From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: greemngreek@gmail.com To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Subject: Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Message-Id: <15744041560.8c521.64663@composer.9fans.topicbox.com> Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2019 01:29:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="15744041561.E5C69e8.64663" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 689ff932-0cf1-11ea-a23f-cff59034e1fa --15744041561.E5C69e8.64663 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2019 01:29:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The site hasn't been updated since 2014-2015. If it's dead, is there any ch= ance of it coming back into development?= --15744041561.E5C69e8.64663 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2019 01:29:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
The site hasn't been updated since 2014-201= 5. 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To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000006e2a730597e9c04c" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: a031c234-0cf3-11ea-b54e-d99dcc9ddf29 --0000000000006e2a730597e9c04c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" no. On Thu, Nov 21, 2019, 22:30 wrote: > The site hasn't been updated since 2014-2015. If it's dead, is there any > chance of it coming back into development? > *9fans * / 9fans / see discussions > + participants > + delivery options > Permalink > > --0000000000006e2a730597e9c04c Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
no.

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019, 22:30 <greemngreek@gmail.com> wrote:
The site hasn't been updated since 2014-2015. If it's dea= d, is there any chance of it coming back into development?
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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000f50f4d0597ea8d7e" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: a2c0e8ec-0cfb-11ea-8c34-874c68715a8c --000000000000f50f4d0597ea8d7e Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" 9legacy might interest you: http://www.9legacy.org/intro.html On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 1:29 AM wrote: > The site hasn't been updated since 2014-2015. If it's dead, is there any > chance of it coming back into development? > *9fans * / 9fans / see discussions > + participants > + delivery options > Permalink > > --000000000000f50f4d0597ea8d7e Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
9legacy might interest you:=C2=A0http://www.9legacy.org/intro.html


On= Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 1:29 AM <= greemngreek@gmail.com> wrote:
The site hasn't been updated since 2014-2015. If it's dea= d, is there any chance of it coming back into development?
--000000000000f50f4d0597ea8d7e-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: greemngreek@gmail.com To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Message-Id: <15744096080.0CE977aB4.36035@composer.9fans.topicbox.com> References: <15744041560.8c521.64663@composer.9fans.topicbox.com> In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2019 03:00:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="15744096081.7Fe5DfbC.36035" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 1a59ee9c-0cfe-11ea-b6c1-cff59034e1fa --15744096081.7Fe5DfbC.36035 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2019 03:00:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable @Fazul It's active? How does it compare to 9front?= --15744096081.7Fe5DfbC.36035 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2019 03:00:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
@Fazul It's active? How does it compare to = 9front?
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From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2019 08:24:34 +0000 In-Reply-To: <15744041560.8c521.64663@composer.9fans.topicbox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BlackCat-Spam-Score: 12 X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.2 Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 8ab35c2a-0d01-11ea-bb51-f0c6b3621b55 > The site hasn't been updated since 2014-2015. The mirror 9pi.io has more recent patches in /sources/patch. There is also a good selection of patches in 9legacy.org/patch.html Current raspberry pi kernel source is on 9p.io in /sources/contrib/miller/9/bcm So yes, there is current development but not centralised. 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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000000f66200597eb8df3" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 99a240b2-0d05-11ea-b6c2-b257e126cfac --0000000000000f66200597eb8df3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" It's not dead; it's resting. On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 10:29 PM wrote: > The site hasn't been updated since 2014-2015. If it's dead, is there any > chance of it coming back into development? > *9fans * / 9fans / see discussions > + participants > + delivery options > Permalink > > --0000000000000f66200597eb8df3 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
It's not dead; it's resting.
On Th= u, Nov 21, 2019 at 10:29 PM <gr= eemngreek@gmail.com> wrote:
The site hasn't been updated since 2014-2015. If it's dea= d, is there any chance of it coming back into development?
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([2603:300b:14:e000:e8e9:e6b1:eece:a62e]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id x9sm2873736ilp.43.2019.11.22.06.55.49 for <9fans@9fans.net> (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 22 Nov 2019 06:55:49 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-8A4C8BAC-52FE-4070-AC03-366606A77DD0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Don A. Bailey" Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2019 07:55:49 -0700 Message-Id: <9871BD82-3D5E-495A-9CAC-88E0D639A59A@gmail.com> References: In-Reply-To: To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (17B111) Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 2f9df69c-0d38-11ea-804d-d50076576a7e --Apple-Mail-8A4C8BAC-52FE-4070-AC03-366606A77DD0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This :) > On Nov 22, 2019, at 1:54 AM, Skip Tavakkolian = wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BF > It's not dead; it's resting. >=20 >> On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 10:29 PM wrote: >> The site hasn't been updated since 2014-2015. If it's dead, is there any c= hance of it coming back into development? >=20 > 9fans / 9fans / see discussions + participants + delivery options Permalin= k --Apple-Mail-8A4C8BAC-52FE-4070-AC03-366606A77DD0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This :)

On Nov 22, 2019, at 1:54 AM, Skip Tavakkol= ian <skip.tavakkolian@gmail.com> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF
It's not dead; it's resting.

On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 10:29 PM <greemngreek@gmail.com> wrote:
The si= te hasn't been updated since 2014-2015. If it's dead, is there any chance of= it coming back into development?
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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 7d58ae66-0d3a-11ea-815f-827a01742ede Den fre 22 nov. 2019 kl 09:55 skrev Skip Tavakkolian : > > It's not dead; it's resting. > The whole "thing" about Plan9 was bringing back the dead so it is thematically on point. > On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 10:29 PM wrote: >> >> The site hasn't been updated since 2014-2015. If it's dead, is there any chance of it coming back into development? > > 9fans / 9fans / see discussions + participants + delivery options Permalink From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F7DD9F7024 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Fri, 22 Nov 2019 10:31:02 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from sstallion@gmail.com) Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 8D93D2E0913; Fri, 22 Nov 2019 10:31:02 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574436662; b=uB7nTxXWe1z6WGbWIYCftCRkF/w1Gv/f7x8dnVhwk+2pld74M5 751+kI26P24S6QFohk7anWW588Y1ZfHIbVxV1i74OrL5RTylYdlydlIhiZKdu5GV T9wU+OZMmsPh4JAp/rWtXTmAhdnCoLETsQo0ENwSHoajWRysiahI5xbV+Rg+lc1w NnJeAMyZ97623S/Glbi4s6/BTtSwY3ocLvMcBwGsw/PNyP26ru9RiIbtlOh+RalB LPkU3N9GrilnEUPe6YXz4dLz1oi1TyLacqXkkEeVhB/sdegB2EvpIvQA2zDkkStF 8l9hPyn29T4mGjE+DZaK4VFJh2OLxFaXIzww== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; 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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 1ce3c5b8-0d3d-11ea-b19b-c538103da441 Probably pining for the fjords. On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 2:54 AM Skip Tavakkolian wrote: > > It's not dead; it's resting. > > On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 10:29 PM wrote: >> >> The site hasn't been updated since 2014-2015. If it's dead, is there any chance of it coming back into development? > > 9fans / 9fans / see discussions + participants + delivery options Permalink From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2DA19EBAC0 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Fri, 22 Nov 2019 18:15:22 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from sl@9front.org) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id AA0724A4E9D; Fri, 22 Nov 2019 18:15:22 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574464522; b=WUiSESzdqrrf4KrJ4R6luZmE/aE1dYnS73jmIbFVt1ClcWXjpv x6B1LfBYdhRiqdJfnwramzQ/0NfARTqTB9fZHFV4YVb0SpwbPI0uaTLfKCm4rjAH +vJLC2d8Ki8z7uQh5F2IImfaVfodSucS3mPE8AWRZ0mJbeXnfapuFQgUa8SWsNMH rCtseda/jnQf4TbU3RC37IrV4Da9Qu8vyUKzAehZXSiK3MDU8HPHcrk5iddBc8l0 QzzIh0kLa2Nmy1sy/LH0xyNrfzqx2wM1ehlnrd7SJk/c62Wh7fLBSY/DmY78kY9o Jx2zAHIrOKwBdCdQyozWdujfpXGul8a58e4A== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=arcseal; t=1574464522; bh=Cne5WAO9+4JjkP+qZXMIF5A6hlgmC30JRiSPaV3wLtE=; b= cXzJvUndQ3y/2iIk+hkxR1L4RGXD8C0/BaKE5fkTj/whwcRpZ4p4nPR11gl2X6PL yErKpMEpLLZOIUQe+lfs9vDszrDzQmI+NMLwjtZTsWnUmIRH2vBurhLMaDy60T39 IuLYzC/R0QCVxFE9Kuhx5i0Vv4HApV63b9sw8UMHYBWRTi1E5f6dQI9xkWaxy6EE p0S7GF24+AQcxeVY6DjKCOzIV4AmNg283yZbusywQw4KpW1jUizpT1yZ2QXhQnvK D4GbZbFv90wSKzgzSkX9A0dSIPKsMigp/H8LUOvYiCkA2re2YjbX3I1U2CkDTAtP tvq1aFiIqrrhthDFzISsOQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=9front.org; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=107.191.116.128 (ewsd.inri.net); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=sl@9front.org smtp.helo=ewsd.inri.net; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=ewsd.inri.net policy.ptr=ewsd.inri.net; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=9front.org policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=9front.org policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 Authentication-Results: tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=9front.org; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=107.191.116.128 (ewsd.inri.net); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=sl@9front.org smtp.helo=ewsd.inri.net; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=ewsd.inri.net policy.ptr=ewsd.inri.net; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=9front.org policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=9front.org policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudehhedgtdejucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdggtfgfnhhsuhgsshgtrhhisggvpdfu rfetoffkrfgpnffqhgenuceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpefkfffhvf fujgggtgfgsehtjeejtddttddvnecuhfhrohhmpehslheslehfrhhonhhtrdhorhhgnecu ffhomhgrihhnpeelfhhrohhnthdrohhrghenucfkphepuddtjedrudeluddrudduiedrud dvkeenucfrrghrrghmpehinhgvthepuddtjedrudeluddrudduiedruddvkedphhgvlhho pegvfihsugdrihhnrhhirdhnvghtpdhmrghilhhfrhhomhepoehslheslehfrhhonhhtrd horhhgqeenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedt X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (9front.org: 107.191.116.128 is authorized to use 'sl@9front.org' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'mx' matched)) receiver=tb-mx1.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="sl@9front.org"; helo=ewsd.inri.net; client-ip=107.191.116.128 Received: from ewsd.inri.net (ewsd.inri.net [107.191.116.128]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP for <9fans@9fans.net>; Fri, 22 Nov 2019 18:15:22 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from sl@9front.org) Message-ID: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2019 18:15:21 -0500 From: sl@9front.org To: 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? In-Reply-To: CAGGHmKHOVJVfj7O__HM6wGwbJuiu4hTxUYUhkTEqRm5pNgt+qQ@mail.gmail.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: f7fe7414-0d7d-11ea-ac0b-bdad8b638cf1 most of these answers don't really answer the question everyone knows op is asking. why do we always play these games? the answer is: no, vanilla plan 9 is not still alive. background: plan 9's creators all left bell labs many years ago, and none of them use plan 9 anymore[0]. bell labs itself has changed hands a couple of times since development of plan 9 came to its ignoble end. yes, some third parties occasionally tinker. richard miller puts out code that can be run on raspberry pi hardware. some other former heavy users occasionally push piecemeal bits of personal projects into the public eye. nobody takes any of it seriously because none of them really use plan 9 to do anything people use computers to do[1]. which is not to say their efforts aren't appreciated. thanks, guys. for some reason, when interested newbs show up on this mailing list asking this same question, which happens from time to time, they're always made to believe there exists a thriving community of devoted plan 9 from bell labs users eager to point them towards resources useful for running plan 9 on a computer manufactured after sbc rebranded itself as at&t. 9front was created in 2011 because by then it had already been apparent for several years that this was a baldfaced lie. failing a massive leak of all the code 9fans will swear to you they are running on their modern computers, your choices include: - 9front (new drivers, modern cryptography, useful new programs) - 9legacy (an attempt to combine patches from all extant personally maintained copies of the plan 9 source tree) don't thank me until you've tried to get straight answers to follow-up questions. sl [0] http://fqa.9front.org/fqa0.html#0.2.3 [1] i'm typing this on a thinkpad x250, over intel wifi/wpa2, running 1920x1080 on the native lcd. it's running plan 9, but is sure ain't vanilla[2]. [2] oh yeah, all the code is available here: http://code.9front.org/hg/plan9front From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: greemngreek@gmail.com To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Message-Id: <15744657640.bdD2EDEcd.765976@composer.9fans.topicbox.com> In-Reply-To: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> References: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2019 18:36:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="15744657641.999F.765976" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: d98ce166-0d80-11ea-bcd3-240c1f2d11b0 --15744657641.999F.765976 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2019 18:36:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks for the detailed response!= --15744657641.999F.765976 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2019 18:36:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks for the detailed response!
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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000009d1cca0597fb6a7d" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 4115b66e-0da4-11ea-85b3-8141eec3e734 --0000000000009d1cca0597fb6a7d Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Not dead; more like Schr=C3=B6dinger's OS. On Fri, Nov 22, 2019, 3:16 PM wrote: > most of these answers don't really answer the question everyone knows > op is asking. why do we always play these games? > > the answer is: no, vanilla plan 9 is not still alive. > > background: > > plan 9's creators all left bell labs many years ago, and none of them > use plan 9 anymore[0]. bell labs itself has changed hands a couple of > times since development of plan 9 came to its ignoble end. yes, some > third parties occasionally tinker. richard miller puts out code that > can be run on raspberry pi hardware. some other former heavy users > occasionally push piecemeal bits of personal projects into the public > eye. nobody takes any of it seriously because none of them really use > plan 9 to do anything people use computers to do[1]. which is not to > say their efforts aren't appreciated. thanks, guys. > > for some reason, when interested newbs show up on this mailing list > asking this same question, which happens from time to time, they're > always made to believe there exists a thriving community of devoted > plan 9 from bell labs users eager to point them towards resources > useful for running plan 9 on a computer manufactured after sbc > rebranded itself as at&t. > > 9front was created in 2011 because by then it had already been > apparent for several years that this was a baldfaced lie. > > failing a massive leak of all the code 9fans will swear to you they > are running on their modern computers, your choices include: > > - 9front (new drivers, modern cryptography, useful new programs) > - 9legacy (an attempt to combine patches from all extant personally > maintained copies of the plan 9 source tree) > > don't thank me until you've tried to get straight answers to follow-up > questions. > > sl > > [0] http://fqa.9front.org/fqa0.html#0.2.3 > > [1] i'm typing this on a thinkpad x250, over intel wifi/wpa2, running > 1920x1080 on the native lcd. it's running plan 9, but is sure ain't > vanilla[2]. > > [2] oh yeah, all the code is available here: > http://code.9front.org/hg/plan9front > > ------------------------------------------ > 9fans: 9fans > Permalink: > https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tf27e6479d8812712-M638dbd98d3e82c= 0062f4a8c0 > Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription > --0000000000009d1cca0597fb6a7d Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Not dead; more like=C2=A0Schr=C3=B6dinger's= =C2=A0OS.

On Fri, Nov 22, 2019, 3:16 PM <sl@9front.org> wrote= :
most of these answers don't r= eally answer the question everyone knows
op is asking.=C2=A0 why do we always play these games?

the answer is: no, vanilla plan 9 is not still alive.

background:

plan 9's creators all left bell labs many years ago, and none of them use plan 9 anymore[0].=C2=A0 bell labs itself has changed hands a couple of=
times since development of plan 9 came to its ignoble end.=C2=A0 yes, some<= br> third parties occasionally tinker.=C2=A0 richard miller puts out code that<= br> can be run on raspberry pi hardware.=C2=A0 some other former heavy users occasionally push piecemeal bits of personal projects into the public
eye.=C2=A0 nobody takes any of it seriously because none of them really use=
plan 9 to do anything people use computers to do[1].=C2=A0 which is not to<= br> say their efforts aren't appreciated.=C2=A0 thanks, guys.

for some reason, when interested newbs show up on this mailing list
asking this same question, which happens from time to time, they're
always made to believe there exists a thriving community of devoted
plan 9 from bell labs users eager to point them towards resources
useful for running plan 9 on a computer manufactured after sbc
rebranded itself as at&t.

9front was created in 2011 because by then it had already been
apparent for several years that this was a baldfaced lie.

failing a massive leak of all the code 9fans will swear to you they
are running on their modern computers, your choices include:

- 9front (new drivers, modern cryptography, useful new programs)
- 9legacy (an attempt to combine patches from all extant personally
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 maintained copies of the plan 9 source tree)
don't thank me until you've tried to get straight answers to follow= -up
questions.

sl

[0] http://fqa.9front.org/fqa0= .html#0.2.3

[1] i'm typing this on a thinkpad x250, over intel wifi/wpa2, running 1920x1080 on the native lcd.=C2=A0 it's running plan 9, but is sure ain= 't
vanilla[2].

[2] oh yeah, all the code is available here:
http://code.9front.org/hg/plan9= front

------------------------------------------
9fans: 9fans
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Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
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From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2019 09:29:14 +0000 In-Reply-To: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BlackCat-Spam-Score: 12 X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.2 Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: bdf24fba-0dd3-11ea-833b-c3dc417b0bf5 > nobody takes any of it seriously because none of them really use > plan 9 to do anything people use computers to do Ummm, what? Four instances of universal quantification ("nobody", "any of it", "none of them", "anything") in a sentence which is not even logically self-consistent. Never mind, I think I can just about see the gist of what you're trying to get across. It's meant to be insulting, right? Grow up. 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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 07199968-0dfd-11ea-be11-a1e5b01fe1fe On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 3:30 AM Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> wrote: > Grow up. Indeed. It's interesting that folks from 9front like to tout their development as "open" using tools that others in the community have developed in addition to their own. To wit, you seem to have gotten along quite nicely using the porting work I did for Mercurial in 2012. The Plan 9 community is certainly fragmented, but there are still a number of people that are willing to share their knowledge and work with others and it benefits no one to cast aspersions. (FWIW, I found this response especially entertaining after visiting code.9front.org; "Just Send the Money" indeed.) 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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 5061b690-0dfe-11ea-9d55-a0a47291c6f6 Steve and Richard, You are a bunch of hypocrites. Bitter old men. --=20 Aram H=C4=83v=C4=83rneanu From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0ED4A1D6B5 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 09:57:12 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from lucio.dere@gmail.com) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 42F1E50F986; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 09:57:12 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574521032; b=SNDl0CRVMbesvyjmFIefK8ydYA1cDopsk6QFn7SrOJePI0j4wa gg8UArfiyraUZeb7tkPuQ6JncgFs2DEcQXoGyEw2V6lTXLwv8sTnjQxyD3K/yDYi kcMv44OKTXqUnByKfmt5WXFzd9bir8NeponcrCXT69CmFy1iY7H+/AexRwlwa8z6 Ijm0ndV7khZM4vn34xKostgC0RcM/YXDmo+IIsWJodn6DVZxStrpGBjpeNp0bY9t w5yd5HTzra+08i2A9qJawSRAnFp49BBPrKOwLZe62dLP33vHs8U8G4mIXe8C9N+g S8f35lQUIMsJji7nr5MsOFL5ZMcKC9QA/g9w== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; 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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 8a67a77a-0e01-11ea-8fa4-9064b0465587 On 11/23/19, Aram H=C4=83v=C4=83rneanu wrote: > Steve and Richard, > > You are a bunch of hypocrites. Bitter old men. > Not hypocrites, not bitter. Old, maybe. Nor am I. One day, Aram, you'll be at the receiving end of criticism or even ridicule. There is no doubt that you are brilliant, and so are many 9front supporter. 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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000070f85d059806ae88" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: e73861d4-0e14-11ea-bfbc-ad40e6508a99 --00000000000070f85d059806ae88 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I think (hope) this is sarcasm. On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 6:35 AM Aram H=C4=83v=C4=83rneanu w= rote: > Steve and Richard, > > You are a bunch of hypocrites. Bitter old men. > > -- > Aram H=C4=83v=C4=83rneanu > > ------------------------------------------ > 9fans: 9fans > Permalink: > https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tf27e6479d8812712-M08bfe720c68d2b= 835d25e368 > Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription > --00000000000070f85d059806ae88 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I think (hope) this is sarcasm.

On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 6:3= 5 AM Aram H=C4=83v=C4=83rneanu <aram.h@= mgk.ro> wrote:
Steve and Richard,

You are a bunch of hypocrites. Bitter old men.

--
Aram H=C4=83v=C4=83rneanu

------------------------------------------
9fans: 9fans
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a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=Gc3CAQNYdP4qCxadZZkJ/i2AMDgFS/uAdKeU6znpIhs=; b=Hx6bveprmUH0a09Q/YORKc+TlkmpzWIgzrRKXhKO8TjDD+d1B+mDeUUubgLTGOMfnX HJjErk2Jr3nwT7yGjTZ4LYMbaf7ZHnjlqU0OLEZ0k8TXFZPlTGQWQhuX3V88F2HI3lFF 3qMqcBJtQioW6Bc0aY8Ns4EQsQchaRLZnNVKZl65htDzXDcSCnRb8Acaxekp+wn55TQ3 ONGzvinw25wrslowIYoX/Zs8yiRBbs9xj10+HXQlpeLGec/6eDEyLOCA9xi9fFx1UMUY /3Vfm9iUIVBFW+JDgoTWp+fRJmBYbybRYPsmSKI7WTaI2mi0nS9LrhM1VF4Cxcbhpm1r b6Fw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVK0fpPsL39tuIuyACm9w4V7bnHNx2DpO4FNkwDFjq5D831qG51 2EKN1wm436RXWmejo0OsgPBvnBPq5zBgjypGAWsSNA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzhQUpm6b2I4eyMO3v4+DGvyNcIgT3fevGaNtTS/I/Oynif8NOw1H3kEF714VtrEf3wtbq7mK8RvgZwuxMqwtw= X-Received: by 2002:a1c:7e82:: with SMTP id z124mr20452115wmc.136.1574532698618; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 10:11:38 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 2002:adf:f4d1:0:0:0:0:0 with HTTP; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 10:11:37 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <2566f3964ef2455c38c1576b7f68fc45@hamnavoe.com> References: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> <2566f3964ef2455c38c1576b7f68fc45@hamnavoe.com> From: hiro <23hiro@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2019 19:11:37 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: b501fdda-0e1c-11ea-9dcf-8470c35079b0 On 11/23/19, Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> wrote: >> nobody takes any of it seriously because none of them really use >> plan 9 to do anything people use computers to do ... > Never mind, I think I can just about see the gist of what you're > trying to get across. It's meant to be insulting, right? it's insulting to you that nobody takes plan9 serious? or that sl feels the need to point it out while you know better? or you disagree? because you take plan9 serious? i'm not sure you got sl's philosophy here. of course he will deny i do, but here's my interpretation anyway: the public generally seems to frown upon technology. people don't even want products any more. all they need is a flashy name. a future idea to be had. just buy another app, download it. don't even use it. try it out another day when it is actually more convenient for you. never threaten the user that your system will enable them to do anything. nobody wants an IDE, or to configure an operating system. if you can just open another tab, why should you buy another computer and install and configure an operating system that doesn't auto-update itself and is always out-of-date bec. it lacks support of any mainstream protocol like netflix or instagram. if they were consistent they would laugh about ALL operating systems, but apple and microsoft spend a good deal of marketing to prevent that :) it seems that 9front and plan9 are both ridiculous to the public. in the case of the former i would like to take pride and say for good reason. for the latter i think it's a sad, cause there was once big monopolies and bright people backing the effort, and now they are all busy doing something else that i don't know about - sad for me, perhaps great for them :P From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 056F8A21502 for <9fans@9fans.net>; 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Sat, 23 Nov 2019 10:14:06 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-AEAE661F-BE16-41BD-BFDA-4B8D4BEFD7C6 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Federico Benavento Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2019 15:14:04 -0300 Message-Id: References: In-Reply-To: To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (17B111) Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 0dcda07c-0e1d-11ea-b0f6-ac699048695e --Apple-Mail-AEAE661F-BE16-41BD-BFDA-4B8D4BEFD7C6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Yeah, WTF. > On 23 Nov 2019, at 14:16, Skip Tavakkolian wr= ote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BF > I think (hope) this is sarcasm. >=20 >> On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 6:35 AM Aram H=C4=83v=C4=83rneanu = wrote: >> Steve and Richard, >>=20 >> You are a bunch of hypocrites. Bitter old men. >>=20 >> --=20 >> Aram H=C4=83v=C4=83rneanu >>=20 >> ------------------------------------------ >> 9fans: 9fans >> Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tf27e6479d8812712-M08b= fe720c68d2b835d25e368 >> Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription >=20 > 9fans / 9fans / see discussions + participants + delivery options Permalin= k --Apple-Mail-AEAE661F-BE16-41BD-BFDA-4B8D4BEFD7C6 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Yeah, WTF.

On 23 Nov 2019, at 14:16, Skip Tavakkoli= an <skip.tavakkolian@gmail.com> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF
I think (hop= e) this is sarcasm.

On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 6:35 AM Aram H=C4=83v=C4=83rneanu &= lt;aram.h@mgk.ro> wrote:
Steve and Richard,

You are a bunch of hypocrites. Bitter old men.

--
Aram H=C4=83v=C4=83rneanu

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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 8bc4211c-0e1e-11ea-bde1-cb7f85e43e3b imo you should not allow insult by who only tried to insult you in weakness of feeling insulted by former accused insult. 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Message-ID: <20191123190014.GE37773@wopr> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> References: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> <2566f3964ef2455c38c1576b7f68fc45@hamnavoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <2566f3964ef2455c38c1576b7f68fc45@hamnavoe.com> Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 7f913cae-0e23-11ea-af68-bc7077acc565 On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 09:29:14AM +0000, Richard Miller wrote: > > Never mind, I think I can just about see the gist of what you're > trying to get across. It's meant to be insulting, right? > It's meant to be a practical answer. When people come looking for information, they want to know where the information is. "It's in six different places, and the only consistent place to find them is by asking over and over again on a mailing list, because they move every couple years" is not an answer that people find much use for. Generalizations are useful ways to get an overall picture of the situation. If you read the documents on 9p.io, none of the people who currently develop Plan 9 or software for it are even mentioned except in the contrib index. An example of this is how people always describe 9p.io as a mirror. I'm grateful it's up, but the first time I found out that people have been posting source code to it post-mirror is *in this thread*. How is anyone supposed to have been able to discover this? Repeatedly walking the tree and diffing everything just in case? Another good example is the kernel changes we only find out about when someone tries to build a Go beta on 9front, fails, and then we realize that someone on that team has modified the kernel for the language. I opened a ticket and asked for such things to be mentioned in the Go release notes, and they kindly accomodated me. But that was not the default behavior; the default behavior was to assume everyone was monitoring some mercurial repository on bitbucket. Those assumptions do not hold. As for the "just send the money" joke, the code lives at code.9front.org/hg/ and the (little-used, despite years of requests for its existence) wiki is at code.9front.org/wiki/. The code repos are documented on 9front.org and the wiki is not advertised beyond the people who asked for it, but it's open to everyone and contains a changelog. I appreciate the work that people put into Plan 9. The reality of that work is that it's scattered, difficult to find, and necessitates years of monitoring 9fans to identify the people who do it. That works for the people involved, and nobody at this point expects it to change, but it is extremely disconnected from the way people tend to go about developing software nowadays. For all practical purposes, sl's answer is accurate. Whether it's insulting is really up to the reader. khm From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F77EA250BF for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 15:17:03 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from khm@sciops.net) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 6B31DDC6B03; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 15:17:03 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574540223; b=sQZF/Tqr8icw0Ligzs/IP4iQusapEw0Ykny7FC3ozejIDfPF/L mfBML+86WUUPHZa7R2QYKN07NAX6oXdviIGZYHy8aJz3Ui3AEBgf0j9e2SYzPX5i AmHy+JP0AJtzmVweEXqRBp0EitKqKO95UPuJQ/P+yU6O2mlP5YdJvZnNMd4IgBrP eD/cExL2hNiWuTV3P29dC9R1+7qnOaBNdR1wJv2/pjdHBUS0a1f99pkLeYzBxLzo 4Q6FVQphdjqDv8YODZ4Kxcp5tqp7uyoyZ13L8Kq0cyV5Mg+Q3oBxGBB9/x3fGfJS g1mLkwdNjQKi1BX6Sae6JEiQWWdHgACITQzA== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:content-type:in-reply-to; s=arcseal; t=1574540223; bh=19jCbNb2U/8svCg7+tejF29ZPd2Jux2oUvoROPV1sHk=; b=PDahNqjAXrs3 YcopcJYKSdxxo6yg4BI8WePeOdwb8f1Mf4RDqxcV0qtTBDhSDGqIjai95S5ir7En PTpeb7vc/cXjd0lC5peZXLSJFP9kf39b7Hwn7U+PDYRfeYWolVw9owympXsLI03A 1+VGwjdJFUc5XZTsPWSCIuSOFMcA3U8TVW8EoMPW5m8jqNELhcK3enTwr/tYRJzY +SsyshwyQF/JTtTuMe8vgoJBDpVJJgbV+hb627CbM7dJzfj1Kgey8G3GcrHHNLjR G5g/oVnfvAFcjJiirWPa2xWDdPuYNiNCCXwvrh7r/rpfYGQksmMlDsOZpVtfVhwT xtyG4Zj2nQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=sciops.net; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=216.126.196.60 (wopr.sciops.net); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=khm@sciops.net smtp.helo=wopr.sciops.net; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=wopr.sciops.net policy.ptr=wopr.sciops.net; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=sciops.net policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=sciops.net policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 Authentication-Results: tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=sciops.net; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=216.126.196.60 (wopr.sciops.net); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=khm@sciops.net smtp.helo=wopr.sciops.net; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=wopr.sciops.net policy.ptr=wopr.sciops.net; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=sciops.net policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=sciops.net policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudehiedgudegtdcutefuodetggdotefrod ftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpggftfghnshhusghstghrihgsvgdp uffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepfffhvf fukfhfgggtuggjsehttdertddttddvnecuhfhrohhmpefmuhhrthcujfcuofgrihgvrhcu oehkhhhmsehstghiohhpshdrnhgvtheqnecuffhomhgrihhnpeelfhhrohhnthdrohhrgh enucfkphepvdduiedruddviedrudeliedriedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepihhnvghtpedvudei rdduvdeirdduleeirdeitddphhgvlhhopeifohhprhdrshgtihhophhsrdhnvghtpdhmrg hilhhfrhhomhepoehkhhhmsehstghiohhpshdrnhgvtheqnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihii vgeptd X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (sciops.net: 216.126.196.60 is authorized to use 'khm@sciops.net' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'mx' matched)) receiver=tb-mx1.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="khm@sciops.net"; helo=wopr.sciops.net; client-ip=216.126.196.60 Received: from wopr.sciops.net (wopr.sciops.net [216.126.196.60]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 15:17:03 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from khm@sciops.net) Received: (qmail 67679 invoked by uid 1001); 23 Nov 2019 12:17:01 -0800 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2019 12:17:01 -0800 From: Kurt H Maier To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Message-ID: <20191123201701.GA14389@wopr> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> References: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> <2566f3964ef2455c38c1576b7f68fc45@hamnavoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 3a85e2b2-0e2e-11ea-837d-cca957380813 On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 08:24:41AM -0600, Steven Stallion wrote: > > Indeed. It's interesting that folks from 9front like to tout their > development as "open" using tools that others in the community have > developed in addition to their own. To wit, you seem to have gotten > along quite nicely using the porting work I did for Mercurial in 2012. I'm not sure what this paragraph means. Can you clarify? If you feel something in 9front is misattributed or should be clarified as your work, it will take seconds to fix. Can you be specific? Initial commits were in 2011, and I don't see much change to the mercurial code until some CVE fixes in 2014. I'd be happy to amend the record on your behalf. I also don't understand the scare quotes around "open" or the part about using other people's software. That's kind of the point of the license. > (FWIW, I found this response especially entertaining after visiting > code.9front.org; "Just Send the Money" indeed.) 402 Payment Required is my default response to search engine crawlers and unpopulated URL paths. code.9front.org returns that up front to mitigate search engines, which otherwise beat the shit out of hgweb. 9front infrastructure is all paid for out of pocket by me and sl, so we're not really interested in spending bandwidth on Google's bottom line. the actual hgweb pages (everything under code.9front.org/hg) have working search functions. the "just send the money" text is a decade-old joke about support contracts and how they handle bug reports. You may note that there is no actual money-collecting infrastructure presented, because nobody actually sends the money. khm From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14FD9A251DD for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 15:27:37 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from khm@sciops.net) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 9900C2A3AC8; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 15:27:37 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574540857; b=FPBVw+siNDxKY29MCqyg0ixtnkWc8Ie479Dt3txTBt3LN4u5H+ c/qMbaGD8tDVPEkqikCcsbrlJxHznH7VytIPsjmGXCMocgZq5IG8wylfth81mLXM Jks3ur83LHzOXD2rCy4u0ckcZ/MqMm+Cg1snshPl1rDcEBFuzVWtcRYsrZzsrmfM Z6rMlSD47X0415cEmVQO29xIcrrIAghzDE+u26NTnYOGg8UQ4HJBYVsRXdIQKjfF HXfZTWbdhn2QT/OZ3owAWYhjdq/wG7pfxwA+f+bH3gGEw0OZ9Gj1rxI591HERL3k YgEh6ZL4+6ez4qhBQf6hEoOYZCEgXGpukfXw== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:content-type:in-reply-to; s=arcseal; t=1574540857; bh=JWLejKxRWkIYbo3jl75sJ6dcNBS2vKgKh/9OSRarvVQ=; b=NCLK5YNg6QE4 DyVx7WQ5Lu/0E7xjF+jpAkWHoOe9WtlBOxholYQDRJ5gdgyi2H7EtXrHpG2WaSjX YgVHHDslfEQTkEexbzu8Daql/K7WpDIEBiJvj2VewLbj/iU/aOIeBTb8zasEeYhZ Sima5AzwgBN43IuPRVDvOLStuSLenZJduZtIzU4qFfS94M/KP6OWTnn7gJlwxWb9 Nn+O3crLO5j9QXQhBuirbk7Mb4qBHk+5EjGmqCskMTFItvJCZuee8cn75k7rbezH ec2/QAHmF4Nvqk+3Ntay8ko28Oc2C1C+RTrZKH6Vng/KUzb4pchzSjtk4pKxZNuO 4zWkBTXwQg== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=sciops.net; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=216.126.196.60 (wopr.sciops.net); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=khm@sciops.net smtp.helo=wopr.sciops.net; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=wopr.sciops.net policy.ptr=wopr.sciops.net; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=sciops.net policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=sciops.net policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 Authentication-Results: tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=sciops.net; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=216.126.196.60 (wopr.sciops.net); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=khm@sciops.net smtp.helo=wopr.sciops.net; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=wopr.sciops.net policy.ptr=wopr.sciops.net; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=sciops.net policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=sciops.net policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudehiedgudegfecutefuodetggdotefrod ftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpggftfghnshhusghstghrihgsvgdp uffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepfffhvf fukfhfgggtuggjsehttdertddttddvnecuhfhrohhmpefmuhhrthcujfcuofgrihgvrhcu oehkhhhmsehstghiohhpshdrnhgvtheqnecukfhppedvudeirdduvdeirdduleeirdeitd enucfrrghrrghmpehinhgvthepvdduiedruddviedrudeliedriedtpdhhvghlohepfiho phhrrdhstghiohhpshdrnhgvthdpmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpeeokhhhmhesshgtihhophhsrd hnvghtqeenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedt X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (sciops.net: 216.126.196.60 is authorized to use 'khm@sciops.net' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'mx' matched)) receiver=tb-mx1.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="khm@sciops.net"; helo=wopr.sciops.net; client-ip=216.126.196.60 Received: from wopr.sciops.net (wopr.sciops.net [216.126.196.60]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 15:27:36 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from khm@sciops.net) Received: (qmail 68183 invoked by uid 1001); 23 Nov 2019 12:27:35 -0800 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2019 12:27:35 -0800 From: Kurt H Maier To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Message-ID: <20191123202735.GB14389@wopr> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> References: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> <2566f3964ef2455c38c1576b7f68fc45@hamnavoe.com> <20191123201701.GA14389@wopr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20191123201701.GA14389@wopr> Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: b2e87e26-0e2f-11ea-85c1-c24d30dcb3b4 To follow up, 9front mercurial originated from /n/sources/contrib/bichued/ in 2009. So this is yet another example of the complete lack of discoverability being a source of unending confusion in the Plan 9 community. How many years have people been pissed off about "stolen work" or whatever based on similar misconceptions? We'll never know. So much information gets lost, and it takes concentrated effort to reconstruct the timelines. 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identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="sstallion@gmail.com"; helo=mail-il1-f173.google.com; client-ip=209.85.166.173 Received: from mail-il1-f173.google.com (mail-il1-f173.google.com [209.85.166.173]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 17:35:37 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from sstallion@gmail.com) Received: by mail-il1-f173.google.com with SMTP id u17so10744641ilq.5 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 14:35:37 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=4EL/PS8i5MbGjviHxy3oJhEwBLPsIYpVsD7PdGvwIKM=; b=darhmNo7oX7q6C2T9QZ6rfUAD3uNCF7Cr4VpVRqfMrMUb+346MgrZ8AQrdpAf3a6z7 ePicdcg7IX7ZVL4VtShlecys1mm4cDq3G3DBampYkLq9GmhGYvgK8cU2AVg8jd0UYCzN 83Im0LtWkOhRECg6HB4vhIpquppQ/CsFbW9A2dj73/g72zQIbY/xgIMV63TOm0G9jCCy OzmElkl9svLvS56R97DptwgNbcBb5RRMW7AG/VpFQ6p7ASyBnrq+PG8Q33LzXXXYskFL EjxbZvmAdItEe+kvM4HkukRdpX+LPxqDcEX3jbwLGC78+vRU9al1swtZKJ/3rTyQFL2T dbZA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=4EL/PS8i5MbGjviHxy3oJhEwBLPsIYpVsD7PdGvwIKM=; b=PVNEkzJSVgumWMT2DMZTgY1jWxn+vswiBxvwxPvrUCCpgQYOzihoWvJtai9T4VN+T0 qqVxTpphJ/Lr3I+vyBPfhkKvHlDurhvRBcG1p/WUGQJEl+dUAQ6wHXftHUlU7qavj/nc i1H+U+fdrxy8IFr3Hnv5hha9AG3vtDWS5CRaCAEqP+gYVUmzPKwSnW84JAtQ0iZMk7Eo 0XQqJmZFTUI4zpw1Z1XcnfgNAc0qyAUtgXBiq5Ft7BHB+jsWnL6IrKZGg0S7FZqM+YSk P7pck7iD1ieQ0LP217vum+rcs0lFdVVq2UVsTbD7OfvTao8H8vRgLZMyLluqXpQ1gfyw LTNg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXlxbg3AaAjBvbGn6EoKQEnT0w6F/vF9zi0CJbblYZ1ApSD1AyD 1C1OtxDQ+7P64AhL+QrY3SifdRiDXe7Y9+B+KNGzIAc5XQs= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxnfe/ta4kt5BrFo6tHYKg/JXN5bJ91Qk5zOK3oJcytK9uXcG+/NnBGoy/tgIYKWJozfLn3LWQED7MB3PxZSdc= X-Received: by 2002:a92:5cdd:: with SMTP id d90mr25990694ilg.48.1574548536522; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 14:35:36 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> <2566f3964ef2455c38c1576b7f68fc45@hamnavoe.com> <20191123201701.GA14389@wopr> <20191123202735.GB14389@wopr> In-Reply-To: <20191123202735.GB14389@wopr> From: Steven Stallion Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2019 16:35:25 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 94fcef3e-0e41-11ea-8e33-de50e07ed119 The upstream version of Mercurial in the 9front ports collection is based on my work, not bichued's: https://code.9front.org/hg/ports/file/5f994209e142/dev-vcs/mercurial/mkfile The amount of work wasn't much, but if you're going to dredge up ancient history, at least be accurate: http://mail.9fans.net/pipermail/9fans/2012-April/023243.html https://www.mercurial-scm.org/wiki/Plan9FromBellLabs https://www.mercurial-scm.org/wiki/FactotumExtension https://www.mercurial-scm.org/pipermail/mercurial-devel/2012-April/039078.html On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 2:28 PM Kurt H Maier wrote: > > To follow up, 9front mercurial originated from > /n/sources/contrib/bichued/ in 2009. So this is yet another example of > the complete lack of discoverability being a source of unending > confusion in the Plan 9 community. How many years have people been > pissed off about "stolen work" or whatever based on similar > misconceptions? We'll never know. So much information gets lost, and > it takes concentrated effort to reconstruct the timelines. A stitch in > time saves nine! > > khm > > ------------------------------------------ > 9fans: 9fans > Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tf27e6479d8812712-M05aa51942958bd173676b94d > Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7C8AB390F5 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 17:43:47 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from 23hiro@gmail.com) Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 01053674233; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 17:43:47 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574549027; b=fsjF8NqWGE1zVwDhMzs7R0Lolvn0n0Seex785zphJrTgJdPjGU shwV2c6jhhCubhXfulbUgZ4Kbrg5IT7J0yrq9LGT7KdiXjOM0j0Hm+qyAMr0r05H KEeZ9+q5Ei4/97K4lZJTfgbe5FZa7xUnxhBk9/BkXFL6P1dajc0yE9J4PaSjjZ1k P00BYYnwq1P1ygRimWx8JjVjGOZXlnfxDUH9VSRT2LfvKq70W57fUexmTSr0HPJ9 EVyqCfOMuFKpIw436aoA5KMKZTKvLxtBiZtXvcU7hE6zpddDK3clWPg9YLVTYkjA pGk4FQ55UuWaLrAjijx18D7XE2hxg+Kp8qfA== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; 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identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="23hiro@gmail.com"; helo=mail-wr1-f47.google.com; client-ip=209.85.221.47 Received: from mail-wr1-f47.google.com (mail-wr1-f47.google.com [209.85.221.47]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 17:43:47 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from 23hiro@gmail.com) Received: by mail-wr1-f47.google.com with SMTP id w9so12972865wrr.0 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 14:43:47 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=T+WOJCV/eyKwD0IUL5Wr04GLSSdwpkOJBD1fYEhLjMo=; b=h8FiIbUjC7zpNR0GlMhI9ZA5ObBPBzEScpHEQ6ekgtd48nmZ87ARqhkFa5OBDV/+tB CialbGPXgrLxaUE/7qIFQ9AJlzNow2HL/O+7aQCJ4cMmXTtiwxrxjMiMX+YbcOOoykd0 ezZIHxUwJT490hZO0C3VO/tV+UBsBlFLiZaeBsWzyRJxI10mypcbJzXBYZ6OkpLHYW8C jSmW3M+h3aIB1VWJwD/yHO3wUeXB/PE/pCZtQgwjG7kSRftJT3XSxhJVkXExkxqiSRlf 0Y4y8eyvOsRKKMb1uXDBM+lpUAtdTKuTh5+HMcvQSvC1FgzB5DeaUGoQZIyEl3Z7J4ij pMsQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; 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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: b8e7e75e-0e42-11ea-96e4-948189c3c9ff oh. nobody uses that. i wish that stupid ports repo didn't exist :) From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A88FB3996D for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 17:44:58 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from 23hiro@gmail.com) Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 57F5A866878; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 17:44:58 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574549098; b=N6w57RcfSTAQATMpwIejeuLoSvTp+bWqtX+wQDR42AtFGfvzDl GHSZ1vaXqvDqiH3ptD5tU6WQJP1WRQn93OlkiDueo1r1AFKul9VxQWK0P2oHFGCV 1epJq/m07jqAjDgqJ9bt0PFPydwHegnsyvQfW0D2uEglgbWb+UpKbpuwtlHJ5Z4n pJL3BqiYDeUtRmJzNQzxOUydF4OKrx2U4oBP2xtqEN3b6aDzrWF4E6l5lyx8fWIh ZPfrAtjdWT/Dddav6tvVAKuPtoHoZzutTIUNKLdXxDg6pmjDDp0gMQwUz+Gpubh9 eMrxnZ0DRdv4hXWtf05RHi/Kq1Ha7mOZs7rA== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; 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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: e857b2da-0e42-11ea-903a-8d493f8f15dc > The amount of work wasn't much then why bring it up? 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(12.151.36.202 [12.151.36.202]) by eigenstate.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id 88e259cc (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256:NO) for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 15:08:43 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2019 15:08:42 -0800 From: Ori Bernstein To: 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Message-Id: <20191123150842.0cb241ffef2e3b6b0affa08a@eigenstate.org> In-Reply-To: References: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> <2566f3964ef2455c38c1576b7f68fc45@hamnavoe.com> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; x86_64-unknown-openbsd6.6) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 36330c5e-0e46-11ea-b587-8df735085175 On Sat, 23 Nov 2019 08:24:41 -0600, Steven Stallion wrote: Against my better judgement... On Sat, 23 Nov 2019 08:24:41 -0600, Steven Stallion wrote: > On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 3:30 AM Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> wrote: > > Grow up. > > Indeed. It's interesting that folks from 9front like to tout their > development as "open" using tools that others in the community have > developed in addition to their own. To wit, you seem to have gotten > along quite nicely using the porting work I did for Mercurial in 2012. Yes, and thank you. I mean that. You put your code in the open, and people that found it useful were able to use it. > The Plan 9 community is certainly fragmented, but there are still a > number of people that are willing to share their knowledge and work > with others and it benefits no one to cast aspersions. It's frustrating. I *want* to see a healthy, active Labs distribution. >From my viewpoint, fragmentation doesn't capture the nature of the difficulty. The problem is that the fragments are invisible. The most official looking site for vanilla plan9 is 9p.io. It doesn't show any sign of activity since 2015. The wiki not only fails to point to a more up to date location, it confuses the issue by exclusively pointing at dead links. 9legacy exists. It doesn't bill itself as living continuation of Plan 9. It claims it's a patch set for the last image to come out of the moldering corpse of Bell Labs. Even there, '9fs sources' tries to connect to the long-gone sources.cs.bell-labs.com. There's code scattered on contrib, but as for who has the most up to date/maintained/functioinal version of something -- it's hearsay, and usually, I haven't heard anyone say. There's the plan9-contrib github repository, but the last commit on that was over a year ago, and until recently, there was no way to use it *from* plan 9 -- now, lufia has ported git, and I wrote git9. Lufia's patches seem to be stalled in review. There are contrib directories, but projects are haphazardly thrown in, often duplicated them, with no indication of what's working, up to date, or maintained. Code may exist, but... where? I've been around for a while and I would have trouble finding the bits needed for a day-to-day usable system outside of the 9front world. God have mercy on someone trying to use the system seriously for the first time. -- Ori Bernstein From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 731A3A28A6C for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 18:46:22 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from skip.tavakkolian@gmail.com) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 3B343108A0A; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 18:46:22 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574552782; b=BfFTZT9clP4OWTMVETup/ZRHOcGW0aiIymurrfAJ86xNPRd/ec Kb7yIBbgXAv9awdUAu21iLW461OQGY7TkJyK6/VSL4376LkjCt0bAwRyF5Zk1FU7 mcqWqkqldpIlXjn/NwwNW9sQE8S+uQHxdPfPD+xrhJv/O2pte1NSXETqKqrdeGQv agpcBPJDxMH4zqS/204+uZnfJIaD4XTCcqz7fWTqtefwHVvjGV/ghLB766aat5KE xJKFU8FgJ9Djmi1z6GJvEJ4S+DzWPVNTGmwL0fUJDI74xs+g8mOYcSiLFNmGDIbw na+nHFDbbuXDeI0p2BG3cfQI4Ws/QYkIvgnQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; 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a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=JrbxNev4fjv0Rq82S/c5i+vEoIY/gZ0NnAwC06RpqE8=; b=qRHr2S/r9KWXC6aucKqzWP+BxMOagGHxGlcI0xQgiQIHYG4JppcFa+lunf5YvctRZc YxY3HqokqwJlvjcTUoka07WL6SRX+KMVIRCduvEihgucATvw65GHNOUuZ5AEYMRyzikc UE3Ko14AlShbDfpEu2Un9zhnPtVMqnyUCDC8nSKd5bHvk6T4qsEAcdchWajkn5jNPvlh eUEAOHPiqzxsynqKMLfdyrWMOsIPuhbD3jo/BSESmeyNEJ0HoypXKb4of4BTtlvrzvY0 iuTrYjkbOihz2kmkbRL6oYSAumjzTHyg3RQYxJGyse/BmBqBeIgTzCJ+s+OxH+5uvVHN B+Mw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVn5QrxrMb1eAJ2qoJDbb2rJFoprT+0UZdnqM3vKevqxVvFDRku Go7762Zzxo/T0+ybJCG06ahMSmaqPX/NI8KjfdoGq3QV X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwklRsTLZRBdz/JxTKJ6Z2WDUFH/7cS7LxAsE2h3lMPzpcSHiKxuujMo6WzdwShlfQaCzy1vRbs0T8K/V42wEs= X-Received: by 2002:a67:ce84:: with SMTP id c4mr14446558vse.12.1574552781253; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 15:46:21 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> <2566f3964ef2455c38c1576b7f68fc45@hamnavoe.com> <20191123150842.0cb241ffef2e3b6b0affa08a@eigenstate.org> In-Reply-To: <20191123150842.0cb241ffef2e3b6b0affa08a@eigenstate.org> From: Skip Tavakkolian Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2019 15:46:07 -0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000034f17b05980c23ad" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 771e1a42-0e4b-11ea-9fcb-ddec302ecbe9 --00000000000034f17b05980c23ad Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" It is unfortunate that some believe that being caustic is a prerequisite for 9front advocacy. Worse, many 9front advocates become offended by any challenge to claims they make, while at the same time administering personal insults with ease. Fixing the fragmentation doesn't come from starting yet another fork. On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 3:10 PM Ori Bernstein wrote: > On Sat, 23 Nov 2019 08:24:41 -0600, Steven Stallion > wrote: > > Against my better judgement... > > On Sat, 23 Nov 2019 08:24:41 -0600, Steven Stallion > wrote: > > > On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 3:30 AM Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> > wrote: > > > Grow up. > > > > Indeed. It's interesting that folks from 9front like to tout their > > development as "open" using tools that others in the community have > > developed in addition to their own. To wit, you seem to have gotten > > along quite nicely using the porting work I did for Mercurial in 2012. > > Yes, and thank you. I mean that. > > You put your code in the open, and people that found it useful > were able to use it. > > > The Plan 9 community is certainly fragmented, but there are still a > > number of people that are willing to share their knowledge and work > > with others and it benefits no one to cast aspersions. > > It's frustrating. I *want* to see a healthy, active Labs > distribution. > > From my viewpoint, fragmentation doesn't capture the nature of the > difficulty. The problem is that the fragments are invisible. > > The most official looking site for vanilla plan9 is 9p.io. It > doesn't show any sign of activity since 2015. The wiki not only > fails to point to a more up to date location, it confuses the > issue by exclusively pointing at dead links. > > 9legacy exists. It doesn't bill itself as living continuation of > Plan 9. It claims it's a patch set for the last image to come > out of the moldering corpse of Bell Labs. Even there, '9fs sources' > tries to connect to the long-gone sources.cs.bell-labs.com. > > There's code scattered on contrib, but as for who has the most up > to date/maintained/functioinal version of something -- it's > hearsay, and usually, I haven't heard anyone say. > > There's the plan9-contrib github repository, but the last commit > on that was over a year ago, and until recently, there was no way > to use it *from* plan 9 -- now, lufia has ported git, and I wrote > git9. Lufia's patches seem to be stalled in review. > > There are contrib directories, but projects are haphazardly thrown > in, often duplicated them, with no indication of what's working, > up to date, or maintained. > > Code may exist, but... where? I've been around for a while and I > would have trouble finding the bits needed for a day-to-day usable > system outside of the 9front world. > > God have mercy on someone trying to use the system seriously for the > first time. > > -- > Ori Bernstein > > ------------------------------------------ > 9fans: 9fans > Permalink: > https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tf27e6479d8812712-Mb9b516149f01370f96ffb6b8 > Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription > --00000000000034f17b05980c23ad Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
It is unfortunate that some believe that being caustic is = a prerequisite for 9front advocacy.

Worse, many 9front a= dvocates become offended by any challenge to claims they make, while at the= same time administering personal insults with ease.

Fixing the fragmentation doesn't come from starting yet another = fork.



On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 3:10 PM Or= i Bernstein <ori@eigenstate.org> wrote:
On = Sat, 23 Nov 2019 08:24:41 -0600, Steven Stallion <sstallion@gmail.com> wrote:

Against my better judgement...

On Sat, 23 Nov 2019 08:24:41 -0600, Steven Stallion <sstallion@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 3:30 AM Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> wrote:
> > Grow up.
>
> Indeed. It's interesting that folks from 9front like to tout their=
> development as "open" using tools that others in the communi= ty have
> developed in addition to their own. To wit, you seem to have gotten > along quite nicely using the porting work I did for Mercurial in 2012.=

Yes, and thank you. I mean that.

You put your code in the open, and people that found it useful
were able to use it.

> The Plan 9 community is certainly fragmented, but there are still a > number of people that are willing to share their knowledge and work > with others and it benefits no one to cast aspersions.

It's frustrating. I *want* to see a healthy, active Labs
distribution.

>From my viewpoint, fragmentation doesn't capture the nature of the
difficulty. The problem is that the fragments are invisible.

The most official looking site for vanilla plan9 is 9p.io.=C2=A0 It
doesn't show any sign of activity since 2015.=C2=A0 The wiki not only fails to point to a more up to date location, it confuses the
issue by exclusively pointing at dead links.

9legacy exists. It doesn't bill itself as living continuation of
Plan 9.=C2=A0 It claims it's a patch set for the last image to come
out of the moldering corpse of Bell Labs. Even there, '9fs sources'=
tries to connect to the long-gone sources.cs.bell-labs.com.

There's code scattered on contrib, but as for who has the most up
to date/maintained/functioinal version of something -- it's
hearsay, and usually, I haven't heard anyone say.

There's the plan9-contrib github repository, but the last commit
on that was over a year ago, and until recently, there was no way
to use it *from* plan 9 -- now, lufia has ported git, and I wrote
git9.=C2=A0 Lufia's patches seem to be stalled in review.

There are contrib directories, but projects are haphazardly thrown
in, often duplicated them, with no indication of what's working,
up to date, or maintained.

Code may exist, but...=C2=A0 where?=C2=A0 I've been around for a while = and I
would have trouble finding the bits needed for a day-to-day usable
system outside of the 9front world.

God have mercy on someone trying to use the system seriously for the
first time.

--
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Ori Bernstein

------------------------------------------
9fans: 9fans
Permalink: https:= //9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tf27e6479d8812712-Mb9b516149f01370f96ffb6= b8
Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/gro= ups/9fans/subscription
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Message-ID: <20191124020302.GA70376@wopr> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> References: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> <2566f3964ef2455c38c1576b7f68fc45@hamnavoe.com> <20191123201701.GA14389@wopr> <20191123202735.GB14389@wopr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 8fdd5530-0e5e-11ea-9aad-f291fadde636 On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 04:35:25PM -0600, Steven Stallion wrote: > The upstream version of Mercurial in the 9front ports collection is > based on my work, not bichued's: > https://code.9front.org/hg/ports/file/5f994209e142/dev-vcs/mercurial/mkfile > That repo is run by 9front users; I just host it. That's why the contact point is mveety in the repo listing. 9front doesn't ship any of that code. > The amount of work wasn't much, but if you're going to dredge up > ancient history, at least be accurate: I wasn't aware I was dredging anything up. You complained about something, and I went looking to see if I could fix the problem. This repo is 9front: http://code.9front.org/hg/plan9front/ Nothing else is 9front, and all of 9front is in that repo. Here is the revision history for the mercurial mkfile in 9front: http://code.9front.org/hg/plan9front/log/tip/sys/src/cmd/hg/mkfile Obviously the people who work on the ports appreciate your effort, but it is not the same port of mercurial that 9front uses. I hope this clears up the issue. In the future, if anyone is dissatisfied with any of the attribution or use of any of the code in 9front, please feel free to contact the 9front mailing list, and I'll do my best to verify & fix any such problems. Complete archives are available over 9p; there's a script to make accessing them easier at https://code.9front.org/hg/plan9front/file/tip/rc/bin/9fs If you'd prefer, you can also email me directly. The other repos on that site are either user repos run by random people who asked me for access, or else various code I've collected around the internet and did not want to lose. Some of those repos came from Uriel and I never have figured out what they are or where they came from. If anyone can help with those, I'd appreciate it. thanks, khm From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E94DB3D95A for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 23:40:18 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from bakul@bitblocks.com) Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 15325B0873D; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 23:40:18 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574570418; b=jCmCsREt5rD+vC9KZbzzLoGa4dRu+DNInuAX9tpNBJp+WLbJPS o4eWgiuhofbJ2B2zV0L5ExwlAhrf07B6usVubS83xLPr5uRsP5reskCqKwplXSsV kLG24ekvos+Ze2mYTvOvOVwJAyauLq1hjbwNHEwuE983Wqs4UcXoubk9q8FJCbCt P9Ap9aTMtSnHreDrnSzt7DzYvzD5L9AAjZTtAxqbgQc9an2xq5FDcGfKJ57F5Lvg sPlApgpn58cZNtt8O219FPdFeUnZHCMH6qlbWdbtoqDRlu+Cr31mbHXf+AMl/2cS jYQ9FtIZd+/IXiXgLmzcKuVwjGfe6c1/VuyQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=from:content-type:content-transfer-encoding :mime-version:subject:date:references:to:in-reply-to:message-id; s=arcseal; t=1574570418; bh=SfhMNC2akwZhHgGaFKndxfDKV8KGlSvlkRa SvZpWCSo=; b=ULR7o0jRqvJtpna4mKAnfbrt5uuQpgNO0lCCe9utY3kdpFroXBW 5mSuRWa+oIIOOJVS5XjMDJCsf5W4NPQKAOmAk8Li14AU/aDR+eSNPO6Y4HRc5g09 7FwgoqucoiCzv8Fi6qxWRxoYVV+Hqduwz00YJ5g0zHsWveQYU0hT3c+4/FrKREu6 UL69HeEWP+fSFJCxy5TpOHt3ZHcqSuciK7Kc+W+bh5DN/wok021zmEvuogePsC/t Pgcjsum1o37bvf2TOJQHy9/EOZMoSuBYh34aKxZj1hbIribbdvQPNH3e82j/HAqs qVhFfqxyGLhQzaf3Z9Zyi3u/jgdU3j+yRiw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tb-mx0.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=bitblocks.com; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=173.228.5.8 (ns1.bitblocks.com); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=bakul@bitblocks.com smtp.helo=mail.bitblocks.com; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=fail smtp.helo=mail.bitblocks.com policy.ptr=ns1.bitblocks.com; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=bitblocks.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=bitblocks.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 Authentication-Results: tb-mx0.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=bitblocks.com; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=173.228.5.8 (ns1.bitblocks.com); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=bakul@bitblocks.com smtp.helo=mail.bitblocks.com; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=fail smtp.helo=mail.bitblocks.com policy.ptr=ns1.bitblocks.com; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=bitblocks.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=bitblocks.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudehjedgjeefucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdggtfgfnhhsuhgsshgtrhhisggvpdfu rfetoffkrfgpnffqhgenuceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpefhtgfggg fuffhfvfgjkffosehtqhhmtdhhtddvnecuhfhrohhmpeeurghkuhhlucfuhhgrhhcuoegs rghkuhhlsegsihhtsghlohgtkhhsrdgtohhmqeenucfkphepudejfedrvddvkedrhedrke enucfrrghrrghmpehinhgvthepudejfedrvddvkedrhedrkedphhgvlhhopehmrghilhdr sghithgslhhotghkshdrtghomhdpmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpeeosggrkhhulhessghithgslh hotghkshdrtghomhequcfukfgkgfepleektdenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedt X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (bitblocks.com: 173.228.5.8 is authorized to use 'bakul@bitblocks.com' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'ip4:173.228.5.8/29' matched)) receiver=tb-mx0.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="bakul@bitblocks.com"; helo=mail.bitblocks.com; client-ip=173.228.5.8 Received: from mail.bitblocks.com (ns1.bitblocks.com [173.228.5.8]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 23:40:17 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from bakul@bitblocks.com) Received: from mob.bitblocks.com (mob.bitblocks.com [192.168.125.11]) by mail.bitblocks.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E00A8156E80B for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sat, 23 Nov 2019 20:40:09 -0800 (PST) From: Bakul Shah Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\)) Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2019 20:40:09 -0800 References: <15744041560.8c521.64663@composer.9fans.topicbox.com> To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> In-Reply-To: <15744041560.8c521.64663@composer.9fans.topicbox.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 86960132-0e74-11ea-92c9-d8ec93c85f20 On Nov 21, 2019, at 10:29 PM, greemngreek@gmail.com wrote: >=20 > The site hasn't been updated since 2014-2015. If it's dead, is there = any chance of it coming back into development? Why do you ask? What do you want to do?= From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: greemngreek@gmail.com To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Message-Id: <15745731170.C8915.555230@composer.9fans.topicbox.com> References: <15744041560.8c521.64663@composer.9fans.topicbox.com> In-Reply-To: Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2019 00:25:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="15745731171.E9DbEc84.555230" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: cd0aaffe-0e7a-11ea-b3e2-240c1f2d11b0 --15745731171.E9DbEc84.555230 Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2019 00:25:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I was just curious if it had any chances of coming back or were 9legacy and= 9front the only options.= --15745731171.E9DbEc84.555230 Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2019 00:25:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I was just curious if it had any chances of= coming back or were 9legacy and 9front the only options.
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Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2019 22:13:35 -0800 References: <15744041560.8c521.64663@composer.9fans.topicbox.com> <15745731170.C8915.555230@composer.9fans.topicbox.com> To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> In-Reply-To: <15745731170.C8915.555230@composer.9fans.topicbox.com> Message-Id: <70C64719-7A20-4BA1-BA8A-3522947C7AB8@bitblocks.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 93ac9018-0e81-11ea-af4a-885ad3d07f45 On Nov 23, 2019, at 9:25 PM, greemngreek@gmail.com wrote: >=20 > I was just curious if it had any chances of coming back or were = 9legacy and 9front the only options. Ah. :-) But why? It is just out of idle curiosity, such as wondering about an old friend you haven't seen in decades or you actually wanted to use plan9? Personally I'd recommend 9pi. Raspi + 9pi is a great combination and there is plenty to explore, plenty of real world things to control. There are a lot of pi "hats" that would be fun to play with or use. 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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 7e0482b8-0e84-11ea-9caa-e17f5649fe54 On 11/24/19, Kurt H Maier wrote: > > The other repos on that site are either user repos run by random people > who asked me for access, or else various code I've collected around the > internet and did not want to lose. Some of those repos came from Uriel > and I never have figured out what they are or where they came from. If > anyone can help with those, I'd appreciate it. > We just got a mouthful from sl and you about the lack of explanation for the state of the various plan 9 "distributions". It all smacks of expecting Da Vinci to update the Mona Lisa because somebody would prefer a high-rise landscape in the background and because someone actually did photoshop the Mona Lisa in that guise, but was not accepted as the most significant contributor to the painting. I really don't feel like being kind to that sentiment, but I will refrain to lower myself to the level of disrespect that sl demonstrated. You used to have that position, Kurt with Hiro a close second (no offence intended, Kurt or Hiro, we are what we are and I find much of it stimulating), but between sl and Aram, they have left the two of you standing! Lucio. 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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: b8e9299a-0e86-11ea-b4f7-a9b3889a0202 On 11/23/19, hiro <23hiro@gmail.com> wrote: > i'm not sure you got sl's philosophy here. of course he will deny i > do, but here's my interpretation anyway: the public generally seems to > frown upon technology. people don't even want products any more. all > they need is a flashy name. a future idea to be had. just buy another > app, download it. don't even use it. try it out another day when it is > actually more convenient for you. > This here is a "Plan 9 contributors mutual admiration society" mailing list, a lot like a very large marriage; with all the thorns that complement the occasional budding rose and all the pain the hopefully rare divorce brings. Somebody coming along to promote 9front as the real heir to some totally inappropriate throne, to lord it over a scattering of communities that like to play with the one exotic toy they managed to salvage when they escaped from the clutches of Bill Gates first and Linus Torvalds second, well, that someone should at least show some manners. Failing which, I think it is reasonable for them to get escoriated, as there seem to be few if any other mechanism for the local team supporters to express their annoyance. Of course, I presume none of us "bitter old hypocrites (of the male variety)" - as Aram seems to have felt a need to label us - would risk trying to bully the 9front mailing list participants, in our frailty. Nevertheless, maybe just pointing out that bullying is so 1980s will have some positive effect, at least for a couple of days. Lucio. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FA96A30455 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 02:54:07 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from khm@sciops.net) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 687E4714C93; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 02:54:07 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574582047; b=VOLppEh+ZZp8390U/HpGZ5kElxVrbl3ocnOm0HyDQ9nXx3d+aA bIpbAYbjCIiuK8F0fkSp0l2f+NlSNyQYZExOPSWNuM/xrWfeQuzAwZENyU3JgHch xq5vAQHXrGXYtrnODSd1ZH2Zz/csuQqtW9UYODc24uo1OQzLPpu65p7duRcFaVRk pe1KjNP+DYbvp98PKaKJstikOPWdnXMjYXK7k3QIM8aXraHChWM7QzwT1F/8NnE/ Kp8W+Xi3m4J4sQygtXDhaKNHVn+KxV+zIOscRx+NBybi6BglZiqDZ48bWlBMvf9O 5CP8gJfmtAgZbLXwlY1CeZpMWxL3K0JgkObg== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:content-type:in-reply-to; s=arcseal; t=1574582047; bh=bXhS26FJD/LME2nYY8n5qGadp/WKH7stQ/3Z8LvRc7I=; b=gFVYNV6FSzKy S3YnZ2ZpQJHUCGRMOgfHu7xZFB91Dosh0443ZNxwjcefyepgVW/tQN5+Y8Ytggnv Je7c3I2Eites4+r4p6KKq+eF70zJ0FsBzNx3IpsZquDki40w35i8O+pmp/gJo8Zw u2HyJD/74sP0/ZDI4c7+oWCdvY52WLE/6/ZHXXAt+G9mOwYWIFX0hGzDVzeUHzvS 7rNPkukAXSpNxiB4JSio0QnV8cplZFWiumnuP8cz4GXGhvDVOQX7QxayxA8kgIJo gLiqC+HEYMJJwPX4satWeZzxr/urlrAEnRUAs5WhTJcAwIeSx7NhMeKtn82yBpoD obQVWJFWIw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=sciops.net; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=216.126.196.60 (wopr.sciops.net); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=khm@sciops.net smtp.helo=wopr.sciops.net; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=wopr.sciops.net policy.ptr=wopr.sciops.net; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=sciops.net policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=sciops.net policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 Authentication-Results: tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=sciops.net; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=216.126.196.60 (wopr.sciops.net); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=khm@sciops.net smtp.helo=wopr.sciops.net; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=wopr.sciops.net policy.ptr=wopr.sciops.net; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=sciops.net policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=sciops.net policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudehjedgudduudcutefuodetggdotefrod ftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpggftfghnshhusghstghrihgsvgdp uffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepfffhvf fukfhfgggtuggjsehttdertddttddvnecuhfhrohhmpefmuhhrthcujfcuofgrihgvrhcu oehkhhhmsehstghiohhpshdrnhgvtheqnecuffhomhgrihhnpeelfhhrohhnthdrohhrgh enucfkphepvdduiedruddviedrudeliedriedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepihhnvghtpedvudei rdduvdeirdduleeirdeitddphhgvlhhopeifohhprhdrshgtihhophhsrdhnvghtpdhmrg hilhhfrhhomhepoehkhhhmsehstghiohhpshdrnhgvtheqnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihii vgeptd X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (sciops.net: 216.126.196.60 is authorized to use 'khm@sciops.net' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'mx' matched)) receiver=tb-mx1.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="khm@sciops.net"; helo=wopr.sciops.net; client-ip=216.126.196.60 Received: from wopr.sciops.net (wopr.sciops.net [216.126.196.60]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 02:54:06 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from khm@sciops.net) Received: (qmail 4657 invoked by uid 1001); 23 Nov 2019 23:54:05 -0800 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2019 23:54:05 -0800 From: Kurt H Maier To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Message-ID: <20191124075405.GA87482@wopr> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> References: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> <2566f3964ef2455c38c1576b7f68fc45@hamnavoe.com> <20191123201701.GA14389@wopr> <20191123202735.GB14389@wopr> <20191124020302.GA70376@wopr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 99e3c344-0e8f-11ea-9c2f-b424043c19e9 On Sun, Nov 24, 2019 at 08:34:32AM +0200, Lucio De Re wrote: > We just got a mouthful from sl and you about the lack of explanation > for the state of the various plan 9 "distributions". It all smacks of > expecting Da Vinci to update the Mona Lisa because somebody would > prefer a high-rise landscape in the background and because someone > actually did photoshop the Mona Lisa in that guise, but was not > accepted as the most significant contributor to the painting. I'm not really following the art analogy here, but nothing I've said on this list is new. It's all documented either on 9front.org or (more frequently) in the manual, which comes with the operating system. The 9front ISO also contains the complete mercurial history of 9front, but does not include or refer to the 'ports' repo. Most of the developers of 9front don't use (or even like) the 'ports' repository. As far as I know the software in it works on any Plan 9 system. Regardless, I'll work with its maintainers to clarify the non-relationship in the README file. If you have any other suggestions for improving the state of things, let me know. If I'm honest, I suspect most of 9fans doesn't really give a shit about most of these issues. If anyone did, they probably would have said something before now, or done something to ameliorate any of them. Instead, they only seem to show up when someone gets mad about something else and then decides to air unrelated grievances -- which is a shame, because the sooner they're voiced the easier it is to fix things. I'm sure the performative outrage is much more gratifying in the moment. If anyone wants anything fixed, I'm available for that. If I have to wait until someone whatabouts something else, that's fine too, it's just slower. Either way, I'll try. khm From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75696B41E56 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 03:53:36 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from miller@hamnavoe.com) Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 041EFE1F8F2; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 03:53:36 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574585616; b=PlgaRTZAS11tQyT/kxuTKRJovTyJDDhYVSOBNe7UR9mHv7tVOo Vo6jQ3iACBCGkKYjCDlQ5pqANPy5mNnuhWaToR/Hv4L248QVfE5+R43lHgCabfi9 YHrVEkee7M4jYybFWhM/MLAsUdUlq2VKeDzsKky42hCOqXs0FBos/nWmZr+lm4R+ TAO3ohtkhfDHEy/Uphd+IY++zvYcQg7+FY8opqgNEJDqX5SjvKqTkaRQBG0NWmoH XaStqp7y7mUem+kxyXy5b3maCVrk5K2489PnadUhSRE8Dt0pnOWUHUgyyEwvrlyZ e49LcniPpdNjcb0KgyQo3yg6hqPCMmenI4pA== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=message-id:to:subject:from:date:in-reply-to :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=arcseal; t=1574585616; bh=A+NpFzpYGpYfBaEmVF6FPYxoNU0XthOwyL1PqlcvDQ8=; b= eFn03vdo63KkkbHDIUfePy7Dm2eQ2Bf2nEqANBWYZfAHEVdn0uU4VgvJA+eRewUn DkRWtPartDteTHVzs79h3nvc9wWxmvgHM1we6E4Cvc/NvRUGxO9jabrqnaAAXkrn 1Fy3K6l/j0O9qznsFXiciFOpHf+TXInr1mcqVEEyGKNWUF0fxn+TlRHRgpAgK27e vps9vkr89V2Mt1oJbaju3E6VQur3k5809Rf5VwOxyDpMovHaHQoMttwQAuSTEGxV MfmhID0jesI8jfjuJGqYOFk2SqAcgivJJXZh/6X8OkOd1YHuINwGwuq4g6JbEg8Y WEOl/JpQJ9WHuqxsgeq1tQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tb-mx0.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=hamnavoe.com; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=46.235.227.24 (balrog.mythic-beasts.com); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=miller@hamnavoe.com smtp.helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; x-aligned-from=domain_pass (Domain match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com policy.ptr=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=hamnavoe.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=hamnavoe.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 Authentication-Results: tb-mx0.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=hamnavoe.com; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=46.235.227.24 (balrog.mythic-beasts.com); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=miller@hamnavoe.com smtp.helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; x-aligned-from=domain_pass (Domain match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com policy.ptr=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=hamnavoe.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=hamnavoe.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudehjedguddvfecutefuodetggdotefrod ftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpggftfghnshhusghstghrihgsvgdp uffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepkffvuf fhffgjgggtgfesthejjhdttddtvdenucfhrhhomheptfhitghhrghrugcuofhilhhlvghr uceolehfrghnsheshhgrmhhnrghvohgvrdgtohhmqeenucfkphepgeeirddvfeehrddvvd ejrddvgedpkeekrdeljedrvdejrdekfeenucfrrghrrghmpehinhgvthepgeeirddvfeeh rddvvdejrddvgedphhgvlhhopegsrghlrhhoghdrmhihthhhihgtqdgsvggrshhtshdrtg homhdpmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpeeomhhilhhlvghrsehhrghmnhgrvhhovgdrtghomhequcfu kfgkgfepgeehhedvnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptd X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (hamnavoe.com: Sender is authorized to use 'miller@hamnavoe.com' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'include:_spf.mythic-beasts.com' matched)) receiver=tb-mx0.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="miller@hamnavoe.com"; helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; client-ip=46.235.227.24 Received: from balrog.mythic-beasts.com (balrog.mythic-beasts.com [46.235.227.24]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 03:53:35 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from miller@hamnavoe.com) Received: from [88.97.27.83] (port=41661 helo=zen.hamnavoe.com) by balrog.mythic-beasts.com with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_3DES_EDE_CBC_SHA1:192) (Exim 4.92.3) (envelope-from ) id 1iYne6-0005WL-Jt for 9fans@9fans.net; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 08:53:35 +0000 Message-ID: <73458d38ba582a30687e811898b41388@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2019 08:53:29 +0000 In-Reply-To: <20191123150842.0cb241ffef2e3b6b0affa08a@eigenstate.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BlackCat-Spam-Score: 12 X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.2 Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: e96819f8-0e97-11ea-9aaf-ce35b1e4dc23 > The most official looking site for vanilla plan9 is 9p.io. It > doesn't show any sign of activity since 2015. Please look more closely: cpu% srv -n 9p.io sources /n/sources post... cpu% ls -lrt /n/sources/patch/*/files|tail -24 --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 fst sys 160 Mar 18 2016 /n/sources/patch/kexportfs/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 102 Apr 19 2016 /n/sources/patch/segment-overlap/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 30 Apr 19 2016 /n/sources/patch/proc-smp-fixes/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 172 Apr 19 2016 /n/sources/patch/armv7-atomic/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 djc sys 36 Apr 19 2016 /n/sources/patch/pread-offset/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 fst sys 33 May 22 2016 /n/sources/patch/dial-await-bug/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 38 May 29 2016 /n/sources/patch/usbserial-ftdi-writelen/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 bootes sys 76 May 29 2016 /n/sources/patch/usbether-rpi/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 29 May 30 2016 /n/sources/patch/ramfs-fixes/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 272 Nov 6 2016 /n/sources/patch/wpa-psk/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 fst sys 43 Feb 9 2017 /n/sources/patch/tcp-halfduplex-close/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 stevesimon sys 44 Feb 21 2017 /n/sources/patch/sed-unbuffered/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 102 Mar 13 2017 /n/sources/patch/usb-ether-cdc/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 stevesimon sys 38 Mar 14 2017 /n/sources/patch/httpfile-suicide/files --rw-rw-rw- M 2032 none sys 41 Jun 29 2017 /n/sources/patch/ndb-remove-cast/files --rw-rw-rw- M 2032 none sys 27 Aug 30 2017 /n/sources/patch/comm-utf-sort/files --rw-rw-rw- M 2032 none sys 29 Aug 30 2017 /n/sources/patch/ascii-extra-newline/files --rw-rw-rw- M 2032 none sys 35 Aug 31 2017 /n/sources/patch/gmtime-tzoff-unset/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 297 Apr 5 2018 /n/sources/patch/usb-ether-lan78xx/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 36 Apr 5 2018 /n/sources/patch/exec-postnote-race/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 30 Apr 5 2018 /n/sources/patch/exit-wrong-parent/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 28 Apr 9 2018 /n/sources/patch/ssh2-dh-group14/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 33 Apr 9 2018 /n/sources/patch/aes-ctr/files --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 114 Apr 9 2018 /n/sources/patch/ssh2-aes-ctr/files cpu% Not a huge amount of churn there, but still a "sign of activity". > I've been around for a while and I > would have trouble finding the bits needed for a day-to-day usable > system outside of the 9front world. "Usable" is a function of who's doing the using. I use the Labs version every day and it does what I need. If another version suits somebody else, that's great. 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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: b19850f4-0eb7-11ea-b104-8cd3ec577463 ok, that is undeniably activity. now i'm giving an even more *horrible* metric of activity, to defend our confusion at least slightly. 9front activity during the same period: hg log|sed -n '1,/Mar 18.*2016/p'|grep changeset|wc -l 2282 here i give only the count of commits, and hope somebody will feel motivated to check the actual content instead of me reciting them all here. in the end what matters is what is inside. there have been lots of improvements to plan 9 you can find 9front. 9front contributions in my opinion are far from superficial or cosmetic as the art analogy earlier seemed to suggest. it's not only new drivers, there are also deeper changes, lots of bugfixes, updating, polishing has been done. quality has generally improved a lot - i wonder what gave anybody the opposite impression... it makes me sad to believe that regardless of our cultural differences you cannot see the technical merit of what has been contributed to 9front. how about more people try to actually use the software that has been contributed, so that we together have a chance to at least praise all the guys doing the heavy lifting (not me). apart from miller, i don't feel like most people having this discussion here are at all invested, i.e. contributing any code... thanks for your work, too, richard miller, i finally got a rpi4, and i'm enjoying 4k@60hz native plan9. it's something none of the much more expensive modern intel igpu can even deliver via hdmi :) and the usb is working, and the gigabit ethernet is working. it's phenomenal. i never gave you much thanks before this because i had such awful experiences with rpi hardware that i could not even fathom anybody's investment in such flawed hardware. but now that they have fixed their hardware i can truly make use of your software, too. turns out to be a great choice after all: a niche product/form-factor, but well worth it. and so, thanks again. with enough space to put all the thinkpads and rpi4 and big 4k screen and keyboard and mouse, i hope i will sooner rather than later not only administer, but instead use plan 9 as intended as a development environment and contribute something back. i hope people can relate in the meantime. On 11/24/19, Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> wrote: >> The most official looking site for vanilla plan9 is 9p.io. It >> doesn't show any sign of activity since 2015. > > Please look more closely: > > cpu% srv -n 9p.io sources /n/sources > post... > cpu% ls -lrt /n/sources/patch/*/files|tail -24 > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 fst sys 160 Mar 18 2016 > /n/sources/patch/kexportfs/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 102 Apr 19 2016 > /n/sources/patch/segment-overlap/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 30 Apr 19 2016 > /n/sources/patch/proc-smp-fixes/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 172 Apr 19 2016 > /n/sources/patch/armv7-atomic/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 djc sys 36 Apr 19 2016 > /n/sources/patch/pread-offset/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 fst sys 33 May 22 2016 > /n/sources/patch/dial-await-bug/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 38 May 29 2016 > /n/sources/patch/usbserial-ftdi-writelen/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 bootes sys 76 May 29 2016 > /n/sources/patch/usbether-rpi/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 29 May 30 2016 > /n/sources/patch/ramfs-fixes/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 272 Nov 6 2016 > /n/sources/patch/wpa-psk/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 fst sys 43 Feb 9 2017 > /n/sources/patch/tcp-halfduplex-close/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 stevesimon sys 44 Feb 21 2017 > /n/sources/patch/sed-unbuffered/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 102 Mar 13 2017 > /n/sources/patch/usb-ether-cdc/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 stevesimon sys 38 Mar 14 2017 > /n/sources/patch/httpfile-suicide/files > --rw-rw-rw- M 2032 none sys 41 Jun 29 2017 > /n/sources/patch/ndb-remove-cast/files > --rw-rw-rw- M 2032 none sys 27 Aug 30 2017 > /n/sources/patch/comm-utf-sort/files > --rw-rw-rw- M 2032 none sys 29 Aug 30 2017 > /n/sources/patch/ascii-extra-newline/files > --rw-rw-rw- M 2032 none sys 35 Aug 31 2017 > /n/sources/patch/gmtime-tzoff-unset/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 297 Apr 5 2018 > /n/sources/patch/usb-ether-lan78xx/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 36 Apr 5 2018 > /n/sources/patch/exec-postnote-race/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 30 Apr 5 2018 > /n/sources/patch/exit-wrong-parent/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 28 Apr 9 2018 > /n/sources/patch/ssh2-dh-group14/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 33 Apr 9 2018 > /n/sources/patch/aes-ctr/files > --rw-rw-r-- M 2032 miller sys 114 Apr 9 2018 > /n/sources/patch/ssh2-aes-ctr/files > cpu% > > Not a huge amount of churn there, but still a "sign of activity". > >> I've been around for a while and I >> would have trouble finding the bits needed for a day-to-day usable >> system outside of the 9front world. > > "Usable" is a function of who's doing the using. I use the Labs version > every day and it does what I need. 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h=message-id :to:subject:date:from:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; q=dns; s=mail; b=FUbVPuOvX+JIzb6DJ75 RpieV2RRzZxb+jsliawDoVDT8qTz10hx93EMUqdO6wRhnu/y0aJCKr7viPr52xuK 9KtaJLHcOxNyUHNoNJkhSg0RdsQ1oJKhtUjEd1uJOx+P5u0+aAvaIQ1DP1NZ/8kh BdZWolg4j+lvg7mPzPRkBo7M= Received: from abbatoir.hsd1.ca.comcast.net (c-76-21-119-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net [76.21.119.139]) by eigenstate.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id a6c6e990 (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA:256:NO); Sun, 24 Nov 2019 08:30:56 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <0074AD32FE84CB7602D40AEE206BCCD9@eigenstate.org> To: 9fans@hamnavoe.com, 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2019 08:30:56 -0800 From: ori@eigenstate.org In-Reply-To: 73458d38ba582a30687e811898b41388@hamnavoe.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: d02adc88-0ed7-11ea-aa8b-e2e10752c1a9 >> The most official looking site for vanilla plan9 is 9p.io. It >> doesn't show any sign of activity since 2015. > > Please look more closely: > > cpu% srv -n 9p.io sources /n/sources Usually, that's not what people mean when they say 'site'. It's good to see patches being posted, but for someone who is interested in experimenting with plan 9 for the first time, it's not clear that these exist, let alone which are important. Actually, you know what, I should put my money where my mouth is. Would there be objections to me going through and fixing the links in the wiki so they point to 9p.io? Is there anyone who would be comfortable explaining to me exactly the relationship between 9p.io and 9legacy, as well as how people are expected to use the two, so that I can put that into the wiki? Is there anywhere that people would be comfortable blessing as a source for building new ISO images, to put behind the download link, with the accepted patches integrated? (Yes, I do use 9front, but I'm not religious. I'd be happy to take some time to improve labs, too. I also hate people who complain without doing the work to improve things.) > "Usable" is a function of who's doing the using. I use the Labs > version every day and it does what I need. The impression I got was that many users (in the 9front world, at least) have a system patched to their desires, and don't run things fully vanilla, direct from the ISO. 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[66.111.4.228]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 184sm1934700qke.73.2019.11.24.09.07.48 for <9fans@9fans.net> (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 24 Nov 2019 09:07:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from compute3.internal (compute3.nyi.internal [10.202.2.43]) by mailauth.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B599226B3 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 12:07:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from imap24 ([10.202.2.74]) by compute3.internal (MEProxy); Sun, 24 Nov 2019 12:07:48 -0500 X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudehkedgleelucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfqfgfvpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgen uceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpefofgggkfgjfhffhffvufgtsehttd ertderredtnecuhfhrohhmpedfffgrvhhiugcuughuucevohhlohhmsghivghrfdcuoedt ihhnthhrohesghhmrghilhdrtghomheqnecuffhomhgrihhnpeelphdrihhonecurfgrrh grmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpegujhgtodhmvghsmhhtphgruhhthhhpvghrshhonhgrlhhi thihqdekheekieduudehvddqudeluddtheejhedvqddtihhnthhroheppehgmhgrihhlrd gtohhmsegsihhtsgdrlhhtnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptd X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id 939012000A3; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 12:07:47 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.1.7-578-g826f590-fmstable-20191119v1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <0074AD32FE84CB7602D40AEE206BCCD9@eigenstate.org> References: <0074AD32FE84CB7602D40AEE206BCCD9@eigenstate.org> Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2019 18:07:26 +0100 From: "David du Colombier" <0intro@gmail.com> To: 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Content-Type: text/plain Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: f51bd86c-0edc-11ea-8a1c-c60b6e907ec3 > Actually, you know what, I should put my money > where my mouth is. Would there be objections to > me going through and fixing the links in the > wiki so they point to 9p.io? This is a good idea. Let me know how do you want to proceed. > Is there anyone who would be comfortable explaining > to me exactly the relationship between 9p.io and > 9legacy, as well as how people are expected to use > the two, so that I can put that into the wiki? 9p.io is a mirror of the former Bell Labs website. We're still accepting patches and people can update their contrib directory. However, the rest is mostly read-only. 9legacy is the latest Plan 9 from Bell Labs sources (2015-01-10) with addition of a few hundreds patches. It's regularly updated. > Is there anywhere that people would be comfortable > blessing as a source for building new ISO images, > to put behind the download link, with the accepted > patches integrated? That's mostly what 9legacy is. -- David du Colombier From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3152B47ED9 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 12:32:28 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from ori@eigenstate.org) Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 05A43561BEB; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 12:32:28 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574616748; b=jwckxjEMZpJKqb1sf/kQywirNeGv8A+iVN3EIDQJyyXHaEfoyz BUvpJSMKRybS8PcC9WQ59Cch4Rdg5iRhsuFp6cFmZAD41scnKJAY+qz0FG8weNW3 U2E9Z2eJkXjRcGgek8Y2k+zeEJz9kWhu1tPImDBhBlzWFPyxghLT9n+YCNz7YWHB m0Yd+g63Vvgykuu1pHAmM2T4sHj4N3yfox//dcPrNGHSOVXN5brkgcPfvhyyNu7v 2Q6umdkSPVSzTlGZMw083X7OUKm/rxuSOI49Oya9zyMgU6k/6Tx+HD+SW8Bty3ak LQSkFS3W3mY1GgIlh2spClM3MWsaykM04I4Q== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=message-id:to:subject:date:from:in-reply-to :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; 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h=message-id :to:subject:date:from:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; q=dns; s=mail; b=e06GwEq5fg7VnsPdIfZ QTrw3+CtH/tqkduRdn185/OhcuQW5LiZUNymP+y1ET9hx2lYsUqkn5AGHdZzY0XE QiEjOXrZ39TXRVirG4E0b/6abTJclWw3sSijtOTA0F/J2XEdC4OLbomHWcocmxyW nG1cteH4y9hQiN7YoECyo+wo= Received: from abbatoir.hsd1.ca.comcast.net (c-76-21-119-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net [76.21.119.139]) by eigenstate.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id 8a64c8c0 (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA:256:NO); Sun, 24 Nov 2019 09:32:26 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: To: 0intro@gmail.com, 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2019 09:32:25 -0800 From: ori@eigenstate.org In-Reply-To: b08e684d-677f-4c00-9cc1-44cf78f8f09c@www.fastmail.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 65f5e2a0-0ee0-11ea-b7be-8c11e55d8418 > This is a good idea. Let me know how do you want to proceed. I will be busy working on other systems until December, but when I get back, I'll just make the chages to the wiki. If it's not editable, I'll email a patch to the 9fans list. > 9p.io is a mirror of the former Bell Labs website. > > We're still accepting patches and people can > update their contrib directory. However, the > rest is mostly read-only. It may be worth making it clear *on* 9p.io, then, that the site is a historical monument, and not a place to go for a living system. A link to 9legacy on the front page, flagging it as the place to go if someone wants to use "Plan 9 from Bell Labs", would probably be in order. Personally, I'd prefer to treat the site, and the system itself, as a living thing, and not as a historical preservation project. Treating the main page as "The world stopped when bell labs died" doesn't indicate a healthy ecosystem to me. But that's not my call to make, and since I'm not the one doing the work, I'm not going to argue about that too much. > > Is there anywhere that people would be comfortable > > blessing as a source for building new ISO images, > > to put behind the download link, with the accepted > > patches integrated? > > That's mostly what 9legacy is. It's a collection of patches, but it's unclear from the site that it's the successor to 9p.io. It would be good to clarify that this is where the labs distribution of Plan 9 lives. You can see that confusion in greemngreek's questions. 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[108.51.182.148]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 83sm2082562qkd.26.2019.11.24.09.34.54 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 24 Nov 2019 09:34:54 -0800 (PST) From: "David L. Craig" X-Google-Original-From: "David L. Craig" Received: from dlc by able.home with local (Exim 4.92.3) (envelope-from ) id 1iYvmf-0000ZS-FP; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 17:34:53 +0000 Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2019 17:34:53 +0000 To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Cc: 9fans@hamnavoe.com Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Message-ID: <20191124173453.GA527@able.home> References: <0074AD32FE84CB7602D40AEE206BCCD9@eigenstate.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="X1bOJ3K7DJ5YkBrT" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <0074AD32FE84CB7602D40AEE206BCCD9@eigenstate.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.12.2 (2019-09-21) Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: bebae5fc-0ee0-11ea-bda4-bb77c76074b8 --X1bOJ3K7DJ5YkBrT Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 19Nov24:0830-0800, ori@eigenstate.org wrote: > >> The most official looking site for vanilla plan9 is 9p.io. It > >> doesn't show any sign of activity since 2015. > >=20 > > Please look more closely: > >=20 > > cpu% srv -n 9p.io sources /n/sources >=20 > Usually, that's not what people mean when they > say 'site'. >=20 > It's good to see patches being posted, but for > someone who is interested in experimenting with > plan 9 for the first time, it's not clear that > these exist, let alone which are important. >=20 > Actually, you know what, I should put my money > where my mouth is. Would there be objections to > me going through and fixing the links in the > wiki so they point to 9p.io? >=20 > Is there anyone who would be comfortable explaining > to me exactly the relationship between 9p.io and > 9legacy, as well as how people are expected to use > the two, so that I can put that into the wiki? >=20 > Is there anywhere that people would be comfortable > blessing as a source for building new ISO images, > to put behind the download link, with the accepted > patches integrated? >=20 > (Yes, I do use 9front, but I'm not religious. I'd > be happy to take some time to improve labs, too. > I also hate people who complain without doing the > work to improve things.) >=20 > > "Usable" is a function of who's doing the using. > > I use the Labs version every day and it does what > > I need. >=20 > The impression I got was that many users (in the > 9front world, at least) have a system patched > to their desires, and don't run things fully > vanilla, direct from the ISO. Over five years ago I was compelled to stop work on my cookbook for newbies to implement a working Plan 9 virtual server with a drawterm interface on a GNU/Linux platform supporting virtual machines. I have received one email =66rom someone who successfully got started thereby and it's still available at http://dlcusa.net/vp9cb-9pio, but after reading this thread, I wonder if it's worth the effort to get back to it eventually and finish the job. --=20 May the LORD God bless you exceedingly abundantly! Dave_Craig______________________________________________ "So the universe is not quite as you thought it was. You'd better rearrange your beliefs, then. Because you certainly can't rearrange the universe." __--from_Nightfall_by_Asimov/Silverberg_________________ --X1bOJ3K7DJ5YkBrT Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEETMVNFO0+WcP+ddQoFX4iU34ShUAFAl3avzAACgkQFX4iU34S hUAsfw//Y2dFUwjai47/Inug6R5GjnmwiIV3Epidr9Ej3juFZdsT0DXEfN8yywTD oN/PFPp+km0nLJtx2BC35lqtIBamXKEvGwqaNobojjy2R/fKCUFFZ87T5DrPxZr2 RsJiqa67sBx3+dvb1EcpUl2cL4hCstZRsUGoP4n09WQTBwFhc7H81hYqsS5uj0hO E09L7GV6xT2B1SSStad/BGsQa+CY6RtsD2xeWhEynjTC+Myc3oxy7BtUkh5Zpmx3 6qrsEJdqUms6fXmG5YClvgS1kg8g42U/Q8y5juft5tvbUeRQWQse2/XX+3UEN8gA cWbIvvoiVS/Qz1Pg7cLvlap/MZlzGalQKfPYbcSM5bOaNiKN00drVscYgnuspBd9 9xqeXvoyX81T5gRXyZXrPvOxDn3fYS4Sv8J9g1gt6mpItD7wkCs15uKCME9jBbdJ MT+LYaPUw4XrrtIICERMRVt+6SJPVqhbyDr4sRUw/uWtNb3Out4nAtRATcBFEgXe YdVgrt3Sowq7IJDfCqtLTn+H6VPeaL0VQn5M8KhCEcbkibzwzk9f+o+deqxDEQLM mmXxSFsJ0XUCk1YltnDEsbCH5tWI2hUndRQyi9p3hUp5oE/qsGU7U3F51A6wvGw9 399XgiSwpurMSxTmquc2uCZH7MiJGqeungMwVudnqcS95Q+GFuM= =FuiI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --X1bOJ3K7DJ5YkBrT-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A96F7A38EAF for <9fans@9fans.net>; 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(gdb@dbsystems.com@47.184.216.224) by 0 with ESMTPA; 24 Nov 2019 18:37:55 -0000 From: David Butler Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_0AA7E370-F973-41D4-A9D5-D4412FA1C249" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3601.0.10\)) Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2019 12:37:54 -0600 References: <0074AD32FE84CB7602D40AEE206BCCD9@eigenstate.org> To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <8278932D-EB4D-400C-A280-8C80520FF9C7@dbsystems.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3601.0.10) Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 8cf20808-0ee9-11ea-89a4-983c5afc5d53 --Apple-Mail=_0AA7E370-F973-41D4-A9D5-D4412FA1C249 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 9fans, First let me agree that 9legacy.org is the best = destination for this thread, is there a living =E2=80=9Cvanilla" Plan9. = And by =E2=80=9Cvanilla=E2=80=9D I=E2=80=99m talking about what was = released and maintained by AT&T / Lucent / Alcatel, to the end, on = January 2015. I applaud the strategy of separating the patches from the = base code because it help clarify license issues. It leaves it to the = user of the code to resolve each patch=E2=80=99s ownership, accepting = those you can get reasonable license terms from and rejecting those that = you can=E2=80=99t. Look at the very last paragraph of = http://www.9legacy.org/patch.html . = David du Colombier explicitly provides a license for his patches. But = leaves all other submissions to the author. For example, I don=E2=80=99t = see a similar grant from another frequent patch supplier, Erik = Quanstrom. For interesting complexities, look at patch = http://www.9legacy.org/9legacy/patch/upas-nfs-p9p.diff = . It was = supplied by Russ Cox that says =E2=80=9CThis port is the work of David = du Colombier with contributions from Justin Bedo.=E2=80=9D What is the = license grant? As you can imagine, so goes every other Plan9 based code. As a result, = none of them are a good place to start, nor continue. I won=E2=80=99t = bore you with the details of my attempt to get reasonable license terms = (you can research the 9fans messages from many years ago), but corporate = lawyers kill great software. The situation was finally resolved in February 2014 when The University = of California, Berkeley received permission to release Plan9 under = GPLv2. (http://akaros.cs.berkeley.edu/akaros-web/news.php = ). =46rom that page = you can download the distribution here = or clone it from the = git repo . Dislike GPL all you like, but = it provides one, very fundamental, feature lacking in almost every other = =E2=80=9Cfree=E2=80=9D software license. The license is in force by = reading. There is no chase to figure out if a patch submitter granted a = compatible license. Or even if they have the right to! (You may be = surprised what you have to get your corporate employer to agree to in = this regard.) So, IMHO, all future work on Plan9 should be applied to the GPLv2 = release. Yes, orphaning all other Plan9 progress. They are only good for = hobby use. If you ever want to use Plan9 for profit, it better be based = on the GPLv2 code. David Butler > On Nov 24, 2019, at 11:07 AM, David du Colombier <0intro@gmail.com> = wrote: >=20 >> Actually, you know what, I should put my money >> where my mouth is. Would there be objections to >> me going through and fixing the links in the >> wiki so they point to 9p.io? >=20 > This is a good idea. Let me know how do you want to proceed. >=20 >> Is there anyone who would be comfortable explaining >> to me exactly the relationship between 9p.io and >> 9legacy, as well as how people are expected to use >> the two, so that I can put that into the wiki? >=20 > 9p.io is a mirror of the former Bell Labs website. >=20 > We're still accepting patches and people can > update their contrib directory. However, the > rest is mostly read-only. >=20 > 9legacy is the latest Plan 9 from Bell Labs sources > (2015-01-10) with addition of a few hundreds patches. > It's regularly updated. >=20 >> Is there anywhere that people would be comfortable >> blessing as a source for building new ISO images, >> to put behind the download link, with the accepted >> patches integrated? >=20 > That's mostly what 9legacy is. >=20 > --=20 > David du Colombier >=20 > ------------------------------------------ > 9fans: 9fans > Permalink: = https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T755e5f03f61e4ad9-M6e903bff791067b= bb961033c > Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription --Apple-Mail=_0AA7E370-F973-41D4-A9D5-D4412FA1C249 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 9fans,

First let me agree that 9legacy.org is the best destination for this thread, = is there a living =E2=80=9Cvanilla" Plan9. And by =E2=80=9Cvanilla=E2=80=9D= I=E2=80=99m talking about what was released and maintained by AT&T = / Lucent / Alcatel, to the end, on January 2015. I applaud the strategy = of separating the patches from the base code because it help clarify = license issues. It leaves it to the user of the code to resolve each = patch=E2=80=99s ownership, accepting those you can get reasonable = license terms from and rejecting those that you can=E2=80=99t. Look at = the very last paragraph of http://www.9legacy.org/patch.html. David du Colombier = explicitly provides a license for his patches. But leaves all other = submissions to the author. For example, I don=E2=80=99t see a similar = grant from another frequent patch supplier, Erik Quanstrom. For = interesting complexities, look at patch http://www.9legacy.org/9legacy/patch/upas-nfs-p9p.diff. = It was supplied by Russ Cox that says =E2=80=9CThis port is the work of = David du Colombier with contributions from Justin Bedo.=E2=80=9D What is = the license grant?

As you can imagine, so goes every other Plan9 based code. As = a result, none of them are a good place to start, nor continue. I = won=E2=80=99t bore you with the details of my attempt to get reasonable = license terms (you can research the 9fans messages from many years ago), = but corporate lawyers kill great software.

The situation was finally resolved in = February 2014 when The University of California, Berkeley received = permission to release Plan9 under GPLv2. (http://akaros.cs.berkeley.edu/akaros-web/news.php). =46rom = that page you can download the distribution here or clone it from the git repo. Dislike = GPL all you like, but it provides one, very fundamental, feature lacking = in almost every other =E2=80=9Cfree=E2=80=9D software license. The = license is in force by reading. There is no chase to figure out if a = patch submitter granted a compatible license. Or even if they have the = right to! (You may be surprised what you have to get your corporate = employer to agree to in this regard.)

So, IMHO, all future work on Plan9 = should be applied to the GPLv2 release. Yes, orphaning all other Plan9 = progress. They are only good for hobby use. If you ever want to use = Plan9 for profit, it better be based on the GPLv2 code.

David Butler

On Nov 24, 2019, at 11:07 AM, = David du Colombier <0intro@gmail.com> wrote:

Actually, you know what, = I should put my money
where my mouth is. Would there be = objections to
me going through and fixing the links in = the
wiki so they point to 9p.io?

This is = a good idea. Let me know how do you want to proceed.

Is there anyone who = would be comfortable explaining
to me exactly the = relationship between 9p.io = and
9legacy, as well as how people are expected to use
the two, so that I can put that into the wiki?

9p.io is a mirror of the former Bell Labs website.

We're still accepting patches and people = can
update their contrib directory. However, the
rest is mostly read-only.

9legacy = is the latest Plan 9 from Bell Labs sources
(2015-01-10) = with addition of a few hundreds patches.
It's regularly = updated.

Is there anywhere that people would be comfortable
blessing as a source for building new ISO images,
to put behind the download link, with the accepted
patches integrated?

That's mostly what 9legacy is.

-- =
David du Colombier

------------------------------------------
9fans:= 9fans
Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T755e5f03f61e4ad9-M6e90= 3bff791067bbb961033c
Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription

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(216.9.110.2 [216.9.110.2]) by eigenstate.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id 0aa63af1 (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256:NO); Sun, 24 Nov 2019 12:32:36 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2019 12:32:35 -0800 From: Ori Bernstein To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Cc: Lucio De Re Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Message-Id: <20191124123235.a29ba3f7a14a69365c377ecf@eigenstate.org> In-Reply-To: References: <83054678AC38490907D956243528B1D4@ewsd.inri.net> <2566f3964ef2455c38c1576b7f68fc45@hamnavoe.com> <20191123201701.GA14389@wopr> <20191123202735.GB14389@wopr> <20191124020302.GA70376@wopr> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; x86_64-unknown-openbsd6.6) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 91747cac-0ef9-11ea-8062-8e518bb16757 On Sun, 24 Nov 2019 08:34:32 +0200, Lucio De Re wrote: > We just got a mouthful from sl and you about the lack of explanation > for the state of the various plan 9 "distributions". It all smacks of > expecting Da Vinci to update the Mona Lisa because somebody would > prefer a high-rise landscape in the background and because someone > actually did photoshop the Mona Lisa in that guise, but was not > accepted as the most significant contributor to the painting. I'm not sure that analogy serves the purpose intended. The Mona Lisa is something sitting in a museum for people to gawk at a bit before getting on with their day to day business, using tools that they either adapt to their needs, or replace with ones that are already suitable. -- Ori Bernstein From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 397F6A40229 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 18:40:45 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from fshahriar@gmail.com) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 07B1592819F; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 18:40:45 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574638845; b=sz6nKmLWzzYwwDloVBjac1JUb1As94t35jTpqftjQUTT7Wbjer KVTi9uYw4PluSsnT+m1gmTug95q7kOHq8HoPkM6NiIv7IoXd4HlshD5Xb0WnbNzt n4AFDpJA3KNhMD89B5CQMHav87irvk67kDqGBkq4F7hUxBLnov0w711hkGcQcPoU LuEI1hP30t127rCzyGeMv9jqgJk4mzQivNsjrCzuwQ3g+rVN/6WoklCy+AzHJ4DT dL+KZcHwJKnKjKAvMRDz97OnDCR6+UXJE9G+mb1nvx3f23IhFIgTOGPsIqyxW5f1 6bC/bkFUpN/4EWy6Ap7zqrZChI2T5gholNQw== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; 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a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=lerubW5Qmny5lXyI1lAP3fGnhnOkc6uvglLYhCohxhE=; b=uE4F3F7an0ameAO9Rfd4yzuYxErtIUrYMG9O4S1u4lTVs5E7lEFD+vRLBDmN5yMVsw cVI2e5NwDWcZc6jjzLNAWCjDPavSuzLPNX42F12ujTbz4d6dbNiyLY/gwBlt9DyA62b0 8cBzdAA99UXcV1MpJvoO3awGXtoP0uzIw7xdLFbNRHBS6gFaqkcEDeHjBblnu1qdEDEM 7mA8vYJhcvHbfViYsldaWni4XXIKTtQeDRjHJL1TeBYq9iYJKmpsdcEOFQsVjSCRhru9 hBTnsKx6CyAJgPbofEIjbvxjKzD4eT6shSAkKLJrUOwG57VQ7iyGPedak9q3dFaoDLRP NxnQ== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUdl6njDsWoWDnWiuiU9qBIEN/aH1x5lhqitbmbPpB789C/bLqQ SiN/2EYsWSIKmF9dYqSKB0mCaUE0EyWztxwA7kfmqPCj X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwxwS3W5rlPPJXaHdzJGIXMhmA/pYCLYKCIhkT0CVuAxPBrqD7hKB2OpMm1A1z+eWeewGxkbm0w+SUK1obDp2c= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:7a93:: with SMTP id l19mr17648262otn.314.1574638844115; Sun, 24 Nov 2019 15:40:44 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Fazlul Shahriar Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2019 18:40:32 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Cc: 0intro@gmail.com Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000f401a70598202cee" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: d8eb7f08-0f13-11ea-ba2e-c3c3e1075d1a --000000000000f401a70598202cee Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Sun, Nov 24, 2019 at 12:32 PM wrote: > > This is a good idea. Let me know how do you want to proceed. > > I will be busy working on other systems until December, > but when I get back, I'll just make the chages to the > wiki. If it's not editable, I'll email a patch to the > 9fans list. The wiki seems to be editable. Run within acme: Local srv net!9p.io!wiki wiki /mnt/wiki Wiki /mnt/wiki/ I've updated few pages, include the mailing list page ( https://9p.io/wiki/plan9/mailing_lists/index.html) to link to 9fans Topicbox. All the man page links are broken, and this will require a change in wikifs(4). Links to bell-labs.com in the html files in /sys/lib/wiki also need to be updated. fhs --000000000000f401a70598202cee Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Sun, Nov 24, 2019 at 12:32 PM <ori@eigenstate.org> wrote:
> This is a good idea. Let me know how do you want to proceed.

I will be busy working on other systems until December,
but when I get back, I'll just make the chages to the
wiki. If it's not editable,=C2=A0 I'll email a patch to the
9fans list.

The wiki seems to be editable. = Run within acme:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Local srv net!9p.io!wiki wiki /mnt/wiki
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Wiki /mn= t/wiki/

I've updated few pages, include the mailing list page (<= a href=3D"https://9p.io/wiki/plan9/mailing_lists/index.html">https://9p.io/= wiki/plan9/mailing_lists/index.html) to link to 9fans Topicbox.
All the man page links are broken, and this will require a change in= wikifs(4). Links to bell-labs.com in = the html files in /sys/lib/wiki also need to be updated.

fhs
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To: Ori Bernstein Cc: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 44e837e4-0f34-11ea-920a-ef047a95c20e On 11/24/19, Ori Bernstein wrote: > On Sun, 24 Nov 2019 08:34:32 +0200, Lucio De Re > wrote: > >> We just got a mouthful from sl and you about the lack of explanation >> for the state of the various plan 9 "distributions". It all smacks of >> expecting Da Vinci to update the Mona Lisa because somebody would >> prefer a high-rise landscape in the background and because someone >> actually did photoshop the Mona Lisa in that guise, but was not >> accepted as the most significant contributor to the painting. > > I'm not sure that analogy serves the purpose intended. > > The Mona Lisa is something sitting in a museum for > people to gawk at a bit before getting on with their > day to day business, using tools that they either > adapt to their needs, or replace with ones that are > already suitable. > Having grown up in the country that spawned many Mona Lisa thieves, I simply disagree with your evaluation, Ori. That is no reflection of the worth of your contribution(s), just a cultural chasm between the two us. And having spent a week visiting Florence (sorry, can't resist first-hand anecdotes), I can see both your more pragmatic point of view and my own interest in archaeology. I would like to persuade you otherwise, but maybe that will happen to you without my help. Until then (a) I'll be happy but cautious to help you bring the ONE Plan 9 to term and will provide all resources at my disposal to do that and (b) will continue to ensure that the reasons and rationales for Plan 9 are not lost in the quest for Shiny New Features. 9p.io is a museum piece, I grant, let it stay. If the Mona Lisa or the Lamborghini Miura or some similar monuments to human creativity do not appeal to you, let me appeal to you on behalf of those who feel like me, so that you do not contribute to their destruction. In my opinion and my philosophy, without history there is no future. I can see how that may seem pointless to some, at least for a time. Lucio. 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To: Ori Bernstein Cc: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 4b51f7ec-0f38-11ea-a11b-8ba92eec93c7 BTW, I miss SSH a lot more often than I miss a browser when using legacy Plan 9. It keeps being what I would port from 9front immediately if I simply had the skills, the time and the persistence. There are one or two more things that may only pop up once caffeine has had its impact on my rather slow brain. I am very extremely grateful for 9legacy, even though I don't really understand what is and what is not possible using it, so I stick to my own modified version of Plan 9 which occasionally leaps from one antiquated host to anotherless antiquated one and were I at total leisure, my dream would be of threading into that, in a repeatable experiment, all the useful imported beads (from 9legacy, 9front and 9atom, more or less in that priority sequence) that I would deem appropriate for 2019 and the future. But there are many directions to take and only one that this mailing list's membership would find it convenient to support. Such a standard (that I had recently named 9heritage in my personal notes) will need a lot of contributing by people who are willing to collaborate where they are instead tempted to compete, to follow when they instead wish to lead. Keep in mind that I live in a country that has unofficially declared my kind "colonials of a special kind" to pamper to a majority that is split in nine cultural groups (plus a few less despised minorities) whose resentment towards whites is their only binding force. I have personal experience of where competing interests lead and of how hard it is to promote common interests in their place. Plan 9 right now is in a similar place, mostly through a similar lack of respected leadership, if my political opinion is to be trusted. Lucio. PS: Is Ori's Git and a plethora of "git forks" (I see that Git itselfs calls them "heads", how appropriate!) the way to go? I can see some merit in stripping Labs' system down to the bone and fleshing it up from the bottom (or is that the top) with the best the community has already contributed. In 24 years, this has not happened, what is most likely to do it today? PPS: I think it was Hiro that contrary to expectations sang the praise of Richard's Raspberry PI developments and opened one more interesting door for me. It is precisely these pearls (both Hiro's and Richard's) that keep me a perhaps undeserving 9fan. On 11/25/19, Lucio De Re wrote: > On 11/24/19, Ori Bernstein wrote: >> On Sun, 24 Nov 2019 08:34:32 +0200, Lucio De Re >> wrote: >> >>> We just got a mouthful from sl and you about the lack of explanation >>> for the state of the various plan 9 "distributions". It all smacks of >>> expecting Da Vinci to update the Mona Lisa because somebody would >>> prefer a high-rise landscape in the background and because someone >>> actually did photoshop the Mona Lisa in that guise, but was not >>> accepted as the most significant contributor to the painting. >> >> I'm not sure that analogy serves the purpose intended. >> >> The Mona Lisa is something sitting in a museum for >> people to gawk at a bit before getting on with their >> day to day business, using tools that they either >> adapt to their needs, or replace with ones that are >> already suitable. >> > Having grown up in the country that spawned many Mona Lisa thieves, I > simply disagree with your evaluation, Ori. That is no reflection of > the worth of your contribution(s), just a cultural chasm between the > two us. > > And having spent a week visiting Florence (sorry, can't resist > first-hand anecdotes), I can see both your more pragmatic point of > view and my own interest in archaeology. I would like to persuade you > otherwise, but maybe that will happen to you without my help. > > Until then (a) I'll be happy but cautious to help you bring the ONE > Plan 9 to term and will provide all resources at my disposal to do > that and (b) will continue to ensure that the reasons and rationales > for Plan 9 are not lost in the quest for Shiny New Features. > > 9p.io is a museum piece, I grant, let it stay. If the Mona Lisa or the > Lamborghini Miura or some similar monuments to human creativity do not > appeal to you, let me appeal to you on behalf of those who feel like > me, so that you do not contribute to their destruction. > > In my opinion and my philosophy, without history there is no future. I > can see how that may seem pointless to some, at least for a time. > > Lucio. > -- Lucio De Re 2 Piet Retief St Kestell (Eastern Free State) 9860 South Africa Ph.: +27 71 471 3694 Cell: +27 83 251 5824 From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14808B5024E for <9fans@9fans.net>; Mon, 25 Nov 2019 02:52:53 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from miller@hamnavoe.com) Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 2D03F9B5DFF; Mon, 25 Nov 2019 02:52:53 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574668373; b=IlP9wJC3vTozoZ4ZEIlMs3R39bUxZESKn+BLYVYtMcP9YEjyRZ QpKJ5tYanggojRuEPIzHwz4pwRaHJMQHR4D/ZwAurgSmi8k806L3uQA1RbVceYzn KmzW0dFfjaTGFBxe3dYpTV/PSKKjU5uljUgjdfFieAELBWTtQzhFabrSudKW6VZQ U9TssDLUyRBfAYrQ5jh0QDtiQgJZmHYauE3Y3PiTWuBGipqd8fRCZYnT+WKfzcXU KQ5CiqWvWIX66LBfXJj6qszeO5ue1sVkVdDOn4YMmYNBBO+qX6eGtECvUbWkMJ9V OiKRXNyGzbuvFPWHGBalJ/y1q4BEmARim+uQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; 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From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2019 07:52:44 +0000 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BlackCat-Spam-Score: 12 X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.2 Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 9858913e-0f58-11ea-a65d-80c20b89d6f3 Lucio - > BTW, I miss SSH a lot more often than I miss a browser when using > legacy Plan 9. Do you mean using Plan 9 as a ssh server, or client? I haven't tried server mode lately, but I use it often as a client with current linux and mac hosts with no trouble. Have you applied the 2018 patches from the 9p.io "museum"? If you have done that and ssh client doesn't work for you, you might simply need to adjust the sshd configuration on your host (if it's under your control) to allow an encryption algorithm that Plan 9 supports. Get in touch off list after Thursday when I get home from Vienna -- since we're showing off our connections to cities of High European Culture :) -- and I'll see if we can sort it out. 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From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2019 08:39:36 +0000 In-Reply-To: <0074AD32FE84CB7602D40AEE206BCCD9@eigenstate.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BlackCat-Spam-Score: 12 X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.2 Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 2d9859fe-0f5f-11ea-b8b6-8cd6e06a2c2b >> cpu% srv -n 9p.io sources /n/sources > > Usually, that's not what people mean when they > say 'site'. Oh, well https://9p.io/sources/patch is another way in, as I expect you know. This is a plan 9 mailing list so it seemed more natural for me to describe things in plan 9 terms, sorry. I can't speak in general for "people", but this grizzled old plan 9 user thinks of a plan 9 site as something to connect to with 9p. 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[66.111.4.227]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a66sm3029026qkb.27.2019.11.25.00.48.18 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 25 Nov 2019 00:48:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from compute3.internal (compute3.nyi.internal [10.202.2.43]) by mailauth.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCD2222AFA; Mon, 25 Nov 2019 03:48:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from imap24 ([10.202.2.74]) by compute3.internal (MEProxy); Mon, 25 Nov 2019 03:48:17 -0500 X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudeitddgieefucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfqfgfvpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgen uceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucesvcftvggtihhpihgvnhhtshculddquddttddmne cujfgurhepofgfggfkjghffffhvffutgesthdtredtreertdenucfhrhhomhepfdffrghv ihguucguuhcuveholhhomhgsihgvrhdfuceotdhinhhtrhhosehgmhgrihhlrdgtohhmqe enucffohhmrghinhepsggvlhhlqdhlrggsshdrtghomhenucfrrghrrghmpehmrghilhhf rhhomhepughjtgdomhgvshhmthhprghuthhhphgvrhhsohhnrghlihhthidqkeehkeeiud duhedvqdduledutdehjeehvddqtdhinhhtrhhopeepghhmrghilhdrtghomhessghithgs rdhlthenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedt X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id 2AC5F2000A3; Mon, 25 Nov 2019 03:48:17 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.1.7-578-g826f590-fmstable-20191119v1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <18b3cf13-2034-413e-9212-73619686eee2@www.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: References: Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2019 09:47:56 +0100 From: "David du Colombier" <0intro@gmail.com> To: "Fazlul Shahriar" , 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Content-Type: text/plain Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 57872d7a-0f60-11ea-b572-c3ffb88119d9 > All the man page links are broken, and this will require a change in > wikifs(4). Links to bell-labs.com in the html files in /sys/lib/wiki > also need to be updated. Thanks. I've fixed the remaining issues. -- David du Colombier From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C27EA85A63 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Mon, 25 Nov 2019 18:42:03 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from sstallion@gmail.com) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 7FCFB0BFCDA; Mon, 25 Nov 2019 18:42:03 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574725323; b=HNuvvMeKopPJVy+pv8d4FZ598nFIK/QVtn7H2B629H6jsOyVMN Pw0De3vsVTHst5iz748INNdB1/xPOYUC58Vlbq9oU6ekRLmVRFKb11Zi5fTyTLdO jqgo6RPa8RqwzJCG69WvHUrSmumqV524NbrLyuRKU4cLF3iv7AECv6kbVV0VdTd2 VQtSjaanhItTlg6SRPIvb5Epuw8xw64D4epp+wEhFF/YJZkA46TIfu6q81qioBI+ UsNWKnJxzEUNb73t4pmYqo3GjOg0J1PSFl8MOa2N43tbwWgxRs6oZKzCRdDC66IZ 1HyTSAlNQ0/+5jmpsvLp3pu9C3165BnBztWA== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type; 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To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Cc: Fazlul Shahriar Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 3442b2da-0fdd-11ea-a43b-dfe6d8372d0c On Mon, Nov 25, 2019 at 2:49 AM David du Colombier <0intro@gmail.com> wrote: > > Thanks. I've fixed the remaining issues. For the most part, I'm glad for the thread. At the very least it convinced me to pull my fileserver out of cold storage last night and bring a couple of CPU servers back online. I'm hoping over the holiday I'll have some time to move over to 9p.io and submit patches for any outstanding diffs. I know I have a few that have been collecting dust, namely IPMI support for KCS-style BMCs and a basic collectd agent that should probably be rewritten in Go. I also have a partial kernel port to the Samsung Exynos I started 5-6 years ago. Out of curiosity, what's the process for reclaiming your contrib directory on 9p.io? I'm happy to spend some time working on polishing the wiki as well. Cheers, Steve From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82641A8EA2A for <9fans@9fans.net>; Tue, 26 Nov 2019 02:05:04 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from 0intro@gmail.com) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id A6A5E6BD6AC; Tue, 26 Nov 2019 02:05:04 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574751904; b=PzU9TL7y9hoMH+65/XsTx1GioHjM+QYLgPR6QMYvisYdaS/tHV bn/xU30tWm6jpnoNojXrSa7Iw2/GxejiOQ9IIJmYMM4dStuCpE3mQGhfxs4FEaXw MS8U8WzF9WQRHOLKez/x64kXnltQfqukROmDyCUZo4HWmieBC5X6eq3IdWaLpA5L AIo5uNl+4KFHHIvmtljbDu2JxiF8CzaA12fQova2IBp2vZI4s1hoWJhe/L1saTqr zGhAmP+XTgL/FcCkOyfrZZtAhRExeBsOj7FXNMkQ9vZpCVS3D8r28Ykl+7zoSkdd BGhhvoVOcQsfr7vEwNAg0Gun5rhnAR6O2swg== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=mime-version:message-id:in-reply-to:references :date:from:to:subject:content-type; 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[66.111.4.227]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id o33sm5481502qta.27.2019.11.25.23.05.01 for <9fans@9fans.net> (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 25 Nov 2019 23:05:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from compute3.internal (compute3.nyi.internal [10.202.2.43]) by mailauth.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03401227D6 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Tue, 26 Nov 2019 02:05:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from imap24 ([10.202.2.74]) by compute3.internal (MEProxy); Tue, 26 Nov 2019 02:05:01 -0500 X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudeivddguddtfecutefuodetggdotefrod ftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfgh necuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepofgfggfkjghffffhvffutgesth dtredtreertdenucfhrhhomhepfdffrghvihguucguuhcuveholhhomhgsihgvrhdfuceo tdhinhhtrhhosehgmhgrihhlrdgtohhmqeenucffohhmrghinheplehprdhiohenucfrrg hrrghmpehmrghilhhfrhhomhepughjtgdomhgvshhmthhprghuthhhphgvrhhsohhnrghl ihhthidqkeehkeeiudduhedvqdduledutdehjeehvddqtdhinhhtrhhopeepghhmrghilh drtghomhessghithgsrdhlthenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedt X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id 32B7E2000A3; Tue, 26 Nov 2019 02:05:00 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.1.7-578-g826f590-fmstable-20191119v1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <18b3cf13-2034-413e-9212-73619686eee2@www.fastmail.com> Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2019 08:04:39 +0100 From: "David du Colombier" <0intro@gmail.com> To: 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Content-Type: text/plain Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 16d6151e-101b-11ea-ac14-be502e09680d > Out of curiosity, what's the process for reclaiming your contrib > directory on 9p.io? I'm happy to spend some time working on polishing > the wiki as well. 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Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2019 18:46:37 +0900 From: kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp In-Reply-To: 9d9b976991d9012ff262455de18d6f68@hamnavoe.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: ab71d4a4-1031-11ea-8075-f83a45e3eac9 > Current raspberry pi kernel source is on 9p.io in /sources/contrib/miller/9/bcm Hi, Richard. I'm now working to make your ether4330.c to work on 9front system, which is now my base sysytem. Your current source can work with wpa2/psk? I tried your 2018 version, but failed. Kenji From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1196BA9111 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Tue, 26 Nov 2019 09:49:25 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from miller@hamnavoe.com) Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id BFB47808671; Tue, 26 Nov 2019 09:49:25 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574779765; b=RydRhP8Zvenw9PVcay41He1EI8gzE2L6/njRGQXMA2yzwbEj4s 4zq6OiesV5lXAm3LXDVsmxoDBylRLukarXyqRghzlEEAd5BaVNr5FgJeeNUshbNO CJEFhumTfkt5Qf03GL7U0Sp0LQurZL0v7NFXJm72LQsNiLxUa76eijeGxg6Ttxsz l/GQj9MHcmgudAeDVVv9koU2ibFaLrUAOES/6yhk5kQpA2IXdcmCGvOiMaXjNkpb jov/0pSj3GoUgJACaGkOmbiW1pecF8EDDiAA1eZhhTJ39AMteQKQzDJ5jRL0D5pv 9mzu2IbwPqtOrhaX9JtpRtdmq1FRk9HkP5CA== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=message-id:to:subject:from:date:in-reply-to :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=arcseal; t=1574779765; bh=ym9EMCKn+qMDI8N5NmOREw3dzy92g/HJ8lDwXzOEEpI=; b= hIr06mRGmuMDdIe8Ea1FL75UuoVi1KD9NYdwJi7KIl6A00R3t/2TA7aU/Du1/aHy CpgtmWjA6ecbyOAeE02thVY/49etrYuSCwXFUqH4/OMAEthTBgRi7CnDRxWuS5+a jDeLC3POcdvNasLAPVpHs8ZFk1Ar+fU2weoc9nyjMhk290IxQSff3tpKP0aG9CEi DErt4/zsNsCSXEaSeAv+tEWlPyVYBVOGeIZKsoH3L6dXpnmNViI2BFdcLq5HwQ+H 9ouGMZmR1ma0ksDcrr/Wg+TJFhzVvxj7I2x7oXEaU+GNeaAHo7SfAy0NNrfkCABR Qi6Qbh+/MeFaZfbI/dV7vA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tb-mx0.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=hamnavoe.com; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=46.235.227.24 (balrog.mythic-beasts.com); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=miller@hamnavoe.com smtp.helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; x-aligned-from=domain_pass (Domain match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com policy.ptr=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=hamnavoe.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=hamnavoe.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 Authentication-Results: tb-mx0.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=hamnavoe.com; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=46.235.227.24 (balrog.mythic-beasts.com); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=miller@hamnavoe.com smtp.helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; x-aligned-from=domain_pass (Domain match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com policy.ptr=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=hamnavoe.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=hamnavoe.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudeifedgieelucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdggtfgfnhhsuhgsshgtrhhisggvpdfu rfetoffkrfgpnffqhgenuceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpefkvffuhf ffjgggtgfgsehtjehjtddttddvnecuhfhrohhmpeftihgthhgrrhguucfoihhllhgvrhcu oeelfhgrnhhssehhrghmnhgrvhhovgdrtghomheqnecukfhppeegiedrvdefhedrvddvje drvdegpdekkedrleejrddvjedrkeefnecurfgrrhgrmhepihhnvghtpeegiedrvdefhedr vddvjedrvdegpdhhvghlohepsggrlhhrohhgrdhmhihthhhitgdqsggvrghsthhsrdgtoh hmpdhmrghilhhfrhhomhepoehmihhllhgvrheshhgrmhhnrghvohgvrdgtohhmqecuuffk kgfgpeduleelfeenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedt X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (hamnavoe.com: Sender is authorized to use 'miller@hamnavoe.com' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'include:_spf.mythic-beasts.com' matched)) receiver=tb-mx0.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="miller@hamnavoe.com"; helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; client-ip=46.235.227.24 Received: from balrog.mythic-beasts.com (balrog.mythic-beasts.com [46.235.227.24]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Tue, 26 Nov 2019 09:49:24 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from miller@hamnavoe.com) Received: from [88.97.27.83] (port=65124 helo=zen.hamnavoe.com) by balrog.mythic-beasts.com with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_3DES_EDE_CBC_SHA1:192) (Exim 4.92.3) (envelope-from ) id 1iZc9X-0001Uf-St for 9fans@9fans.net; Tue, 26 Nov 2019 14:49:24 +0000 Message-ID: <5ed6982d452fccf747b6db751a136f8f@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2019 14:49:17 +0000 In-Reply-To: <08995824A82CC0C4160EE97DBC62B071@hera.eonet.ne.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BlackCat-Spam-Score: 12 X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.2 Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: f3939338-105b-11ea-8d6b-8f7e15dda5c7 > Hi, Richard. Konnichi wa Okamoto san, > Your current source can work with wpa2/psk? Yes, it does with my two routers (buffalo n300 and fritz!box). I haven't tested it with anything else. Please let me know if it works for you now. 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spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp smtp.helo=cmo-0001.xspmail.jp; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=cmo-0001.xspmail.jp policy.ptr=cmo-0001.xspmail.jp; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudeigedgtdehucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdggtfgfnhhsuhgsshgtrhhisggvpdfu rfetoffkrfgpnffqhgenuceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpefkvffuff fhjgggtgfgsehtjeejtddttddvnecuhfhrohhmpehkohhkrghmohhtoheshhgvrhgrrdgv ohhnvghtrdhnvgdrjhhpnecukfhppedvtddvrddvfeekrdduleekrdduieelpddukedtrd dugeeirdefuddrvdehudenucfrrghrrghmpehinhgvthepvddtvddrvdefkedrudelkedr udeiledphhgvlhhopegtmhhoqddttddtuddrgihsphhmrghilhdrjhhppdhmrghilhhfrh homhepoehkohhkrghmohhtoheshhgvrhgrrdgvohhnvghtrdhnvgdrjhhpqecuuffkkgfg pedvvddvvdenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedt X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (hera.eonet.ne.jp: Sender is authorized to use 'kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'include:_mailspf.eonet.ne.jp' matched)) receiver=tb-mx0.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp"; helo=cmo-0001.xspmail.jp; client-ip=202.238.198.169 Received: from cmo-0001.xspmail.jp (cmo-0001.xspmail.jp [202.238.198.169]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Tue, 26 Nov 2019 18:02:55 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp) Received: from cmr-0000.xspmail.jp ([202.238.198.117]) by cmo with ESMTP id ZjmbiQXY7ajWUZjrBi47r1; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 08:02:53 +0900 Received: from pi3L.jitaku.localdomain ([180.146.31.251]) by cmr with ESMTPA id ZjrBiR9zQ3Zb2ZjrBijvf5; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 08:02:53 +0900 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hera.eonet.ne.jp; s=x01; t=1574809373; i=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp; bh=NBfm9YfZ6TUpC3mmkmXji5IizClCL5IsEf5dOwTxpUA=; h=To:Subject:Date:From:In-Reply-To; b=P+mz6aFnaZdybaQrJvtmzm9SsJ3eOMpX175p4DQb5BqWxZnpw+QgyoPrB/nRDdBeZ W35ONfPOuAdCwRpfvEZMrSe2YnPRxc6wFkdcY6Ah8px+A7ckeCskSF2q952jfIL06e bsRyVY7r5beTxTXznKpWDFQNtgPGOjbTPD4xtRTsE7sHVsf2Hrt+WF7FAfcYSBbwWL 4f9CwK8BqMG9UF8ro6FwUIAn1QhjNiD7yFcVxHXVfSvLrkourHf+6kNg48x6g0LpR+ ASEBL4EyjnDdxbs4n8OES88s9Tmcr6IQjs1WURluozGlWtCKRw0hcBQz4F+cdV3Gd0 fbdoXSufpPGHA== Message-ID: <18E311E8F13C5A43E5B81B16963BC6D9@hera.eonet.ne.jp> To: 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2019 08:02:51 +0900 From: kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp In-Reply-To: 5ed6982d452fccf747b6db751a136f8f@hamnavoe.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: e731e550-10a0-11ea-a897-aeb29d4cd66e Thank you very much Richard san. > Yes, it does with my two routers (buffalo n300 and fritz!box). I'm using NEC WARPSTAR WR8170N router, and got the error like: I compiled 9pi3wifi by using your pi3wifi definition file. Plan9 from Bell Labs board rev: 0xa02082 firmware rev: 1521643642 cpu0: 1200MHz ARM Cortex-A53 r0p4 ... #l1: 4330: 10Mbps port 0x0 itq -1: 000000000000 998M memory: 202M kernel data, 795M user, 3780M swap ... ether4330: chip 43430 rev 1 type 1 ether4330: firmware ready ether4330: addr ... user[none]: sys ether4330: [?] error status 23 flags 0x1 reason 0 event: 10 18 00 01 00 02 00 00 00 00 00 17 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 03 00 00 00 00 00 3a 9d 2b b6 51 77 6c 30 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 event: 10 18 00 01 00 02 00 00 00 00 00 17 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 03 00 00 00 00 34 3d c4 ee 1e 68 77 6c 30 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 Kenji From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C66B9BE5926 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 03:09:27 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from miller@hamnavoe.com) Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 7559E2664B4; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 03:09:27 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574842167; b=DSYqHw81FzHO/cKzLsSp368y1VJ8SzvNSWYxy6pnGGwpxIepFz pQXsISGcZGSht6Al+XCj2WfHFZGNr5c+D5nrT85T67xQF2cRC9bj0LxzzMByqb7s +EU9FRRTtj7fQA2iLy3L5BG9oG5DczMOP9RKWkxFx3u/Cg2yTQHdDGvOw9Sqnlgx MjQektObNHE3Vfu3YEcAiZ+TqpQy7/jqzj/cyRm/tJzUNuLmiuWu5jZYrWSsFAMe GWBl7OyE7uGnPI0xSuJNMKnOloPkoScIZfp9qZEVwjZMe5dIVAGeOsYWqoGnfbOn +e6OPTinZV740gaF/6lySkbkzHVoE820ntrg== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=message-id:to:subject:from:date:in-reply-to :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=arcseal; t=1574842167; bh=nCQH4d829GyIZFwt3yMzjzDV9krJHfFjCQAlQuysjJQ=; b= d9H9Cx50o/Ini9baCmbTY5F3cAQLqMXLtT0KyA08hPPHnK0+S7NorbqkBeJGG+da nwfCx5QbxE61OAC8p5Bx/pRoviJL5UWKL8Y5wp7kmLoGg5cM867jMH2MAtu3Uv6f Jpj/90g5Mz6FbkgUU6mARem4O3zu+2lAQBBzQOSqMOOs0CD5gh6+Fjxe25YidHfJ F170oSwL5YyK0x0AIREkH9y1VNICUDjj0Hb18lFtS2aqOv1F18yFyHfU6jGEPpc7 v7RH0YBQAdMeHdViLQCBqL634aT2PI2bodlMAtz/XlTmAHU2DH6ElfnXOiXJk4x9 Ftzc6SxUyMcbHjcrd10GWA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tb-mx0.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=hamnavoe.com; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=46.235.227.24 (balrog.mythic-beasts.com); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=miller@hamnavoe.com smtp.helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; x-aligned-from=domain_pass (Domain match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com policy.ptr=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=hamnavoe.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=hamnavoe.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 Authentication-Results: tb-mx0.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=hamnavoe.com; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=46.235.227.24 (balrog.mythic-beasts.com); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=miller@hamnavoe.com smtp.helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; x-aligned-from=domain_pass (Domain match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com policy.ptr=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=hamnavoe.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=hamnavoe.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudeigedgudduiecutefuodetggdotefrod ftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpggftfghnshhusghstghrihgsvgdp uffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepkffvuf fhffgjgggtgfesthejjhdttddtvdenucfhrhhomheptfhitghhrghrugcuofhilhhlvghr uceolehfrghnsheshhgrmhhnrghvohgvrdgtohhmqeenucfkphepgeeirddvfeehrddvvd ejrddvgedpkeekrdeljedrvdejrdekfeenucfrrghrrghmpehinhgvthepgeeirddvfeeh rddvvdejrddvgedphhgvlhhopegsrghlrhhoghdrmhihthhhihgtqdgsvggrshhtshdrtg homhdpmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpeeomhhilhhlvghrsehhrghmnhgrvhhovgdrtghomhequcfu kfgkgfepudelheehnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptd X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (hamnavoe.com: Sender is authorized to use 'miller@hamnavoe.com' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'include:_spf.mythic-beasts.com' matched)) receiver=tb-mx0.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="miller@hamnavoe.com"; helo=balrog.mythic-beasts.com; client-ip=46.235.227.24 Received: from balrog.mythic-beasts.com (balrog.mythic-beasts.com [46.235.227.24]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 03:09:27 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from miller@hamnavoe.com) Received: from [88.97.27.83] (port=50051 helo=zen.hamnavoe.com) by balrog.mythic-beasts.com with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_3DES_EDE_CBC_SHA1:192) (Exim 4.92.3) (envelope-from ) id 1iZsO2-0006NQ-Eg for 9fans@9fans.net; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 08:09:26 +0000 Message-ID: <731b99334d6a3b3401f5e4ffccaf616d@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2019 08:09:20 +0000 In-Reply-To: <18E311E8F13C5A43E5B81B16963BC6D9@hera.eonet.ne.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BlackCat-Spam-Score: 12 X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.2 Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 3e220bfa-10ed-11ea-bae2-cf55944fb287 > I'm using NEC WARPSTAR WR8170N router, and got the error like: > I compiled 9pi3wifi by using your pi3wifi definition file. I'll look at this tomorrow when I'm back home. What's in your cmdline.txt? From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D7B2AE631F for <9fans@9fans.net>; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 04:44:29 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id BBA77222C56; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 04:44:29 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574847869; b=JDKMdJGzr9lI9KQQK7Z6UZtZUJbvMqKL2rfO4/XDOakKeAayCg ipZ7v9ZPpoERFoBSdhEcWIrnUOOKzQPn6H7yZSHjOQLwSilos2BFZJzPO0Zb+QaY r9yHVl692T33COkDAAggvPnJcCiqoDe5ISTg4gQp1kkKfny/2yveuW/zUxEDDBa7 FpXzQTiB8/6y+91H/vzTQ3/VMwBgrqX7OnCBxVTcIwcaGzPppkCsWoyji9n7LH0J zTfCu5FM/EfBE/9t2zvULq119MuMxa2zMnr3GDzeFNDDEPl+fO9+JmYN2fWXLm1Q IPDeElJNT64ih+xuIPHqyuBaNRXSjtNNNz6A== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=message-id:to:subject:date:from:in-reply-to :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=arcseal; t=1574847869; bh=48+EZyYkpMP7l0e93Fzn0zWyL94AjAXQGlA1gV4N+PA=; b= ktUUWNP8nSCLbgWvYTnX6DIiJYQjZkFSx8MGhNR1132mFTgydoZ6W0Nb0CzngGhN 3GnTklkNAgcsj69e/kWpwQV2Ih8lSdBOWE14nq/TCG8wTY6rIJyl4tNzNOaAN5FA /L916Dj+ZHhVMS01JKrpbSWj5oio7kGg0iUVvAg4nK/wqPYl6F2C7HJgY2WfBMGQ PB9zdD/Z3Pz62yYG/B/TOQdtkZoUFBUVg6BQ4aFN+xricu3j6Eoh1WBhsLApuO4U 9THRcrXMycA4tH8zLRWfgFbAColrM8mDV7cr+qaAfBKwdMFDxBeEET9ny5g+ZwNw ayye24bhMdSvUcz3SQYDBw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim-adsp=pass (ADSP policy from hera.eonet.ne.jp); dkim=pass (2048-bit rsa key sha256) header.d=hera.eonet.ne.jp header.i=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp header.b=iuAA43q7 header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=x01 x-bits=2048; dmarc=pass policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=hera.eonet.ne.jp; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=202.238.198.62 (cmo-0001.xspmail.jp); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp smtp.helo=cmo-0001.xspmail.jp; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=cmo-0001.xspmail.jp policy.ptr=cmo-0001.xspmail.jp; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 Authentication-Results: tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim-adsp=pass (ADSP policy from hera.eonet.ne.jp); dkim=pass (2048-bit rsa key sha256) header.d=hera.eonet.ne.jp header.i=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp header.b=iuAA43q7 header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=x01 x-bits=2048; dmarc=pass policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=hera.eonet.ne.jp; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=202.238.198.62 (cmo-0001.xspmail.jp); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp smtp.helo=cmo-0001.xspmail.jp; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=cmo-0001.xspmail.jp policy.ptr=cmo-0001.xspmail.jp; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudeihedgtdeiucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdggtfgfnhhsuhgsshgtrhhisggvpdfu rfetoffkrfgpnffqhgenuceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpefkvffuff fhjgggtgfgsehtjeejtddttddvnecuhfhrohhmpehkohhkrghmohhtoheshhgvrhgrrdgv ohhnvghtrdhnvgdrjhhpnecukfhppedvtddvrddvfeekrdduleekrdeivddpudektddrud egiedrfedurddvhedunecurfgrrhgrmhepihhnvghtpedvtddvrddvfeekrdduleekrdei vddphhgvlhhopegtmhhoqddttddtuddrgihsphhmrghilhdrjhhppdhmrghilhhfrhhomh epoehkohhkrghmohhtoheshhgvrhgrrdgvohhnvghtrdhnvgdrjhhpqecuuffkkgfgpedu gedtgeenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedt X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (hera.eonet.ne.jp: Sender is authorized to use 'kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'include:_mailspf.eonet.ne.jp' matched)) receiver=tb-mx1.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp"; helo=cmo-0001.xspmail.jp; client-ip=202.238.198.62 Received: from cmo-0001.xspmail.jp (cmo-0001.xspmail.jp [202.238.198.62]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 04:44:26 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp) Received: from cmr-0000.xspmail.jp ([202.238.198.117]) by cmo with ESMTP id ZtkniRLnCajWUZtrzi5Aqs; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 18:44:23 +0900 Received: from pi3L.jitaku.localdomain ([180.146.31.251]) by cmr with ESMTPA id ZtrziUJ343Zb2ZtrzimjDU; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 18:44:23 +0900 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hera.eonet.ne.jp; s=x01; t=1574847863; i=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp; bh=48+EZyYkpMP7l0e93Fzn0zWyL94AjAXQGlA1gV4N+PA=; h=To:Subject:Date:From:In-Reply-To; b=iuAA43q70XmFhQW0sYgjyskHMkOcqqx+MGQfUJvEAxDzNugQDisMlLb96fmOjMWl4 5mFFECwFEzm0QabRpRa/4GCuhOAXVCs4nja7+0zPjkDYmfsI2mN0qvfIDXDIwJWUMn 3ZNORHIxEJtDGudm7M2Tnc9x18w8CWIsNn/PC4exeqXFS1DH0r2Lr3xZ8vQiAcGtUX Eb6KvAPjCwcrZXIy0WwvNIVQ9BiF04tNbY39eRMAiVKM/hSCOHXd2RltkHuik6dMoc YoOj078aKiBrw5VWLpv1lHZKJdwhNHYmNbFOugEO/aROU6gkJjzj3eKJPITtBgm/rO EDtEJ/B2nxzXQ== Message-ID: To: 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2019 18:44:21 +0900 From: kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp In-Reply-To: 731b99334d6a3b3401f5e4ffccaf616d@hamnavoe.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 84a2c576-10fa-11ea-a1b3-8bae64a98cee > What's in your cmdline.txt? --- ether0=type=4330 essid= wificrypt=wpa2 fs= auth= --- Kenji From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 636F3BF8D1E for <9fans@9fans.net>; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 05:04:25 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp) Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 3615143ADD3; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 05:04:25 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1574849065; b=hh9SKezQo9xeYF3eWWmc1DovDF61UVKzTFdkqvjH4e3m8mJC8F Kz1PAP2+TdD54cM/TGKjmJ+wYsFQiaEX3/FxfwSh7f6Rakiv2ynatjraEodj+PWT NZ4hiAOaGEFVCHnbBXb03uMwmHcnMB9tC06D9hE6O7IGqWekaGb8eJFrEKGjXuWJ a490wRhagSi/9zhVVjxWbtSqjZABf23W/BIqNWtUdBq9BCg9OHWikLHU9ieZrs3k ixXWf2y18Tg1pNKWpyjEN+EJSINnTW8XSEYcGCCM5+tOPOSZ7p2Emksb2WWCGpD2 Yj1/LXsqyrNNDK7GUVqesF/jnhL5MMYvZgrw== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=message-id:to:subject:date:from:in-reply-to :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=arcseal; t=1574849065; bh=VVFbQhEg9CQpi4wRoVJnmXC+ajJceycZsjIm8RiSamA=; b= Bj11nU4IRIjzQFrLAOJaBRdS/HxTQ6CCpGg3dIAfjCM236R2i99EX89uRQkELK+B Mvrf6C+MTR0nFO61K1tUjfBjUbJfOldbhfH+dC6o50awhNk8yqZm+WLt6BhQxyle GdAy75QsMhmEGBT/u5uBIzlxOge5IwojB3wez63qTK1HCxeg604RrqPZC+8Getos JSN/pMVWFls3kTcVEdXx4oryUJ0HSP1i8VYqRRtTQiIvKmzdqIMwtQJgWcjIrfOf dtw3XxQRk9QO5c9gdZyUnhqQSZXxrLDFU9bGZbdJ+EfnjYyXLK2LFixj4EVNyePl mUZQaNhoBhAmisbjIlr+vg== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tb-mx0.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim-adsp=pass (ADSP policy from hera.eonet.ne.jp); dkim=pass (2048-bit rsa key sha256) header.d=hera.eonet.ne.jp header.i=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp header.b=QQqcGrEm header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=x01 x-bits=2048; dmarc=pass policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=hera.eonet.ne.jp; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=202.238.198.166 (cmo-0000.xspmail.jp); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp smtp.helo=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp policy.ptr=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 Authentication-Results: tb-mx0.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim-adsp=pass (ADSP policy from hera.eonet.ne.jp); dkim=pass (2048-bit rsa key sha256) header.d=hera.eonet.ne.jp header.i=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp header.b=QQqcGrEm header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=x01 x-bits=2048; dmarc=pass policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=hera.eonet.ne.jp; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=202.238.198.166 (cmo-0000.xspmail.jp); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp smtp.helo=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp policy.ptr=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudeihedguddtucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdggtfgfnhhsuhgsshgtrhhisggvpdfu rfetoffkrfgpnffqhgenuceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpefkvffuff fhjgggtgfgsehtjeejtddttddvnecuhfhrohhmpehkohhkrghmohhtoheshhgvrhgrrdgv ohhnvghtrdhnvgdrjhhpnecukfhppedvtddvrddvfeekrdduleekrdduieeipddukedtrd dugeeirdefuddrvdehudenucfrrghrrghmpehinhgvthepvddtvddrvdefkedrudelkedr udeiiedphhgvlhhopegtmhhoqddttddttddrgihsphhmrghilhdrjhhppdhmrghilhhfrh homhepoehkohhkrghmohhtoheshhgvrhgrrdgvohhnvghtrdhnvgdrjhhpqecuuffkkgfg peduhedtfeenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedt X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (hera.eonet.ne.jp: Sender is authorized to use 'kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'include:_mailspf.eonet.ne.jp' matched)) receiver=tb-mx0.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp"; helo=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp; client-ip=202.238.198.166 Received: from cmo-0000.xspmail.jp (cmo-0000.xspmail.jp [202.238.198.166]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 05:04:23 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp) Received: from cmr-0000.xspmail.jp ([202.238.198.117]) by cmo with ESMTP id Zu86iwq9seKiSZuBIi976k; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 19:04:20 +0900 Received: from pi3L.jitaku.localdomain ([180.146.31.251]) by cmr with ESMTPA id ZuBIiUQPQ3Zb2ZuBIimoiB; Wed, 27 Nov 2019 19:04:20 +0900 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hera.eonet.ne.jp; s=x01; t=1574849060; i=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp; bh=VVFbQhEg9CQpi4wRoVJnmXC+ajJceycZsjIm8RiSamA=; h=To:Subject:Date:From:In-Reply-To; b=QQqcGrEmdOA4KHOX2llkovaIfeW7j/LjG8OKJmGBzqxpcj3hXhReN7/AANbQLsrgY a34hCztIVn4odgcmnZHWV8hJI4KvW5DXT6B+KPX+gBtog1bLb1OuSMqNCChY3w46CU S5IROxjDWjAGvoTgGliKcgfjH6wNWeeWF7CDYb5swWK8o+D2qVi2C/ycpfaUyhUnrJ 6hralU5hSCQmIWSv7tbOmJqtIP1C5wAYKx1QLe9wotjbWpvMWHJO7OILMIGrZzzrTO nXoD8YAmEzkWfDOvFe/beIGE5vkQ3z/FO7xHc/ZpUImx83U5uRKNtz/emtfHNa1fJI OmluQdjeA55LA== Message-ID: <8E8621E5C9981A60C8A659163521A774@hera.eonet.ne.jp> To: 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2019 19:04:18 +0900 From: kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp In-Reply-To: A2E4646D0437A1D87F30933EE2E29F9F@hera.eonet.ne.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 4d9276f0-10fd-11ea-a651-db1e9c19cac6 > ether0=type=4330 essid= wificrypt=wpa2 fs= auth= Sorry, s/ether0/ether1/ I confused the cmdline.txt for 9front test. I tested your codes by ether1=type=4330 on your bcm system.. Kenji From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 303A8CB3DC9 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sun, 8 Dec 2019 23:00:43 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id EBE5390A579; Sun, 8 Dec 2019 23:00:43 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1575864043; b=JQlyKWVaaBI9X+jVfq7dyhVXdMoKoVDz9FPd3tSWp5mQ6J4R+q c2nUv/7k2fDDwXKxQajjn35IVkZuusFg0SVtk1M9Lk8kGeWWb2+D0p9fSElLHpRQ C1uQfQxtGdLg/IFnbuG9Shd8LIq/qtsh/61gyTWSDtL3/Su+H4tKG8cAzfERSLxA B5R9AZNahmQPP5gJDivoTXWERhljxP2bxdsrB8xj7h8dvzHhx2qSLE18Jx5sKGbq EU8an/M5d4DWGfOMBpPDBPAPOLEBtKGWZb4JzX0JJb2NOLGK4fIy63v7nxBgyXhF LJOHb4CdLWr8vT49dc+4luf9gEWu33Ayf9AQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=message-id:to:subject:date:from:in-reply-to :mime-version:content-type; s=arcseal; t=1575864043; bh=mfF3tjzL kuyAmrnRbtO/IN4paaVaU1DEtmh94Ec1Jwg=; b=uhy7NJ1tFpoVFpei9v7hHsSr iD3vidz4FgxXWMIWB9eS5jCal7rwN9nkv3B0JbT7V5zZFdTcM5pQjQCqcZz/HvMP rByRA25/jttGYNt41cG2ndOYw7jjsd5qlLrEcgv90/4XK9WIfjKPNL5CDWjs2rd5 tPRL7MIqlXxg38mUfcjxPAIam4Kk/btDzKqYPnLpJAEEY4FyrT0iJXbzn2xaLizs ROAx1BXyOQyfVEnVMFHyZz/9Z+OecIucHRbuogWRZ3cQtSt7NfTpW0Z2a16vGY+b dDibVs140escR+C9uTWST8JeV5M86DzPG0wWE4FklZzsyIcZcrmj+bl5BG8pHg== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim-adsp=pass (ADSP policy from hera.eonet.ne.jp); dkim=pass (2048-bit rsa key sha256) header.d=hera.eonet.ne.jp header.i=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp header.b=JX6zAsc1 header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=x01 x-bits=2048; dmarc=pass policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=hera.eonet.ne.jp; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=202.238.198.167 (cmo-0000.xspmail.jp); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp smtp.helo=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp policy.ptr=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 Authentication-Results: tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); dkim-adsp=pass (ADSP policy from hera.eonet.ne.jp); dkim=pass (2048-bit rsa key sha256) header.d=hera.eonet.ne.jp header.i=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp header.b=JX6zAsc1 header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=x01 x-bits=2048; dmarc=pass policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=hera.eonet.ne.jp; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=202.238.198.167 (cmo-0000.xspmail.jp); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp smtp.helo=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp policy.ptr=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=hera.eonet.ne.jp policy.org_domain=eonet.ne.jp policy.is_org=no (MX Record found); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedufedrudekledgieefucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdggtfgfnhhsuhgsshgtrhhisggvpdfu rfetoffkrfgpnffqhgenuceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpefkvffuff fhjgggtgesmhdtjeertddtvdenucfhrhhomhepkhhokhgrmhhothhosehhvghrrgdrvgho nhgvthdrnhgvrdhjphenucfkphepvddtvddrvdefkedrudelkedrudeijedpudektddrud egiedrvdejrdeivdenucfrrghrrghmpehinhgvthepvddtvddrvdefkedrudelkedrudei jedphhgvlhhopegtmhhoqddttddttddrgihsphhmrghilhdrjhhppdhmrghilhhfrhhomh epoehkohhkrghmohhtoheshhgvrhgrrdgvohhnvghtrdhnvgdrjhhpqecuuffkkgfgpedu vdefheegnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptd X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (hera.eonet.ne.jp: Sender is authorized to use 'kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'include:_mailspf.eonet.ne.jp' matched)) receiver=tb-mx1.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp"; helo=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp; client-ip=202.238.198.167 Received: from cmo-0000.xspmail.jp (cmo-0000.xspmail.jp [202.238.198.167]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Sun, 8 Dec 2019 23:00:39 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp) Received: from cmr-0002.xspmail.jp ([202.238.198.119]) by cmo with ESMTP id eA78iDY9geKiSeADsiQ1D9; Mon, 09 Dec 2019 13:00:36 +0900 Received: from pi3L.jitaku.localdomain ([180.146.27.62]) by cmr with ESMTPA id eADriicFhWSOFeADriyIPJ; Mon, 09 Dec 2019 13:00:36 +0900 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hera.eonet.ne.jp; s=x01; t=1575864036; i=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp; bh=mfF3tjzLkuyAmrnRbtO/IN4paaVaU1DEtmh94Ec1Jwg=; h=To:Subject:Date:From:In-Reply-To; b=JX6zAsc1IHOF8ljIKJ+p7Ii1q5+xJSM4pEkJpVkgxW87iNtO78USd+y3dU+W00dlQ uXeeg3pXdVBWrqLOhigGfvyF1tz48j/vNeT97e5BzIHDmAR/JFFmrgZi90Z2mkZToy qfw/M1981+5cEEAICg7T5nvdmUUdujjoGapu11fCVwWal0LbSQzz+O5wrllOj0i8vJ 0Mq25fJNJkqGX21y4Fm8jkzHeFA7hnC4O001FCMF3b+LCQAo+qxy2S7eIF8ZrBg+Lb tnIhZeE3HGpLFpuasuiqJsQjrZfY/BqCYm4ZMA631uR9i3q6PuGCttsxWYyqBuYDKt 5M/+MuedEslnw== Message-ID: To: 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2019 13:00:34 +0900 From: kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp In-Reply-To: 08995824A82CC0C4160EE97DBC62B071@hera.eonet.ne.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-hxsyqvoiuucqdlqlhxbyrbzhtm" Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 7b2a4cfc-1a38-11ea-b5c0-8b6dd58c4b0e This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-hxsyqvoiuucqdlqlhxbyrbzhtm Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ok, I got success by Richard's very kind help. Now, I can use wifi on rpi3B (ARM Cortex-A53) device using NEC WARPSTAR Aterm WR8170N. 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Tue, 26 Nov 2019 04:46:43 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp) Received: from cmr-0000.xspmail.jp ([202.238.198.117]) by cmo with ESMTP id ZXJCivK64eKiSZXQei7Vof; Tue, 26 Nov 2019 18:46:40 +0900 Received: from pi3L.jitaku.localdomain ([180.146.31.251]) by cmr with ESMTPA id ZXQeiNWii3Zb2ZXQeihbbJ; Tue, 26 Nov 2019 18:46:40 +0900 Message-ID: <08995824A82CC0C4160EE97DBC62B071@hera.eonet.ne.jp> To: 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2019 18:46:37 +0900 From: kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp In-Reply-To: 9d9b976991d9012ff262455de18d6f68@hamnavoe.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: ab71d4a4-1031-11ea-8075-f83a45e3eac9 Archived-At: =?UTF-8?B?PGh0dHBzOi8vOWZhbnMudG9waWNib3guY29tL2dyb3Vwcy85?= =?UTF-8?B?ZmFucy9UNTU2OWQ3MGJkMmEzZTBkZS1NYzQ5YTBlZWFkOWNhZWJjYzEyMjZh?= =?UTF-8?B?MWEzPg==?= List-Help: List-Id: "9fans" <9fans.9fans.net> List-Post: List-Software: Topicbox v0 List-Subscribe: Precedence: list Reply-To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> List-Unsubscribe: , Topicbox-Delivery-ID: 2:9fans:437d30aa-c441-11e9-8a57-d036212d11b0:f46adda4-eb83-11e9-92f5-7ab8f5b1d025:Mc49a0eead9caebcc1226a1a3:1:DB0s9AHG0iTa-9yHLzrjb7o3d7LO_Z_2JFy6qx7pTtk > Current raspberry pi kernel source is on 9p.io in /sources/contrib/miller= /9/bcm Hi, Richard. I'm now working to make your ether4330.c to work on 9front system, which is now my base sysytem. Your current source can work with wpa2/psk? I tried your 2018 version, but failed. 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Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2019 13:05:46 +0900 From: kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp In-Reply-To: DDBB37D7F63C7B8B2A42DB89682E29CF@hera.eonet.ne.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 334e3d7a-1a39-11ea-a301-996f1878d673 > Ok, I got success by Richard's very kind help. > Now, I can use wifi on rpi3B (ARM Cortex-A53) device > using NEC WARPSTAR Aterm WR8170N. I forgot. It is working on vanilla plan9 by Richard not on 9front device. 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Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2019 20:34:17 -0800 From: ori@eigenstate.org In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 2fb3120e-1a3d-11ea-b057-d04e4e8f398a > Ok, I got success by Richard's very kind help. > Now, I can use wifi on rpi3B (ARM Cortex-A53) device > using NEC WARPSTAR Aterm WR8170N. Might be worth posting what wasn't working, and what you changed to make it work, so that others can figure it out if they run into the same issue. :) From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B47ACB693F for <9fans@9fans.net>; Mon, 9 Dec 2019 00:27:58 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 70DF02E47F2; Mon, 9 Dec 2019 00:27:58 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1575869278; b=kTFxbHeHPM8y67jbaNkRHXoqkYq6noBmVB5Gq7Rc4/2wXO0a/5 8aV4mNBnsuNUShMgS878WC0zYdl3g88YugYC18R+/rVwM91qtPZLBbu87sOGw28G Tvc4FKRwo6Cp//oNX5q4O8QrE503axjPIxfM1bYyNJn6PVPslXOUEVYOtN9JaGV5 vg9sid1Uxg4ys+s84aaDtbWCIXfov43tpRdGGQOPwYEDfzDfaD1IqsOPaFl/Io4O 7jjldLxOB4Qp45y7MsUHDTbFSw2L+mmI6/7K2YaLCOlpUFxZffJarG10N8Qnk/8u Q120xAZxh+sS7wbrKNxqC0RyqqCbmQOyK0CA== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; 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identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp"; helo=cmo-0000.xspmail.jp; client-ip=202.238.198.167 Received: from cmo-0000.xspmail.jp (cmo-0000.xspmail.jp [202.238.198.167]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Mon, 9 Dec 2019 00:27:56 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp) Received: from cmr-0000.xspmail.jp ([202.238.198.117]) by cmo with ESMTP id eBZ1iDedbeKiSeBaLiQ8Ce; Mon, 09 Dec 2019 14:27:53 +0900 Received: from pi3L.jitaku.localdomain ([180.146.27.62]) by cmr with ESMTPA id eBaLisOWb3Zb2eBaLieWup; Mon, 09 Dec 2019 14:27:53 +0900 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hera.eonet.ne.jp; s=x01; t=1575869273; i=kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp; bh=mP73kBKjLV/ghvbLhnjcL5IShh6CF6yxsZKmbd3ErLg=; h=To:Subject:Date:From:In-Reply-To; b=F3SF3mpyM0HeXzm82gYWWkFr3mSjGzvh0aZcgP7Oc1le22kDdrM8+da450qpX/FcK vXUWeJqvW8Uge1ghhTJCNF1uafVTCSaP+mgf2NAgY8P0nqIcOklnpEHK1MZ0ks1n5J npJ9mORwTs6qbKNKtK5d/V58+AjDMRbXTVfgVxQZi6WYmDFfmbIJR2F4PKHYo3qCMv TNgH/sIAbA9RBB7oMOi5jHKs/daWk/hTPrS8Kg3/CbX6njib6bUOdgEJPdHwqk+EB7 EvowtcnXSrPY6rroVLuML7eZhV3OswFdxxl1kixn0aYUHiyA7vlVN8ECR904EKr29q tpIUTljELEndg== Message-ID: <7238A2F0D63B1BD4C83E9451BA7997CB@hera.eonet.ne.jp> To: 9fans@9fans.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Is the vanilla Plan 9 still alive? Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2019 14:27:52 +0900 From: kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp In-Reply-To: A83B620D126ADC13D8146D346FBC933B@eigenstate.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: acdba3ac-1a44-11ea-8b34-f0693bb64a3b > Might be worth posting what wasn't working, and what > you changed to make it work, so that others can figure > it out if they run into the same issue. :) This is Richard's work not mine, so he could write it if neccessary, I think. 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From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2019 08:06:03 +0000 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BlackCat-Spam-Score: 12 X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.2 Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: c576570c-1a5a-11ea-8376-e934284066a8 > Might be worth posting what wasn't working, and what > you changed to make it work An update to Broadcom's (now Cypress's) firmware for the wifi chip on some pi models caused it to start inserting an extra optional header in event packets from the chip to the cpu. My testing when I updated this firmware on the 9pi image hadn't been sufficient, so I didn't realise that it broke wifi on the pi3B. I've now updated the ether4330.c driver on 9p.io to deal with this extra header. Later today I'll update the 9pi image, to add this and to incorporate pi4 support.