From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] EROS, Vapour From: David Gordon Hogan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-lauojctlgmgfkvwysbclrhxmka" Message-Id: <20010831181638.6676F199DD@mail.cse.psu.edu> Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 14:13:26 -0400 Topicbox-Message-UUID: e8079918-eac9-11e9-9e20-41e7f4b1d025 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-lauojctlgmgfkvwysbclrhxmka Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Inferno does this. --upas-lauojctlgmgfkvwysbclrhxmka Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Aug 31 04:51:32 EDT 2001 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Aug 31 04:51:25 EDT 2001 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 663D419A5D; Fri, 31 Aug 2001 04:51:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 736DD199E9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 31 Aug 2001 04:50:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 15cjve-0000bY-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 31 Aug 2001 09:45:30 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Eyal Lotem Message-ID: <3b8ea46f@news.bezeqint.net> Organization: HyperRoll Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit References: , <015c01c130a2$0a325330$a2b9c6d4@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] EROS, Vapour Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.6 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 08:45:21 GMT Boyd Roberts wrote: >> I think all the OS projects that use C++ figure that one out sooner or >> later ... > > i fear that C++ coder's brains are so damaged by the experience that > they are _incapable_ of figuring it out. snow crash, indeed. Well, EROS is moving to C, and Vapour is as far from C\C++ as you can imagine. The whole *point* behind Vapour is that it uses a safe language, rather than damage-prevention hardware protection, which allows a lot of the tests to move to compiletime, and allows interesting things, such as guaranteeing running code complies with object interfaces, without verifying this in runtime (Sometimes it could be unverifiable, or very expensive to verify). A serious advantage of Vapour for example, is since it doesn't reuqire hardware protection, it can run many threads simulataniously, all in kernel mode, all synchronizing via cheap test&set processor instructions, whereas in Plan9/etc. an expensive switch to kernel mode is required, making heavily parallel things unpractical (the cost of mutexes becomes higher than the gain of parallelism). --upas-lauojctlgmgfkvwysbclrhxmka--