From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.6 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,HTML_FONT_LOW_CONTRAST,HTML_MESSAGE, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [50.116.15.146]) by inbox.vuxu.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDB3B253A0 for ; Wed, 13 Mar 2024 16:34:17 +0100 (CET) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6EF6B427E2; Thu, 14 Mar 2024 01:34:13 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-ej1-x62b.google.com (mail-ej1-x62b.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::62b]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 47302427E1 for ; Thu, 14 Mar 2024 01:34:09 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-ej1-x62b.google.com with SMTP id a640c23a62f3a-a44e3176120so888668266b.1 for ; Wed, 13 Mar 2024 08:34:09 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20230601.gappssmtp.com; s=20230601; t=1710344048; x=1710948848; darn=tuhs.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=pQsD06JBKOlUl1jmKhDdi2bOSp27yL7OPe/7yAqn1qo=; b=CyQ07pOSLITJi3JWHGSsIVON4oI92k1clHsCOlsNS9nfDk/+ivMJv0MOb6yywSkfch hF5e20ZUyyy/Se2GcxvCrZaQIOtXYeAZqADv3X23uXFzKh9HgnuCEyjqtITX6CDeeetl uauI8/r846GSz2+ek7tAKB12m4HttfJTqF4Gx2qcxFtPopyYWHjDGcgtpyDNVvBuRZr9 URzUARz4zXHXoFofUb9p6l2g2V3NQB8dzFGfVVHhRZrgwwSZ3v6noa+7DcJzYV/PE+Ab Lk4VdzwIWAHwVnOj2U+Xjdlr3uSmBVKESfO3vU2P1l8cBvHxVuMhKq6/1E+wpquNkSLI Uoxw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1710344048; x=1710948848; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=pQsD06JBKOlUl1jmKhDdi2bOSp27yL7OPe/7yAqn1qo=; b=UZHxlvVsBAidL4NcBo2u4HXXCy3zyArmup7UyZTwD5bS3j3nRE4VlWbHzC/Zbv7GfR YwQUoDWBMIaI0L9e/cdYJDnFizJSm+nuPNIVANGd9jDJrzWLVTWhTKCduRVzN+QJjc0U Brb31z89GRSdDAe1/SWCTVHtm6lfV6yUYpXt8L05CwfWQN5LjPKB6v5WhfMeMHYsfRzx MzNdZKe3XkEavqMlpzn7V7M7pyIli2j53nHyY+FPqo0PXFKNOfHKQdmykWE9STXou+gs w1JUwqqUctb4+HHO+YAvD4xiUI9M5F5DKOQyrCqs/sA4t+2pfHH2CKHRnJ3dfL8fmHv8 5btw== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCVMoZD7/b9ogFflrWAanO0xVIrg7XTrdEqV4fH59hbd4YYXweNb25L7DwlB38sRTIiLgg4HhtfgDMgbKoDS X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YwXCFbTBj4rIcd8T9sdxz4IXchqhkRL0+YpZS+Js4j3IXq/SCkC FS7EYmuMfyiB8ncJ/Lg2bY3ObeQC+eiW44sT5nStRBL0gMMjuaPjalSoY6kw9omSr4+/77xCTPa KdkpZEMWmZ5tq0X9M9LLqVdDKy9vF4NqqK8gwBQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IEsZXPcCxoBV0KlcmulgM4JBAvdp6NLhKFBpbzEH3fExaddCyivYdQzRzr5Cb4ZBkkKkbUCZ66u1yDbcXf2+Lg= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:ba84:b0:a45:ad29:72e7 with SMTP id cu4-20020a170906ba8400b00a45ad2972e7mr9458982ejd.36.1710344047586; Wed, 13 Mar 2024 08:34:07 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <12CFE503-ACC8-44B5-BA41-28DB5450E521@planet.nl> In-Reply-To: From: Warner Losh Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2024 09:33:56 -0600 Message-ID: To: Marc Rochkind Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000668ebb06138c81a9" Message-ID-Hash: 2K3K2C6YLM5H5QMKHQSQ6VBYB7KYDYIH X-Message-ID-Hash: 2K3K2C6YLM5H5QMKHQSQ6VBYB7KYDYIH X-MailFrom: wlosh@bsdimp.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: History of non-Bell C compilers? List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --000000000000668ebb06138c81a9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Mar 13, 2024, 9:28=E2=80=AFAM Marc Rochkind w= rote: > @Clem Cole , > > I don't remember what it was. But, the XT had an 8088, so certainly n > o 386 technology was involved. > Venix could also run DOS. There is a kernel module (well .o) that handles it... Warner Marc > > On Wed, Mar 13, 2024 at 8:38=E2=80=AFAM Clem Cole wrote: > >> @Marc >> >> On Tue, Mar 12, 2024 at 1:18=E2=80=AFPM Marc Rochkind >> wrote: >> >>> At a trade show, I bought a utility that allowed me to run PC-DOS under >>> PC/IX. I'm sure it wasn't a virtual machine. Rather, it just swapped ba= ck >>> and forth. (Guessing a bit there.) >>> >> Hmm ... you sure it was not either VPIX or DOS/Merge -- ISC built VPIX i= n >> cooperation with the Phoenix Tech folks for PC/IX. I always bought a cop= y >> with it, but it may have been an option. LCC did DOS/Merge originally = as >> part of the AIX work for IBM and would become a core part of OS/2 Warp >> IIRC. Both Merge and VPIX had some rough edges but certainly worked fin= e >> for DOS 3.3 programs. The issue tended to be Win and DOS graphics-based >> programs/games that played fast and loose, bypassing the DOS OS interfac= e >> and accessing the HW directly. For instance, I never got the flight >> simulator (Air War over Germany) for Dad's WWII plane (P-47 Thunderbolt)= to >> run under either (i.e., only under DOS directly on the HW. FWIW: In that >> mode, Dad said the simulator flew a lot like how he remembered it). >> >> Both Merge and VPIX used the 386 VM support and a bunch of work in the >> core OS. Heinz would have to fill us in here. The version of the 386 >> port ISC delivered to AT&T and Intel only had the kernel changes to allo= w >> the VM support for VPIX to be linked in, but it was not there. IICR (a= nd >> I'm not sure I am) is that Merge could run on PC/IX also, but you had to >> replace a couple of kernel modules. It certainly would work on the AT&T >> and Intel versions. >> =E1=90=A7 >> > > > -- > *My new email address is mrochkind@gmail.com * > --000000000000668ebb06138c81a9 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On Wed, Mar 13, 2024, 9:28=E2=80=AFAM Marc Rochkind &l= t;mrochkind@gmail.com> wrote:=
@Clem Cole,

I don't remember what it was. But, the XT had an 8088, so certa= inly n
o 386 tec= hnology was involved.

Venix could also run DOS. There is a kernel mo= dule (well .o) that handles it...

Warner=C2=A0

<= div class=3D"gmail_quote">
<= div>Marc

On Wed, Mar 13, 2024 at 8:38=E2=80=AFAM Clem Cole <clemc@ccc.= com> wrote:

On Tue, Mar 12, 2024= at 1:18=E2=80=AFPM Marc Rochkind <mrochkind@gmail.com> wrote:
=
At a trade show, I bought a utility that allowed me to run= PC-DOS under PC/IX. I'm sure it wasn't a virtual machine. Rather, = it just swapped back and forth. (Guessing a bit there.)
Hmm ... you sure it was not eithe= r VPIX or DOS/Merge -- ISC built VPIX in cooperation with the Phoenix Tech = folks for PC/IX. I always=C2=A0bought=C2=A0a copy with it, but it may have = been an option.=C2=A0 =C2=A0LCC did DOS/Merge originally as part of the AIX= work for IBM and would become a core part of OS/2 Warp IIRC.=C2=A0 Both Me= rge and VPIX had some rough edges but certainly worked fine for DOS 3.3 pro= grams.=C2=A0 The issue tended to be Win and DOS graphics-based programs/gam= es that played fast and loose, bypassing the DOS OS interface and accessing= the HW directly.=C2=A0 For instance, I never got the flight simulator (Air= War over Germany) for Dad's WWII plane (P-47 Thunderbolt) to run unde= r either (i.e., only under DOS directly on the HW. FWIW: In that mode, Da= d said the simulator flew a lot like how he remembered it).

Both Merge and VPIX used the 386 VM support and a bunch = of work in the core OS.=C2=A0 =C2=A0Heinz would have to fill us in here.=C2= =A0 The version of the 386 port ISC delivered to AT&T and Intel only ha= d the kernel changes to allow the VM support for VPIX to be linked in, but = it was not there.=C2=A0 =C2=A0IICR (and I'm not sure I am) is that Merg= e could run on PC/IX also, but you had to replace a couple of kernel module= s.=C2=A0 It certainly would work on the AT&T and Intel versions.=
3D""=E1=90=A7


--
My new email address is mrochkind@gmail.com=
--000000000000668ebb06138c81a9--