[9fans] acme design (long)

[<cej@gli.cas.cz>]

DEBATE CONTINUES ;-)

++pac:
> 
> Now ETHZ is ending new core of Aos. It becomes real-time.
> That's great news!
> 
what does it mean "real-time" ? I heard it many times but still dont know...

> > nevertheless, shared libs are not true objects. I'm not the proper
> > person to discuss pros and cons of OO paradigm. I was 
> pursuaded I can
> > live w/o objects :-)
> 
> Oh, no! It's just a mirage! I can assure you 101% :o) I can't
> live w/o 
> objects! Nobody can! :o) Unix was so successful because of it was 
> defined one very useful and common OBJECT - "FILE"... :o)))) 

yes...

> And I wont
> speak about graphical library. May be you can't inherit from 
> library's 
> object but the ideology ot those libraries is object.
> 


++pac:
> is it really just a GUI to complete  Bluebottle functionality?? So I 
> can get rid of all those colourful windows and buttons?

Hmmm... Of Course I can understand first reaction of a man who went from 
Unix world! :o))) But I can say: You have CLI anywhere you want! :o) May be it is just a case of a habit?


Wlad:
> What is it CLI? Commandline interface?
> Do I have "Command.command ^ selected arguments~ middleclick" in BB, 
> too? Anywhere?

Yes. Where you want and where it is compfirtable for you.

Module.Procedure ^ - take "arguments" in the last selection (in any 
window, not just from the same window)

Module.Procedure * - take marked object (may be whole window as a 
"parameter", more friquent it is used for compilation for example. For 
instance we can mark (by pressing F1) window with program source text 
and type "Builder.Compile /s *"...)

Module.Procedure arg1 arg2 arg3 ... argN ~ - just simple command with 
its arguments. "~" means the end of argument list. Any command doesn't 
require it.

> We have similar "text-command-in-one-place arguments-elsewhere 
> middleclick-leftclick" in p9, however in AcmeUI only.

No-no. IN OBERON YOU CAN INPUT COMMANDS ANYWHERE YOU WANT!

> In an alternative, but concurrent, Rio (terminal) window you can only 
> select command together with its arguments and "send" it (via menu) to 
> execute...

"Menu items" in Oberon are just "carriers" of links to "commands". It 
has been done just for convenience.

> we have basically two GUIs in p9, that can run concurrently: one is 
> normal windowing environment, Rio, with a terminal window for each 
> process, capable of displaying text and graphics, and driven by menu, 
> and an AcmeUI, which is much like old Oberon UI, but runing within a 
> Rio window like frames, or panes, and driven via text commands 
> (pre)written anywhere.

Its just the question of you wish. You can open "desktops" with usual 
overlapped windows. But they remain "oberonish" window where you can do 
the same things as at tiled window GUI.

> Well, most importantly, do I have scripting in BB? With "if" and 
> loops? which languege, Oberon?

The main biuty is due to architecture of Oberon system you don't have 
separate languges for different goals. You just create modules. You even 
do not differentiate "sustem" and "user" modules. You just expand system 
functionality by adding new developed modules or change it by replacing 
its default modules with yours.