIjXdR7OD0THa9zRnYDImXjHJnmSKioZe+7GTFEFh Z9iQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyU5FNV7710hvBPxa9cPCHcdvrbLHq6UbQdxp3r2UUwxDxwgejs QhgLQBqMCB/DkpEJKTsFBqleWOyZOIdzRuSUKRthydHi90C0ML9+/6Iq3Afiw9awHV5XaWPWduj 4rpSsrjW+bvBeNma9toNHDxP/g9Hxx2F5 X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IHRUqiws59m55JRk/II0bPoXXMR3GE8ECI7j3XxUEb1zFwIYmtaCJzI6AKCwVZSmtKkgIEYi7WVimiiSKmlliQ= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6102:19cb:b0:473:ac7f:8663 with SMTP id jn11-20020a05610219cb00b00473ac7f8663mr4549733vsb.1.1710486023636; Fri, 15 Mar 2024 00:00:23 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <4999eb0b-e0e5-4a79-b14f-77d17995f454@osta.com> In-Reply-To: <4999eb0b-e0e5-4a79-b14f-77d17995f454@osta.com> From: Rob Pike Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2024 18:00:12 +1100 Message-ID: To: heinz@osta.com Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000d510910613ad8f13" Message-ID-Hash: BXLFPL62H2KV6VREE3FRBQT5TM3N5DPR X-Message-ID-Hash: BXLFPL62H2KV6VREE3FRBQT5TM3N5DPR X-MailFrom: robpike@gmail.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: tuhs@tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: The Mark Williams Company and Coherent List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --000000000000d510910613ad8f13 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Another detail. There was lawyerly concern about the code being stolen, and we (127) were asked to find ways to test, absent their source, whether they had just stolen our source and built the binaries. It was soon concluded that there were enough details different to definitively say that at least most of the work was done in a clean room, as advertised, but the piece I liked best is that their PPT(1) program (ASCII art showing a paper tape rendering the argument text) did not include the original, and just discovered, bug that mispunched, if I remember right, the letter 'R'. -rob On Fri, Mar 15, 2024 at 4:16=E2=80=AFPM Heinz Lycklama wro= te: > Interesting little history about Coherent. They were > one of a few companies building UNIX-like systems > from scratch without using UNIX source code in the > early 1980's. Robert Schwartz represented the Mark > Williams Company on the /usr/group standards > effort resulting in the /usr/group Standard in 1984. > Robert was very insistent that members of the > /usr/group standards group did not have to be > UNIX source licensees. > > Heinz > > On 3/14/2024 8:45 PM, Marc Rochkind wrote: > > In another thread there's been some discussion of Coherent. I just > > came across this very detailed history, just posted last month. > > There's much more to it than I knew. > > > > https://www.abortretry.fail/p/the-mark-williams-company > > > > Marc > > > > --000000000000d510910613ad8f13 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Another detail. There was lawyerly concern about the code being s= tolen, and we (127) were asked to find ways to test, absent their source, w= hether they had just stolen our source and built the binaries. It was soon = concluded that there were enough details different to definitively say that= at least most of the work was done in a clean room, as advertised, but the= piece I liked best is that their PPT(1) program (ASCII art showing a paper= tape rendering the argument text) did not include the original, and just d= iscovered, bug that mispunched, if I remember right, the letter 'R'= .
=
-rob


On Fri, Mar 15, 2024 at 4:16=E2=80=AFPM Heinz Lycklama <= heinz@osta.com> wrote:
Interesting little history = about Coherent. They were
one of a few companies building UNIX-like systems
from scratch without using UNIX source code in the
early 1980's. Robert Schwartz represented the Mark
Williams Company on the /usr/group standards
effort resulting in the /usr/group Standard in 1984.
Robert was very insistent that members of the
/usr/group standards group did not have to be
UNIX source licensees.

Heinz

On 3/14/2024 8:45 PM, Marc Rochkind wrote:
> In another thread there's been some discussion of Coherent. I just=
> came across this very detailed history, just posted last month.
> There's much more to it than I knew.
>
> https://www.abortretry.fail/p/the-mark-w= illiams-company
>
> Marc
>

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