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From: Dan Cross <cross@math.psu.edu>
To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu
Subject: Re: [9fans] Installed Plan 9, now what?
Date: Mon,  8 Dec 2003 23:54:45 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <200312090454.hB94skl24638@augusta.math.psu.edu> (raw)
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 08 Dec 2003 20:02:56 PST." <b1d88ffde415a2a9ad07345a8534a4bc@collyer.net>

What Scott said.  My concerns here stem from my days as a Lunix system
administrator, and the difficulty of keeping localized changes straight
in the face of vendor changes; RCS, though used, didn't do everything,
because vendors started making necessary changes that simply checking a
file out from RCS would overwrite.  All the diffing and patching became
tedious; multiplying that over hundreds of machines with different
functions in tens of different administrative domains quickly leads to
a lot of tedious work.  While Plan 9's architecture really attenuates
the problem, I'd like to try and eliminate it.

This isn't Unix; there's only one vendor.  As for division of
change-authority (for lack of a better term), it's really simple:
anything with the name local in it is off limits for any `vendors' (ie,
Bell Labs).  Everything else is `change at your own peril' for everyone
else.  Create /dist/replica/defaults, that tries to dot
/dist/replica/defaults.local.  Problem solved.

It could be argued that the proliferation of hacks Geoff mentions in
Lunix-land happened because no one ever had a decent convention that
allowed for a clear seperation of authority between vendors and sites.
We have an opportunity with Plan 9 to try and do it right, and we
should.  Rob's paper on the death of systems research lists system
administration as a problem area worthy of investigation; instead of
sticking our collective heads in the sand and pretending this is a
non-problem, let's tackle it head on and figure out a good way to
address it.  Is all the .local stuff perfect?  No, not really, and the
warnings are good, because they give us perspective.  But, what's a
better alternative?  I'm all eyes.

	- Dan C.



  parent reply	other threads:[~2003-12-09  4:54 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 30+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2003-12-08 12:48 David Presotto
2003-12-08 15:10 ` andrey mirtchovski
2003-12-08 16:21   ` David Presotto
2003-12-08 19:30   ` Dan Cross
2003-12-08 21:14     ` david presotto
2003-12-08 22:20       ` Dan Cross
2003-12-09  0:55         ` David Presotto
2003-12-09  1:20           ` Russ Cox
2003-12-09  1:29             ` Dan Cross
2003-12-09  1:36               ` Russ Cox
2003-12-09  3:00                 ` Dan Cross
2003-12-09  4:02                   ` Geoff Collyer
2003-12-09  3:44                     ` mirtchov
2003-12-09  4:10                     ` Scott Schwartz
2003-12-07  9:59                       ` Charles Forsyth
2003-12-07 10:28                         ` Charles Forsyth
2003-12-09  4:33                       ` Geoff Collyer
2003-12-09  4:54                     ` Dan Cross [this message]
2003-12-09  7:47                       ` okamoto
2003-12-09 11:23                       ` a
2003-12-09 12:12                         ` boyd, rounin
2003-12-09 18:33                       ` splite
2003-12-09 19:23                         ` Brantley Coile
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2003-12-09  7:55 YAMANASHI Takeshi
2003-12-09 13:49 ` David Presotto
2003-12-08 11:36 Tiit Lankots
2003-12-08 14:51 ` ron minnich
2003-12-08 15:00 ` Russ Cox
2003-12-08 10:08 Sujan Gautam
2003-12-08 13:53 ` mirtchov

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