wrote: >> That reminds me. Weren=E2=80=99t there some Inferno ports for micro contr= ollers, >=20 > Until now I did not have a need for this, so I do not know. > But often there is a need for a compact live VM with a ready OS that > must be run on a public terminal. This is a problem. Live USB I can > not load to the terminal, it forbidden. I found only Puppy Linux in > the Virtual Box, but it works very slowly. >=20 > I many times used Inferno on the desktop in the past, but I had > FreeBSD. It was usability. And here on Windows10x64 now the emu don't > start. It's a pity. >=20 > A modern OS to become popular should have a Live USB and ready-made > assemblies for almost everything. I'm sorry that Inferno does not have > a power now. >=20 > --=20 > http://andr.ru >=20 --Apple-Mail-F51737DC-B30A-4F99-A245-C2F7F53CA51F Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I honestly don=E2=80=99t th= ink Plan9 or Inferno will become =E2=80=9Cgeneral use=E2=80=9D without (at t= he very least) a modern browser, but that was not what motivated me to post h= ere.

Inferno, dis and 9p seem like a good fit for e= mbedded devices, and having run it successfully on a Raspberry Pi a few mont= hs ago (https://bitbucke= t.org/infpi/inferno-rpi), I was wondering if the kernel and network stac= k would be shrunk down to something like an ESP8266 (although don=E2=80=99t t= hink that has enough heap space).

A while back ther= e was the Aijuboard (https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/aijuboard#/), but nothing else se= ems to have popped up since 2015, and any industrial applications of Inferno= that might be interesting are likely squirreled away in commercial companie= s...

So I=E2=80=99d like to know if anyone here kno= ws about recent efforts to run Inferno on other tiny machines...

<= br>

Happy New Year,

On 3= 0 Dec 2017, at 19:57, Andre Wingor <andrewingor@gmail.com> wrote:

On 12/30/17, Rui Carmo <rui.carmo@gmail.com> wrote:
= That reminds me. Weren=E2=80=99t there some Inferno ports for micro co= ntrollers,

Until now I did not= have a need for this, so I do not know.
But often there is a= need for a compact live VM with a ready OS that
must be run= on a public terminal. This is a problem. Live USB I can
not= load to the terminal, it forbidden. I found only Puppy Linux in
<= span>the Virtual Box, but it works very slowly.

<= span>I many times used Inferno on the desktop in the past, but I had<= br>FreeBSD. It was usability. And here on Windows10x64 now the emu don= 't
start. It's a pity.

A mo= dern OS to become popular should have a Live USB and ready-made
assemblies for almost everything. I'm sorry that Inferno does not have
a power now.

--
<= span>http://andr.ru

= --Apple-Mail-F51737DC-B30A-4F99-A245-C2F7F53CA51F-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2017 18:28:48 +0000 From: "Brian L. Stuart" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> Message-ID: <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423@mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c7ec1d38-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 On Sun, 12/31/17, Rui Carmo wrote: > I honestly don=E2=80=99t think Plan9 or Inferno will become > =E2=80=9Cgeneral use=E2=80=9D without (at the very least) a modern > browser, For which we can all be grateful. "General use" is not a good thing to be desired. One of the biggest reasons I moved away from Linux was that it was becoming too mainstream for me. > Inferno, dis and 9p seem like a good fit for > embedded devices, Very true. > So I=E2=80=99d like to know if anyone here knows about > recent efforts to run Inferno on other tiny > machines... Not particularly recent, but several years ago I ported Inferno to the SunSPOT device. As I recall, the version I was using had 1MB of RAM and 4MB of flash. It took some squeezing (like severely reducing the size of the ARP tables), but I did get it running including IPv6 over the 802.15.4 radio in it. BLS From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Steve Simon Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2017 18:50:53 +0000 Message-Id: <0C27ADF2-82BC-4F7F-9AA0-6D219789C3DE@quintile.net> References: <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423@mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423@mail.yahoo.com> To: "Brian L. Stuart" , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c7f8ed74-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 mmm, not sure i agree. i would be very happy to see a modern browser on plan9, though i would not want anyone to spend a lot of time supporting one. a few years ago cinap got opera and firefox to run as linux binaries under l= inuxemu. i spent some time tweaking that code to run more recent releases bu= t sadly the linux kernel api was changing too fast for my spare time to keep= up with it. i still think this might be a good approach but have less time (more kids) t= o work on such a project. the other route might be to piggy back on some of the harvey os work. in the meantime i just use remote desktop to a windows box. -Steve > On 31 Dec 2017, at 18:28, Brian L. Stuart wrote: >=20 >> On Sun, 12/31/17, Rui Carmo wrote: >> I honestly don=E2=80=99t think Plan9 or Inferno will become >> =E2=80=9Cgeneral use=E2=80=9D without (at the very least) a modern >> browser, >=20 > For which we can all be grateful. "General use" is not a > good thing to be desired. One of the biggest reasons I > moved away from Linux was that it was becoming too > mainstream for me. >=20 >> Inferno, dis and 9p seem like a good fit for >> embedded devices, >=20 > Very true. >=20 >> So I=E2=80=99d like to know if anyone here knows about >> recent efforts to run Inferno on other tiny >> machines... >=20 > Not particularly recent, but several years ago I ported > Inferno to the SunSPOT device. As I recall, the version > I was using had 1MB of RAM and 4MB of flash. It took > some squeezing (like severely reducing the size of the > ARP tables), but I did get it running including IPv6 over > the 802.15.4 radio in it. >=20 > BLS From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Bakul Shah To: "Brian L. Stuart" , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 31 Dec 2017 18:28:48 +0000." <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423@mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <15616.1514746812.1@bitblocks.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2017 11:00:12 -0800 Message-Id: <20171231190027.5907D156E523@mail.bitblocks.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c8013790-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 On Sun, 31 Dec 2017 18:28:48 +0000 "Brian L. Stuart" wrote: Brian L. Stuart writes: > On Sun, 12/31/17, Rui Carmo wrote: > > I honestly don't think Plan9 or Inferno will become > > "general use" without (at the very least) a modern > > browser, > = > For which we can all be grateful. "General use" is not a > good thing to be desired. One of the biggest reasons I > moved away from Linux was that it was becoming too > mainstream for me. I don't think we can assume a more popular plan9 would have met the fate of Linux. What bothers (some of) us is not that Linux is mainstream but that it is far too complicated and kitchensinky. Guess we will never know! > > Inferno, dis and 9p seem like a good fit for > > embedded devices, > = > Very true. > = > > So I'd like to know if anyone here knows about > > recent efforts to run Inferno on other tiny > > machines... > = > Not particularly recent, but several years ago I ported > Inferno to the SunSPOT device. As I recall, the version > I was using had 1MB of RAM and 4MB of flash. It took > some squeezing (like severely reducing the size of the > ARP tables), but I did get it running including IPv6 over > the 802.15.4 radio in it. Wasn't Styx-on-a-Brick running on a device with 32K RAM + 16K ROM? Though that was for controlling a Lego Mindstorm device. Recently on another mailing list someone wanted a secure "personal" encrypted filesystem on a removable SDcard. = Even the encryption key is fed at runtime so if you just have the SD card, it appears to contain random junk. I suggested a Raspi Zero but I think it would be possible to build this using an ESP8266 device, talking 9p (or html). May be you can even send the FS encryption key over 9p! From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20171231190027.5907D156E523@mail.bitblocks.com> References: <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423@mail.yahoo.com> <20171231190027.5907D156E523@mail.bitblocks.com> From: Skip Tavakkolian Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2017 11:16:57 -0800 Message-ID: To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f403045fab0aa05aae0561a7b518" Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c80522d8-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 --f403045fab0aa05aae0561a7b518 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Sun, Dec 31, 2017 at 11:00 AM, Bakul Shah wrote: > > > Wasn't Styx-on-a-Brick running on a device with 32K RAM + 16K > ROM? Though that was for controlling a Lego Mindstorm device. > I think that was just a 9P fs on the lego brick. --f403045fab0aa05aae0561a7b518 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

= On Sun, Dec 31, 2017 at 11:00 AM, Bakul Shah <bakul@bitblocks.com&g= t; wrote:

Wasn't Styx-on-a-Brick running on a device with 32K RAM + 16K ROM? Though that was for controlling a Lego Mindstorm device.

I think that was just a 9P fs on the lego brick.

--f403045fab0aa05aae0561a7b518-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2017 19:47:37 +0000 From: "Brian L. Stuart" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net>, Bakul Shah Message-ID: <125383542.7354050.1514749657604@mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <125383542.7354050.1514749657604.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c8096960-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 On Sun, 12/31/17, Bakul Shah wrote: > I don't think we can assume a more popular plan9 would have > met the fate of Linux. What bothers (some of) us is not that > Linux is mainstream but that it is far too complicated and > kitchensinky. I'd like to think that there can be widespread use without the bloat and absurdities. However, I suspect that overly complicated and kitchensinky is necessary for mainstream. From what I've observed over the last 40 years, even among those who are technically educated, the subset who will choose well-designed over packed-with-unused-features is sadly small. Seeing how many "modern" programmers immediately reach for the obscene JavaScript "frameworks" for everything they do is enough to drive one to drink. I will admit that the cause and effect might also work in the other direction. There does seem to be a very real case to be made that as a system becomes more popular, it attracts more people who lack the judgement and the good taste to say 'no' to features that don't fit well. Personally, I think that popularity and bloat form a positive feedback loop that stalls out once the complexity budget is exhausted. From then on, all future releases merely rearrange the bugs. Certainly, I'd love to be proved wrong. But I can't think of any examples where the mainstream user and developer communities were able to resist the latest "ooh shiny." Just look how long it's taken for the community to realize that flash was a bad idea. BLS From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Message-ID: From: "Steve Simon" Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2017 19:48:06 +0000 To: 9fans@9fans.net In-Reply-To: <20171231190027.5907D156E523@mail.bitblocks.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c8160bfc-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 Russ had a set of diffs to kfs to make it an encrypted filesystem... -Steve From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <3894BD22-87BA-4D9F-9A82-721BEDCA73BD@gmail.com> References: <3894BD22-87BA-4D9F-9A82-721BEDCA73BD@gmail.com> From: Skip Tavakkolian Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2017 11:49:01 -0800 Message-ID: To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a1142ad464f64380561a828b2" Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c8227036-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 --001a1142ad464f64380561a828b2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Dec 31, 2017 at 7:27 AM, Rui Carmo wrote: > I honestly don=E2=80=99t think Plan9 or Inferno will become =E2=80=9Cgene= ral use=E2=80=9D without > (at the very least) a modern browser, but that was not what motivated me = to > post here. > > Inferno, dis and 9p seem like a good fit for embedded devices, and having > run it successfully on a Raspberry Pi a few months ago ( > https://bitbucket.org/infpi/inferno-rpi), I was wondering if the kernel > and network stack would be shrunk down to something like an ESP8266 > (although don=E2=80=99t think that has enough heap space). > I started porting a 9p library and writing an fs for esp8266 using espressif sdk, but stopped once I found out tls1.2 isn't supported (not fixable; bug in firmware). I think esp32 is a better choice, but then, why not use rpi-zero or other ARM, MIPS devices. Arguments for esp32 for power budget reasons might be exaggerated a little (see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DDDpuBJYFJ7Y&t= =3D131s ) there is also proprietary firmware involved. In my opinion, esp8266 should be categorized as an "attractive nuisance". > A while back there was the Aijuboard (https://www.indiegogo.com/ > projects/aijuboard#/), but nothing else seems to have popped up since > 2015, and any industrial applications of Inferno that might be interestin= g > are likely squirreled away in commercial companies... > > So I=E2=80=99d like to know if anyone here knows about recent efforts to = run > Inferno on other tiny machines... > > Happy New Year, > > > --001a1142ad464f64380561a828b2 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

On Sun, Dec 31, 2017 at 7:27 AM, Rui Carmo <rui.carmo@gmail.com&= gt; wrote:

I honestly don=E2=80=99t think Plan9 or Infer= no will become =E2=80=9Cgeneral use=E2=80=9D without (at the very least) a = modern browser, but that was not what motivated me to post here.
=
Inferno, dis and 9p seem like a good fit for embedded device= s, and having run it successfully on a Raspberry Pi a few months ago (https://bi= tbucket.org/infpi/inferno-rpi), I was wondering if the kernel and = network stack would be shrunk down to something like an ESP8266 (although d= on=E2=80=99t think that has enough heap space).

I started porting a 9p library and writing an fs for esp82= 66 using espressif sdk, but stopped once I found out tls1.2 isn't suppo= rted (not fixable; bug in firmware).

I think esp32 is a bette= r choice, but then, why not use rpi-zero or other ARM, MIPS devices. Argume= nts for esp32 for power budget reasons might be exaggerated a little (see <= a href=3D"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DDDpuBJYFJ7Y&t=3D131s">https= ://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DDDpuBJYFJ7Y&t=3D131s )

there= is also proprietary firmware involved.

In my opin= ion, esp8266 should be categorized as an "attractive nuisance".

A while back there was the Aijuboard (htt= ps://www.indiegogo.com/projects/aijuboard#/), but nothing else see= ms to have popped up since 2015, and any industrial applications of Inferno= that might be interesting are likely squirreled away in commercial compani= es...

So I=E2=80=99d like to know if anyone here k= nows about recent efforts to run Inferno on other tiny machines...

Happy New Year,

--001a1142ad464f64380561a828b2-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <0C27ADF2-82BC-4F7F-9AA0-6D219789C3DE@quintile.net> References: <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423@mail.yahoo.com> <0C27ADF2-82BC-4F7F-9AA0-6D219789C3DE@quintile.net> From: hiro <23hiro@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2017 21:43:07 +0100 Message-ID: To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c8267dac-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 > i would be very happy to see a modern browser on plan9, though > i would not want anyone to spend a lot of time supporting one. > in the meantime i just use remote desktop to a windows box. what's the difference really? i also remote into a windows box, from my linux box. and i drawterm into my 9front box. why not have all of those, at the same time, instead of faking one to be more like the other? From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: References: <3894BD22-87BA-4D9F-9A82-721BEDCA73BD@gmail.com> From: hiro <23hiro@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2017 22:05:22 +0100 Message-ID: To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c82b1f1a-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 > I started porting a 9p library and writing an fs for esp8266 using > espressif sdk, but stopped once I found out tls1.2 isn't supported (not > fixable; bug in firmware). > I think esp32 is a better choice, but then, why not use rpi-zero or other > ARM, MIPS devices. Arguments for esp32 for power budget reasons might be > exaggerated a little (see > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDpuBJYFJ7Y&t=131s > ) > there is also proprietary firmware involved. > > In my opinion, esp8266 should be categorized as an "attractive nuisance". what about esp8266's power usage? is *that* lower? why does it take 4! seconds to send data?! From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: References: <3894BD22-87BA-4D9F-9A82-721BEDCA73BD@gmail.com> From: Shane Morris Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2018 09:48:55 +1100 Message-ID: To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c07d522a55ffa0561aaabaf" Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c83023d4-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 --94eb2c07d522a55ffa0561aaabaf Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" I've got one of these boards kicking around: https://core-electronics.com.au/realtek-ameba-board.html ARM Cortex-M3 CPU, wifi, my board has the NFC, there is one that looks like a NodeMCU, it has basic features. I've not used the smaller board. I'm using an Arduino bootloader on my Ameba for now, its able to have the flash ROM mounted, and the Arduino toolchain copies the compiled firmware file over, a bit like the Freescale Kinetis "Freedom" boards I was using in 2013. There is a JTAG port, non-populated, I don't have the JTAG programmer - of course. This board with an Inferno system on it, and perhaps an SPI LCD driver, would be awesome. I see now the Nextion HMI LCDs are a serial port controlled affair, you upload your graphics and all that to the micro SD card as *another* compiled firmware. I was going to source a Nextion HMI along with a Cytron motor driver late next week from Western Australia, no holding my breath on when it'll turn up however. The board and screen assembly is meant to go into a control head project for a potentially remotely controlled ride in locomotive, a grid operating system would be perfect for what I'm trying to accomplish. It will have CAN Bus, RS485, Dallas One Wire, et al, all embedded type communications standards, and be a rather souped up PLC type affair. Except I have little idea of how to port anything. I guess I could go back to the work done on Lynxline, and try to replicate it somehow, I believe I read Charles report done for him on Vita Nuova about the Styx on a Brick, I'd gotten rid of my Lego RIS2.0 many years before I saw that report, shame. The "Brick" was quite limited, so is 9Pea on ATMega, iirc... My $0.02 likely not worth $0.02 due to inflation. Happy New Year all! On Mon, Jan 1, 2018 at 8:05 AM, hiro <23hiro@gmail.com> wrote: > > I started porting a 9p library and writing an fs for esp8266 using > > espressif sdk, but stopped once I found out tls1.2 isn't supported (not > > fixable; bug in firmware). > > I think esp32 is a better choice, but then, why not use rpi-zero or other > > ARM, MIPS devices. Arguments for esp32 for power budget reasons might be > > exaggerated a little (see > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDpuBJYFJ7Y&t=131s > > ) > > there is also proprietary firmware involved. > > > > In my opinion, esp8266 should be categorized as an "attractive nuisance". > > what about esp8266's power usage? is *that* lower? why does it take 4! > seconds to send data?! > > --94eb2c07d522a55ffa0561aaabaf Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I've got one of these boards kicking around:

<= /div>

https://core-electronics.com.au/realtek-ameba-board.html

<= div>

ARM Cortex-M3 CPU, wifi, my board has the NFC, there is = one that looks like a NodeMCU, it has basic features. I've not used the= smaller board.

I'm using an Arduino bootloade= r on my Ameba for now, its able to have the flash ROM mounted, and the Ardu= ino toolchain copies the compiled firmware file over, a bit like the Freesc= ale Kinetis "Freedom" boards I was using in 2013. There is a JTAG= port, non-populated, I don't have the JTAG programmer - of course.

This board with an Inferno system on it, and perhaps = an SPI LCD driver, would be awesome. I see now the Nextion HMI LCDs are a s= erial port controlled affair, you upload your graphics and all that to the = micro SD card as another=C2=A0compiled firmware. I was going to sour= ce a Nextion HMI along with a Cytron motor driver late next week from Weste= rn Australia, no holding my breath on when it'll turn up however.

The board and screen assembly is meant to go into a con= trol head project for a potentially remotely controlled ride in locomotive,= a grid operating system would be perfect for what I'm trying to accomp= lish. It will have CAN Bus, RS485, Dallas One Wire, et al, all embedded typ= e communications standards, and be a rather souped up PLC type affair.

Except I have little idea of how to port anything. I g= uess I could go back to the work done on Lynxline, and try to replicate it = somehow, I believe I read Charles report done for him on Vita Nuova about t= he Styx on a Brick, I'd gotten rid of my Lego RIS2.0 many years before = I saw that report, shame. The "Brick" was quite limited, so is 9P= ea on ATMega, iirc...

My $0.02 likely not worth $0= .02 due to inflation. Happy New Year all!

On Mon, Jan 1, 2018 at 8:05 AM, hiro <2= 3hiro@gmail.com> wrote:

> I started porting a 9p library and writing an fs for esp= 8266 using
> espressif sdk, but stopped once I found out tls1.2 isn't supported= (not
> fixable; bug in firmware).
> I think esp32 is a better choice, but then, why not use rpi-zero or ot= her
> ARM, MIPS devices. Arguments for esp32 for power budget reasons might = be
> exaggerated a little (see
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v= =3DDDpuBJYFJ7Y&t=3D131s
> )
> there is also proprietary firmware involved.
>
> In my opinion, esp8266 should be categorized as an "attractive nu= isance".

what about esp8266's power usage? is *that* lower? why does it t= ake 4!
seconds to send data?!

--94eb2c07d522a55ffa0561aaabaf-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.2 $3445.5.20$) From: Rui Carmo In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2018 14:31:36 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <3894BD22-87BA-4D9F-9A82-721BEDCA73BD@gmail.com> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c83b2d10-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 > On 31 Dec 2017, at 21:05, hiro <23hiro@gmail.com> wrote: >=20 >> I started porting a 9p library and writing an fs for esp8266 using >> espressif sdk, but stopped once I found out tls1.2 isn't supported = (not >> fixable; bug in firmware). >> I think esp32 is a better choice, but then, why not use rpi-zero or = other >> ARM, MIPS devices. Arguments for esp32 for power budget reasons might = be >> exaggerated a little (see >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DDDpuBJYFJ7Y&t=3D131s >> ) >> there is also proprietary firmware involved. >>=20 >> In my opinion, esp8266 should be categorized as an "attractive = nuisance". >=20 > what about esp8266's power usage? is *that* lower? why does it take 4! > seconds to send data?! I honestly don=E2=80=99t see it as slow, or as a nuisance, but then = again I have several around the house, some incorporated into commercial = products like the Sonoff S20 outlets, which I control over MQTT with = open source firmware. Where it relates to power consumption, I have sensors running in = low-power mode powered by AA batteries that last me many months, since = the ESP8266 only consumes 40 _micro_ amperes of power in deep sleep, and = waking up every 5 minutes to read a sensor and pushing out a single data = packet isn=E2=80=99t especially taxing on the batteries. R. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.2 $3445.5.20$) From: Rui Carmo In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2018 14:35:46 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423@mail.yahoo.com> <0C27ADF2-82BC-4F7F-9AA0-6D219789C3DE@quintile.net> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c83f49fe-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 > On 31 Dec 2017, at 20:43, hiro <23hiro@gmail.com> wrote: >=20 >> i would be very happy to see a modern browser on plan9, though >> i would not want anyone to spend a lot of time supporting one. >=20 >> in the meantime i just use remote desktop to a windows box. >=20 > what's the difference really? i also remote into a windows box, from > my linux box. and i drawterm into my 9front box. why not have all of > those, at the same time, instead of faking one to be more like the > other? >=20 Perhaps because then you wouldn=E2=80=99t need those other boxes as = much? I find the notion of having a minimal self-sufficient environment = (i.e., one with creature comforts like a browser to read documentation) = interesting - and achievable on other operating systems. R. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: References: <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423@mail.yahoo.com> <0C27ADF2-82BC-4F7F-9AA0-6D219789C3DE@quintile.net>

From: hiro <23hiro@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2018 18:23:08 +0100 Message-ID: To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c8435c4c-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 "minimal self-sufficient environment": agreed, the 9front man pages, documentation and fqa can be read with page, man and mothra for the web, served by sl's rc-httpd/werc setup. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2018 11:46:27 -0800 From: Ori Bernstein To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> Message-Id: <20180102114627.b09367516685424e21dd703e@eigenstate.org> In-Reply-To: References: <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1799452333.7330135.1514744928423@mail.yahoo.com> <0C27ADF2-82BC-4F7F-9AA0-6D219789C3DE@quintile.net>

Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: [9fans] Inferno on microcontrollers Topicbox-Message-UUID: c8ae59ac-ead9-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 On Tue, 2 Jan 2018 14:35:46 +0000 Rui Carmo wrote: >=20 > Perhaps because then you wouldn=E2=80=99t need those other boxes as muc= h? I find the > notion of having a minimal self-sufficient environment (i.e., one with > creature comforts like a browser to read documentation) interesting - a= nd > achievable on other operating systems. >=20 > R. >=20 Exactly. That's why I finally caved and ordered a new laptop, one that ca= n run aux/vmx on 9front, and use a virtual machine with a browser without needing access to another machine. --=20 Ori Bernstein