From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Message-ID: <3EB9A2D5.6090909@ameritech.net> From: northern snowfall User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020518 Netscape6/6.2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] design clairvoyance & the 9 way References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 19:20:37 -0500 Topicbox-Message-UUID: a3212a2e-eacb-11e9-9e20-41e7f4b1d025 > > >``Your conventional `good citizen' can be depended >on not to be too thoughtful. His ideas, beliefs, >and practices are those of other people. He loves >and hates with them. He is unreflectively loyal to >the institutions under which he lives, and to the >men who administer them. But the really educated >good man has no right to go along without question.'' > - Henry Raymond Mussey > Somehow, I find it hard to believe that simply because I've come to the same conclusion that other people have, I'm a blindly loyal follower. The fact is I have questioned. That is *why* I got interested in OS research. That is *why* I forced myself to read the entire BSD kernel and plan9 kernel before I even fully understood the C language. That is *why* I chose to take on my own OS development initiatives to push myself further than what I've learned from the above, and other, experiences. If two brilliant men both surmise that E=MC2, is only the first one that brings the subject to public light seen as genius? Or, are they both respected for the hard work they've done. If you noticed, I said that there was merit in a lot of the work done by the patchwork-quilt appendages to the UNIX world, and others. If it wasn't for Windows, I wouldn't even *be* involved in computers, today. Just because these things have design problems relating to their eventual growth and extension doesn't mean they're any less usable or worthy of praise. However, it *does* mean that developers have to be wary in implementing new techniques. VPN in a Windows environment is a superb example of this. Look how many problems the design of their driver architecture had when attempting to implement a secure wide-area-network infrastructure. Rather than pursuing a solution that would afford e-business some security, they patched in a simple driver that afforded horrible overlay of crypto to a sickly protocol that was easily manipulated by security analysts with a wide range of skill: www.atstake.com, www.team-teso.net, etc. The problems do not seem to end here. It isn't necessarily that things *can't* be fixed, as much as it is that to implement true dynamic flexibility in an Operating System, certain things need to be adhered to. Namespaces, presenting everything as files for simple resource exportation, runes, plumbing, embedded authentication semantics, to name a few, are all great examples of ways to extend the capability of an OS for *years* of research, when implementing new ideas, testing theory, or whatever you're doing. UNIX simply failed to have these things and because of the way the OS has been structured from years of hacking and rehacking, it would just be another *hack* to attempt implementation of these ideas. We've seen attempts at these hacks in projects like SELinux at the NSA and it is very telling that their work seems to prove that, though name spaces in a *NIX environment is a great ambition, the underlying VFS/Net framework presents a serious problem to the abstraction of isolated resource management, severely crippling the implementation. So, what you end up with is almost a redesigned Linux. Isn't it more sensible to move to another OS with these ideas built from the ground up, rather than spending a large amount of time attempting to redesign the core of an OS whose design is proven to be non-adherent to your goal? Sheesh. >