From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <7d3530220908030909k3d25bbd7ofaf77cf1aaee55c3@mail.gmail.com> References: <7d3530220908030909k3d25bbd7ofaf77cf1aaee55c3@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 3 Aug 2009 21:29:14 -0400 Message-ID: <283f5df10908031829x4844674fndad0d69815a4b2b@mail.gmail.com> From: LiteStar numnums To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001485f7c41e821886047046d00a Subject: Re: [9fans] An excerpt from Syllable's description Topicbox-Message-UUID: 37633d54-ead5-11e9-9d60-3106f5b1d025 --001485f7c41e821886047046d00a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit They also have REBOL as a scripting language... It's an interesting project, forked from an interesting project (Atheos), but Gospodin Floren is correct: they have exactly the same problems with Syllable as 9fans have with Plan9, namely drivers & user expectations. Haiku, ReactOS, Hurd, &c &c have these problems as well. On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 12:09 PM, John Floren wrote: > Why do we have to care about every self-righteous pronouncement from > every minor project out there? Why should we have to put everything > into a "Plan 9 context"? > > If you want to relate Plan 9 to Syllable, look at their forums--it > seems to have the same sort of problems as Plan 9. Lacking in drivers > (a quick look showed that they don't have PCMCIA, WLAN, or PPP > support), new users coming in expecting it to be like other operating > systems (I'm looking at you, Balwinder) or trolls calling it dead, and > in general an apparent lack of people writing programs for it. > Syllable looks to be POSIX-compliant (I think) which is probably how > they have Quake most of the other ported programs. > > John > > On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 2:13 AM, Balwinder S > Dheeman wrote: > > Computer scientists will tell you that their operating systems and tools > > are fine, because they like them to be complex. Companies will tell you > > that their machines or devices are fine, because they like to control > > them by hiding requisite device specifications and, or applications > > notes, even though you own them. Yet, some people remember a few > > machines from decades ago that were different. They got run over in the > > gold rush, but they proved that it is possible to build much more > > helpful machines. And if it was possible then, it is certainly possible > > now, because the hardware that computers are built from has become much > > more powerful. It's the software that is often not working in the > > interest of the owner. In the /Syllable/ project, we are using this > > power to help the owner instead of the scientists and the big companies. > > > > Please comment the above in a Plan 9 context. > > -- > > Balwinder S "bdheeman" Dheeman Registered Linux User: #229709 > > Anu'z Linux@HOME (Unix Shoppe) Machines: #168573, 170593, 259192 > > Chandigarh, UT, 160062, India Plan9, T2, Arch/Debian/FreeBSD/XP > > Home: http://werc.homelinux.net/ Visit: http://counter.li.org/ > > > > > > > > -- > "Object-oriented design is the roman numerals of computing" -- Rob Pike > > -- And in the "Only Prolog programmers will find this funny" department: Q: How many Prolog programmers does it take to change a lightbulb? A: No. -- Ovid "By cosmic rule, as day yields night, so winter summer, war peace, plenty famine. All things change. Air penetrates the lump of myrrh, until the joining bodies die and rise again in smoke called incense." "Men do not know how that which is drawn in different directions harmonises with itself. The harmonious structure of the world depends upon opposite tension like that of the bow and the lyre." "This universe, which is the same for all, has not been made by any god or man, but it always has been, is, and will be an ever-living fire, kindling itself by regular measures and going out by regular measures" -- Heraclitus --001485f7c41e821886047046d00a Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable They also have REBOL as a scripting language...

It's an interest= ing project, forked from an interesting project (Atheos), but Gospodin Flor= en is correct: they have exactly the same problems with Syllable as 9fans h= ave with Plan9, namely drivers & user expectations.

Haiku, ReactOS, Hurd, &c &c have these problems as well.
On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 12:09 PM, John Floren <= span dir=3D"ltr"><slawmaster@gma= il.com> wrote:
Why do we have to= care about every self-righteous pronouncement from
every minor project out there? Why should we have to put everything
into a "Plan 9 context"?

If you want to relate Plan 9 to Syllable, look at their forums--it
seems to have the same sort of problems as Plan 9. Lacking in drivers
(a quick look showed that they don't have PCMCIA, WLAN, or PPP
support), new users coming in expecting it to be like other operating
systems (I'm looking at you, Balwinder) or trolls calling it dead, and<= br> in general an apparent lack of people writing programs for it.
Syllable looks to be POSIX-compliant (I think) which is probably how
they have Quake most of the other ported programs.

John

On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 2:13 AM, Balwinder S
Dheeman<bsd.SANSPAM@cto= .homelinux.net> wrote:
> Computer scientists will tell = you that their operating systems and tools
> are fine, because they like them to be complex. Companies will tell yo= u
> that their machines or devices are fine, because they like to control<= br> > them by hiding requisite device specifications and, or applications > notes, even though you own them. Yet, some people remember a few
> machines from decades ago that were different. They got run over in th= e
> gold rush, but they proved that it is possible to build much more
> helpful machines. And if it was possible then, it is certainly possibl= e
> now, because the hardware that computers are built from has become muc= h
> more powerful. It's the software that is often not working in the<= br> > interest of the owner. In the /Syllable/ project, we are using this > power to help the owner instead of the scientists and the big companie= s.
>
> Please comment the above in a Plan 9 context.
> --
> Balwinder S "bdheeman" Dheeman =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Registered Lin= ux User: #229709
> Anu'z Linux@HOME (Unix Shoppe) =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Machines: #168573, 1= 70593, 259192
> Chandigarh, UT, 160062, India =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Plan9, T2, Arch/Debian/F= reeBSD/XP
> Home: http://= werc.homelinux.net/ =A0 =A0 =A0Visit: http://counter.li.org/
>
>



--
"Object-oriented design is the roman numerals of computing" -- Ro= b Pike




--
And in the "= ;Only Prolog programmers will find this funny" department:

Q: H= ow many Prolog programmers does it take to change a lightbulb?

A: No= .
=A0-- Ovid

=A0 =A0"By cosmic rule, as day yields night, so wi= nter summer, war peace, plenty famine. All things change. Air penetrates th= e lump of myrrh, until the joining bodies die and rise again in smoke calle= d incense."

=A0 =A0"Men do not know how that which is drawn in different dire= ctions harmonises with itself. The harmonious structure of the world depend= s upon opposite tension like that of the bow and the lyre."

= =A0 =A0"This universe, which is the same for all, has not been made by= any god or man, but it always has been, is, and will be an ever-living fir= e, kindling itself by regular measures and going out by regular measures&qu= ot;
-- Heraclitus
--001485f7c41e821886047046d00a--