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Sun, 22 Aug 2021 03:04:47 -0700 Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm GPU (was: Software philosophy) To: 9fans@9fans.net References: <4fb3ad2e48e31b089705a85b1374de02@hera.eonet.ne.jp> <18d7f6cc-8e13-4229-9fe3-d9247a3153fc@sirjofri.de> From: "Frank D. Engel, Jr." Message-ID: <26f2d31b-da03-f2c5-dda0-e03436c26b84@fjrhome.net> Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 06:04:41 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.14; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.13.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <18d7f6cc-8e13-4229-9fe3-d9247a3153fc@sirjofri.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"; format="flowed" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en-US X-Exim-Id: 26f2d31b-da03-f2c5-dda0-e03436c26b84 X-Bayes-Prob: 0.9999 (Score 4, tokens from: base:default, @@RPTN) X-CanIt-Geo: No geolocation information available for 192.168.101.1 X-CanItPRO-Stream: base:default X-Canit-Stats-ID: 015Iy57AL - 5d51957d3289 - 20210822 X-Scanned-By: CanIt (www . roaringpenguin . com) on 192.168.101.81 X-Originating-IP: 192.168.101.81 Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 72c92032-0330-11ec-b6c3-dde27ceb7ffe Archived-At: =?UTF-8?B?PGh0dHBzOi8vOWZhbnMudG9waWNib3guY29tL2dyb3Vwcy85?= =?UTF-8?B?ZmFucy9UNjVlYzY0YWRiNTEzNzg3NC1NYTEyYzZlNzY5Njk5ZjVjM2I1NjFm?= =?UTF-8?B?YmYyPg==?= List-Help: List-Id: "9fans" <9fans.9fans.net> List-Post: List-Software: Topicbox v0 List-Subscribe: Precedence: list Reply-To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> List-Unsubscribe: , Topicbox-Delivery-ID: 2:9fans:437d30aa-c441-11e9-8a57-d036212d11b0:522be890-2105-11eb-b15e-8d699134e1fa:Ma12c6e769699f5c3b561fbf2:1:A21ux_3mFt81W8SaIngOnbbhBvGaeoWfHxWrt_8P2J4 While not necessarily unwelcome as a possibility, I don't think=20 GPU-based drawing/gaming is as relevant to this discussion (or as=20 important of a goal for Plan 9 / 9front) as is GPU compute (GPGPU). The ability to leverage GPU resources across CPU servers for computation=20 purposes would be of great benefit to the platform, and working out a=20 driver interface by starting the process remotely via drawterm seems=20 like a sensible step in that direction. On 8/22/21 3:07 AM, sirjofri wrote: > > 22.08.2021 05:16:42 Eli Cohen : >> deep learning is another interest of mine too. hardware support is a >> big deal for that... some kind of support for GPUs would be nice. >> people have discussed that for years... hardware drivers are difficult >> and important to do correctly! >> >> I always really liked the "XCPU" and drawterm type ideas of using >> other OSes for their existing strengths along with Plan 9. maybe >> drawterm could have a GPU device driver or something... that being >> said I have sometimes found it ends up surprisingly easier doing it >> all on Plan 9... >=20 > That's also something I thought about a few times already: drawterm > with GPU support. The only issue I see is, for realtime applications > like games the draw times would be network bound and thus pretty slow. > It would work for heavy GPU applications where almost no draw calls > will exist (no textures, very low poly meshes, ...), but for heavier > stuff we'd need to address that. >=20 > That's the benefit of a native driver: you could calculate the server > side (heavy CPU calculations) on a cpu server, the client/frontend > side (including draw calls) on a terminal and the pure graphics on the > GPU. >=20 > I'd still give the drawterm GPU a shot. Maybe I can set drawterm up > for compilation on my work PC (two GTX 1080Ti) and try figuring out > how to do all that stuff. However, I've never done graphics > applications on windows or somewhere else that uses OpenGL or DirectX > (I'd try OpenGL because portability), only written shaders so far. > I'll surely need some time (which is always rare as a game developer). >=20 > Btw I don't know the exact specifications for GPU usage for neural > networks. I assume it's all compute shaders? Maybe it's even a kinda > blackbox, put stuff in (draw call), read things out. I assume this can > work perfectly fine for draw times, depending on the data. >=20 > sirjofri ------------------------------------------ 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T65ec64adb5137874-Ma12c6= e769699f5c3b561fbf2 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription