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[49.186.103.213]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a6-20020a170902ee8600b001dd02f4c2casm5240096pld.164.2024.03.11.15.28.44 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 11 Mar 2024 15:28:45 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3774.500.171.1.1\)) From: Peter Yardley In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2024 09:28:29 +1100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <12CFE503-ACC8-44B5-BA41-28DB5450E521@planet.nl> To: Marc Rochkind X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3774.500.171.1.1) Message-ID-Hash: 2K46375HV3KWO2L3COATH2MQ2FD6SJUB X-Message-ID-Hash: 2K46375HV3KWO2L3COATH2MQ2FD6SJUB X-MailFrom: peter.martin.yardley@gmail.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: "tuhs@tuhs.org" X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: History of non-Bell C compilers? List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: I used the DEC VMS C compiler extensively while I was at NSWIT. I ported = a lot of Berkley (I think) C code to VMS. Some of their VLSI design = suite, KIC etc. There weren=E2=80=99t a lot of changes to make, the = compiler and library was pretty K&R from what I remember. The usual = small header issues applied. VMS IO is a bit different from UNIX IO but = they had a mode (stream I think) that meant minimal changes to UNIX = code. = http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/pdf/dec/vax/lang/c/AI-L370C-T= E_Guide_to_VAX_C_V2.3_Mar1987.pdf It did help that the code I was working with was pretty damn good. I = learn C porting KIC to VMS. > On 12 Mar 2024, at 7:44=E2=80=AFAM, Marc Rochkind = wrote: >=20 > Since it came up in this thread, here's my review of Coherent in BYTE = Magazine (1985): >=20 > https://www.mrochkind.com/mrochkind/docs/Byte-Pick-Coherent-Theos.pdf >=20 > Marc >=20 > On Mon, Mar 11, 2024 at 11:13=E2=80=AFAM Paul Ruizendaal = wrote: > On Thu, Mar 7, 2024, 4:14=E2=80=AFPM Tom Lyon = wrote: >=20 > > For no good reason, I've been wondering about the early history of C > > compilers that were not derived from Ritchie, Johnson, and Snyder at = Bell. > > Especially for x86. Anyone have tales? > > Were any of those compilers ever used to port UNIX? >=20 > An unusual one would be the =E2=80=9Crevenue bomb=E2=80=9D compiler = that Charles Simonyi and Richard Brodie did at Microsoft in 1981. >=20 > This compiler was intended to provided a uniform environment for the = menagerie of 8 and 16-bit computers of the era. It compiled to a byte = code which executed through a small interpreter. This by itself was = hardly new of course, but it had some unique features. It generated code = in overlays, so that it could run a code base larger than 64KB (but it = defined only one data segment). It also defined a small set of = =E2=80=9Csystem=E2=80=9D commands, that allowed for uniform I/O. I still = have the implementation spec for that interpreter somewhere. >=20 > This compiler was used for the first versions of Multiplan and Word, = and my understanding is that the byte code engine was later re-used in = Visual Basic. I think the compiler also had a Xenix port, maybe it even = was Xenix native (and at this time, Xenix would still essentially have = been V7). >=20 > I am not sure to what extent this compiler was independent of the Bell = compilers. It could well be that it was based on PCC, Microsoft was a = Unix licensee after all and at the time busy doing ports. On the other = hand, Charles Simonyi would certainly have been capable of creating his = own from scratch. I do know that this compiler preceded Lattice C, the = latter of which was distributed by Microsoft as Microsoft C 1.0. >=20 > Maybe others know more about this Simonyi/Brodie compiler? >=20 > Paul >=20 > Notes: > http://www.memecentral.com/mylife.htm > = https://web.archive.org/web/20080905231519/http://www.computerworld.com/so= ftwaretopics/software/appdev/story/0%2C10801%2C76413%2C00.html > http://seefigure1.com/images/xenix/xenix-timeline.jpg >=20 >=20 > --=20 > My new email address is mrochkind@gmail.com Peter Yardley peter.martin.yardley@gmail.com