[9fans] Web Gardens

[9fans] Web Gardens

[Andrew Simmons]

As a diversion from the discussion of the existential essence of Javascript, could I ask the group for a view on the meaning of the term "Web Garden"? I was just asked about this in a job interview. Supplementary question - how would you implement a Web Garden in Plan9?

> On 9/10/2015, at 2:48 PM, Hugo Rivera <uair00@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> ahh, thanks.
> 
> 2015-10-08 20:32 GMT-04:00 Ryan Gonzalez <rymg19@gmail.com>:
>> The newest OSX version: http://www.apple.com/osx/whats-new/.
>> 
>>> On October 8, 2015 6:57:15 PM CDT, Hugo Rivera <uair00@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Who is el capitán?
>>> 
>>> 2015-10-08 19:06 GMT-04:00 marius eriksen <marius@monkey.org>:
>>>> 
>>>> works great. and the split view feature is fantastic with full screen
>>>> acme.
>> 
>> --
>> Sent from my Nexus 5 with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Hugo
> 

Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Skip Tavakkolian]

if it's the term used by IIS, i think it refers to how a server
handles web requests: (a) one process handling all requests -- i.e.
in a select() loop -- or (b) a process pool, with each process
handling one request.  the latter is a "web garden" model.

plan9's httpd starts a proc for each new request.

> As a diversion from the discussion of the existential essence of
> Javascript, could I ask the group for a view on the meaning of the
> term "Web Garden"?  I was just asked about this in a job interview.
> Supplementary question - how would you implement a Web Garden in
> Plan9?

Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[hiro]

sounds organic, try to avoid that job.

Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Staven]

I thought a web garden was a hobbyist version of a server farm.

Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Charles Forsyth]

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No, that's a web allotment

On 12 October 2015 at 10:49, Staven <staven@staven.pl> wrote:

> I thought a web garden was a hobbyist version of a server farm.
>
>
>

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Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Steve Simon]

I think I once saw one at the Chelsea flower show,
Designed and produced by a team of 37 spiders...

-Steve

> On 12 Oct 2015, at 10:49, Staven <staven@staven.pl> wrote:
>
> I thought a web garden was a hobbyist version of a server farm.
>

Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Anthony Sorace]

I had never heard this term before, but this is perfect. Well done.

> I thought a web garden was a hobbyist version of a server farm.

Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Kurt H Maier]

On Mon, Oct 12, 2015 at 05:57:16PM +1300, Andrew Simmons wrote:
> As a diversion from the discussion of the existential essence of Javascript,
> could I ask the group for a view on the meaning of the term "Web Garden"?
> I was just asked about this in a job interview.

This is a concept that has developed in the Windows world because a lot
of the .net web server tech tends to share state per-process.  In order
to have multiple backend processes running on a single server you
generally have to play games with information sharing between processes.
It's just another reason web services on Windows can be such a pain in
the ass.

> Supplementary question - how would you implement a Web Garden in Plan9?

We've found it easier to hire more web sharecroppers when yields aren't
sufficient.

khm

Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Andrew Simmons]

Thanks to all for the excellent and occasionally informative suggestions. I don’t think there’s any risk of my being offered the job, but I wish I’d had the concepts of “web allotment” and “web sharecropper” to hand during the interview.

> On Oct 13, 2015, at 5:13 AM, Kurt H Maier <khm@sciops.net> wrote:
> 
> On Mon, Oct 12, 2015 at 05:57:16PM +1300, Andrew Simmons wrote:
>> As a diversion from the discussion of the existential essence of Javascript, 
>> could I ask the group for a view on the meaning of the term "Web Garden"? 
>> I was just asked about this in a job interview. 
> 
> This is a concept that has developed in the Windows world because a lot
> of the .net web server tech tends to share state per-process.  In order
> to have multiple backend processes running on a single server you
> generally have to play games with information sharing between processes.
> It's just another reason web services on Windows can be such a pain in
> the ass.
> 
>> Supplementary question - how would you implement a Web Garden in Plan9?
> 
> We've found it easier to hire more web sharecroppers when yields aren't
> sufficient.
> 
> khm
> 

Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[erik quanstrom]

On Mon Oct 12 09:16:37 PDT 2015, khm@sciops.net wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 12, 2015 at 05:57:16PM +1300, Andrew Simmons wrote:
> > As a diversion from the discussion of the existential essence of Javascript,
> > could I ask the group for a view on the meaning of the term "Web Garden"?
> > I was just asked about this in a job interview.
>
> This is a concept that has developed in the Windows world because a lot
> of the .net web server tech tends to share state per-process.  In order
> to have multiple backend processes running on a single server you
> generally have to play games with information sharing between processes.
> It's just another reason web services on Windows can be such a pain in
> the ass.
>

i'd recommend a google search

https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=web%20garden

- erik

Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Kurt H Maier]

On Thu, Oct 15, 2015 at 07:10:01PM -0700, erik quanstrom wrote:
>
> i'd recommend a google search
>
> https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=web%20garden
>

I deeply apologize for failing to summarize to your satisfaction.  I
have bookmarked the url you provided and welcome any feedback I Can use
to improve my understanding in this matter.

khm

Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Prof Brucee]

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Sounds like a lot of bullshit to me. No fish slapping.
On 16/10/2015 2:50 PM, "Kurt H Maier" <khm@sciops.net> wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 15, 2015 at 07:10:01PM -0700, erik quanstrom wrote:
> >
> > i'd recommend a google search
> >
> >
> https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=web%20garden
> >
>
> I deeply apologize for failing to summarize to your satisfaction.  I
> have bookmarked the url you provided and welcome any feedback I Can use
> to improve my understanding in this matter.
>
> khm
>
>

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Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Jeff Sickel]

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Next thing we know someone will produce a Grey Gardens fork of Plan 9.

Now that I said it, it’s likely the GPL version is the Plan 9 Grey Gardens tree.

-jas



> On Oct 15, 2015, at 10:53 PM, Prof Brucee <prof.brucee@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Sounds like a lot of bullshit to me. No fish slapping.
> 
> On 16/10/2015 2:50 PM, "Kurt H Maier" <khm@sciops.net <mailto:khm@sciops.net>> wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 15, 2015 at 07:10:01PM -0700, erik quanstrom wrote:
> >
> > i'd recommend a google search
> >
> > https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=web%20garden <https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=web%20garden>
> >
> 
> I deeply apologize for failing to summarize to your satisfaction.  I
> have bookmarked the url you provided and welcome any feedback I Can use
> to improve my understanding in this matter.
> 
> khm
> 


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Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Winston Kodogo]

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To be honest, I didn’t understand the “Grey Gardens” reference until I used
this new “Google” thing that Erik recommends. Were I not scared of being
called silly by Skip, I would recommend merging this exciting new potential
fork of Plan9 into the forthcoming "Great British Code Off" fork of Plan9,
of which I am the sole proprietor. But I won’t do that. Instead, I will
just say "On your marks, get set, Code!".



On Oct 17, 2015, at 2:51 PM, Jeff Sickel <jas@corpus-callosum.com> wrote:

Next thing we know someone will produce a Grey Gardens fork of Plan 9.

Now that I said it, it’s likely the GPL version is the Plan 9 Grey Gardens
tree.

-jas



On Oct 15, 2015, at 10:53 PM, Prof Brucee <prof.brucee@gmail.com> wrote:

Sounds like a lot of bullshit to me. No fish slapping.

On 16/10/2015 2:50 PM, "Kurt H Maier" <khm@sciops.net> wrote:
On Thu, Oct 15, 2015 at 07:10:01PM -0700, erik quanstrom wrote:
>
> i'd recommend a google search
>
>
https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=web%20garden
>

I deeply apologize for failing to summarize to your satisfaction.  I
have bookmarked the url you provided and welcome any feedback I Can use
to improve my understanding in this matter.

khm

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Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[erik quanstrom]

On Thu Oct 15 20:50:52 PDT 2015, khm@sciops.net wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 15, 2015 at 07:10:01PM -0700, erik quanstrom wrote:
> >
> > i'd recommend a google search
> >
> > https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=web%20garden
> >
>
> I deeply apologize for failing to summarize to your satisfaction.  I
> have bookmarked the url you provided and welcome any feedback I Can use
> to improve my understanding in this matter.

relax.

i posted that link because "web gardens" are off topic, and well addressed
outside this mailing list.

- erik

Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[hiro]

back to upgrading the themes for El Käptn drawterm.

On 10/18/15, erik quanstrom <quanstro@quanstro.net> wrote:
> On Thu Oct 15 20:50:52 PDT 2015, khm@sciops.net wrote:
>> On Thu, Oct 15, 2015 at 07:10:01PM -0700, erik quanstrom wrote:
>> >
>> > i'd recommend a google search
>> >
>> > https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=web%20garden
>> >
>>
>> I deeply apologize for failing to summarize to your satisfaction.  I
>> have bookmarked the url you provided and welcome any feedback I Can use
>> to improve my understanding in this matter.
>
> relax.
>
> i posted that link because "web gardens" are off topic, and well addressed
> outside this mailing list.
>
> - erik
>
>

Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Aleksandar Kuktin]

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>On Mon, 12 Oct 2015 17:57:16 +1300
>Andrew Simmons <kodogo@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> As a diversion from the discussion of the existential essence of
> Javascript, could I ask the group for a view on the meaning of the
> term "Web Garden"? I was just asked about this in a job interview.
> Supplementary question - how would you implement a Web Garden in
> Plan9?

How do you call isolated ecosystems put up by the big players
(Facebook, Tweeter and such) that hold all the data within and disallow
linking to that data from the outside? I seem to remember "Web Garden"
was used, but it could also be a "Walled Garden"..

- -- 
Svi moji e-mailovi su kriptografski potpisani. Proverite ih.
All of my e-mails are cryptographically signed. Verify them.
- --
You don't need an AI for a robot uprising.
Humans will do just fine.
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Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Charles Forsyth]

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On 12 October 2015 at 23:43, Aleksandar Kuktin <akuktin@gmail.com> wrote:

> but it could also be a "Walled Garden"..


with shrubbery to hide data from outsiders and, for defence in depth,
another shrubbery slightly higher for a two-level
effect, with a little path for authorised users

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Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Lyndon Nerenberg]

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On Oct 13, 2015, at 1:15 AM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:

> with shrubbery to hide data from outsiders and, for defence in depth, another shrubbery slightly higher for a two-level
> effect, with a little path for authorised users

The reference implementation:

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifmRgQX82O4

--lyndon


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Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Charles Forsyth]

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On 14 October 2015 at 04:29, Lyndon Nerenberg <lyndon@orthanc.ca> wrote:

> The reference implementation:
>
>   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifmRgQX82O4
>

No, it's https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zIV4poUZAQo

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Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Charles Forsyth]

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On 14 October 2015 at 09:32, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com>
wrote:

> No, it's https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zIV4poUZAQo
>

As usual, the official reference was short on the implementation detail.
Try https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTQfGd3G6dg

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Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Andrew Simmons]

This reminds me, should you find yourself in Auckland, be sure to visit Roger the Shrubber in Mangere for all of your Web shrubbery requirements:

http://www.localist.co.nz/l/tazcwz


> On Oct 14, 2015, at 9:35 PM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> On 14 October 2015 at 09:32, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:
> No, it's https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zIV4poUZAQo
> 
> As usual, the official reference was short on the implementation detail. Try https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTQfGd3G6dg

Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Skip Tavakkolian]

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http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Yw6bz1YMdV8/VH8UTXIGcjI/AAAAAAAADBk/FXdkiyPq_kU/s1600/monty%2Bpython%2Bgeneral%2Btoo%2Bsilly.jpg


On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 8:25 AM, Andrew Simmons <kodogo@gmail.com> wrote:

> This reminds me, should you find yourself in Auckland, be sure to visit
> Roger the Shrubber in Mangere for all of your Web shrubbery requirements:
>
> http://www.localist.co.nz/l/tazcwz
>
>
> > On Oct 14, 2015, at 9:35 PM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > On 14 October 2015 at 09:32, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > No, it's https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zIV4poUZAQo
> >
> > As usual, the official reference was short on the implementation detail.
> Try https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTQfGd3G6dg
>
>
>

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Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Lyndon Nerenberg]

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On Oct 14, 2015, at 1:35 AM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:

> As usual, the official reference was short on the implementation detail. Try https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTQfGd3G6dg

This, of course, is just the SEC review.

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Re: [9fans] Web Gardens

[Lyndon Nerenberg]

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On Oct 14, 2015, at 1:32 AM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:

> No, it's https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zIV4poUZAQo

No, that's just management.

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