Re: [9fans] weird cursor motion

Re: [9fans] weird cursor motion

[rob pike]

Giving your right hand for a second mouse strikes me as a
philosophical conundrum. Or perhaps an opportunity for
creative input devices.

-rob

Input devices (Was: [9fans] weird cursor motion)

[Lucio De Re]

On Thu, Apr 26, 2001 at 05:51:50AM -0400, rob pike wrote:
>
> Giving your right hand for a second mouse strikes me as a
> philosophical conundrum. Or perhaps an opportunity for
> creative input devices.
>
Am I really that cryptic?  I thought I agreed to the above in my
original message :-)

To be sure, I think Palm have the right idea (I don't care that
3Com are in Boyd's bad books presently).  In fact, it's a pity Bell
Labs did not explore the graffiti input further with their bitsy
development, because to my mind there's room for shorthand (Pitman
style) as a form of text entry (but not within the scope of my
personal programming capabilities).

Of course, Apple was there before U.S.Robotics, and they failed to
capture the imagination of the marketplace with the Newton (more's
the pity, in  my opinion) presumably because learning oneself and
at the same time teaching shorthand to one's handheld would be time
consuming and hardly glamorous.  I'll refrain from stating here
what I think of managers turning into desktop publishers and other
unpublishable points of view on modern enterprise leaders, I do
not have the skills of Scott Adams (I hope I remember the right
name).

Yet it strikes me as self-evident that writing has become the
primary task of personal computing, and shorthand would not only
speed text entry considerably, but also eliminate to some extent
the need to remember the exact spelling of words.

I think the biggest obstacle is the need for a two-prong approach:
computing devices have to be taught skeletal shorthand and users
have to learn _and_ teach their particular fashion of shorthand to
their device.  In addition, one needs to somehow track the owner's
"vocabulary" so that it can be ported to new, different devices
(or should one have just a personal translator as the input device?
No, the market place wouldn't really permit this).

Just some lateral thinking that's been bugging me a while.

++L

Re: Input devices (Was: [9fans] weird cursor motion)

[matt]

Hello Lucio,


LDR> To be sure, I think Palm have the right idea (I don't care that
LDR> 3Com are in Boyd's bad books presently).  In fact, it's a pity Bell
LDR> Labs did not explore the graffiti input further with their bitsy
LDR> development, because to my mind there's room for shorthand (Pitman
LDR> style) as a form of text entry (but not within the scope of my
LDR> personal programming capabilities).

 From my personal use of a Palm I can write in graffiti (to the extent
that I wrote it on paper for while). But I found it was much quicker
to tap on the little virtual keyboard.

The shorthand idea is in MS word via intellisense except it uses
letter combos and not written shapes.

Just for fun I dictated this e-mail and had voice recognition
translate into text for me. No spelling mistakes and much easier my
wrist than typing.

have also being enjoying using the microphone to scroll up and down

--
Best regards,
 matt                            mailto:matt@proweb.co.uk

Re: Input devices (Was: [9fans] weird cursor motion)

[Boyd Roberts]

> To be sure, I think Palm have the right idea (I don't care that
> 3Com are in Boyd's bad books presently.

they have the wrong idea.  the solution is a network device with
an encrypted CDMA radio interface, data encrypted on a server
somewhere and a chunk of memory in the device.  it boots across
the radio link, caches data and programs and has a GSM style SIM.

so, the device is cheap and if you lose it you don't lose the data
'cos it's on a server.  call up your provider and get the SIM
killed and another one sent out and buy a new device.

the crypto secures the radio link and prevents the server/service
providor from seeing what you're data you're saving.

booting over the radio link would also allow the updates
and purchase of new applications.

now, this will involve ground based CDMA or sat based CDMA,
RF spectrum allocation, hardware, software and a company
like lucent to set it up.  no, you can't do it in your
garage.

sounds a bit like inferno, doesn't it?  it's totally doable.

i see the DoD have 'bought' iridium.

de vk2bhr

Re: Input devices (Was: [9fans] weird cursor motion)

[Douglas A. Gwyn]

Boyd Roberts wrote:
> i see the DoD have 'bought' iridium.

Yup, apparently the current administration is more
concerned about our reliance on third parties for commo.

Re: Input devices (Was: [9fans] weird cursor motion)

[Boyd Roberts]

> ... Boyd's world pretty realizable.

    The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable man
    persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all
    progress depends on the unreasonable man.

        -- George Bernard Shaw

Re: Input devices (Was: [9fans] weird cursor motion)

[Boyd Roberts]

> I hear tales of the MTA putting microcells on NYC subway trains
> and using spare track capacity to forward mobile data to above
> ground repeaters.

some of the bigger RER stations in paris have GSM microcells,
but no the metro.  the TDMA's RFI, picked up by my MD player,
give away the location updates as you pass through or get off
at the stations.

eg: chatelet / les halles

the TGV rail lines are used to run fibre around the country.

Re: Input devices (Was: [9fans] weird cursor motion)

[Dan Cross]

In article <20010426142403.19ED319A08@mail.cse.psu.edu> you write:
>The DoD bought iridium as a secret plot to assassinate world
>leaders they don't like by accidentally dropping communications
>satelites on them.

He he he.

> [...] Another plan (I think already in some other part of
>the world) is to put 802.11 in trains, though I'ld hate
>to think what that would do to unlicensed bands near the tracks.

I hear tales of the MTA putting microcells on NYC subway trains
and using spare track capacity to forward mobile data to above
ground repeaters.  This can only mean one thing, of course: More
New Yorkers yaking on their cell phones in public.

	- Dan C.

Re: Input devices (Was: [9fans] weird cursor motion)

[presotto]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2026 bytes --]

The DoD bought iridium as a secret plot to assassinate world
leaders they don't like by accidentally dropping communications
satelites on them.

I just sat in on a meeting describing our wireless strategies
yesterday.  Looks like we might get bandwidth in the US (and
China) a little faster than the rest of the world, thanks to
the European/Japanese CDMA standards effort.  Nevertheless, there
should be a few megabits of bandwidth per cell everywhere in the not
too distant future and that's just the first step.  That has to be
split between all the users but if use is bursty that should
make Boyd's world pretty realizable.
Another current US fad seems to be to stick 802.11b in crowded places
to attract people to them and make them even more crowded.  If
the telco's and ISP's can come up with reasonable billing strategies
(or the telco's take over the ISP's, another trend here) then
you can switch to spotty high bandwidth whenever you stop moving,
especially if you can hand off your connection (using mobileIP
for example). Another plan (I think already in some other part of
the world) is to put 802.11 in trains, though I'ld hate
to think what that would do to unlicensed bands near the tracks.

The Palm VII was an attempt to go that way that didn't do very
well, mostly because they didn't fo far enough.  They tried to
control the channel and the result was a product less interesting
than a Palm V with an omnisky modem attached.  Also the bandwidth
just plain sucks.

On another, or perhaps the same, front, anyone have a nice cursive
writing recognition tool that they'ld like to donate to the world?
The handwriting recognition under Wince on the bitsy is so much
nicer than the Grafitti and sim keyboard that we're using in Plan 9
and Linux.  I'm infinitely jealous.  I wouldn't need shorthand if I
had that.  I've been trying to use the bitsy to do as much as
possible these last few days, but this morning my hand cramped up
and I went back to a laptop for a while.

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From: "Boyd Roberts" <boyd@planete.net>
To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Input devices (Was: [9fans] weird cursor motion)
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 15:41:14 +0200
Message-ID: <009b01c0ce56$90286690$e8b7c6d4@SOMA>

> To be sure, I think Palm have the right idea (I don't care that
> 3Com are in Boyd's bad books presently.

they have the wrong idea.  the solution is a network device with
an encrypted CDMA radio interface, data encrypted on a server
somewhere and a chunk of memory in the device.  it boots across
the radio link, caches data and programs and has a GSM style SIM.

so, the device is cheap and if you lose it you don't lose the data
'cos it's on a server.  call up your provider and get the SIM
killed and another one sent out and buy a new device.

the crypto secures the radio link and prevents the server/service
providor from seeing what you're data you're saving.

booting over the radio link would also allow the updates
and purchase of new applications.

now, this will involve ground based CDMA or sat based CDMA,
RF spectrum allocation, hardware, software and a company
like lucent to set it up.  no, you can't do it in your
garage.

sounds a bit like inferno, doesn't it?  it's totally doable.

i see the DoD have 'bought' iridium.

de vk2bhr