From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED, DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID,FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN,FREEMAIL_FROM, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: from tb-ob0.topicbox.com (tb-ob0.topicbox.com [64.147.108.117]) by inbox.vuxu.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13B6D24AE2 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2024 04:49:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (tb-mx1.nyi.icgroup.com [10.90.30.61]) by tb-ob0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1050A2A5B7 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2024 22:49:59 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from bounce.mMce06715b09bf351399b7ac03.r522be890-2105-11eb-b15e-8d699134e1fa@9fans.bounce.topicbox.com) Received: by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix, from userid 1132) id 09891A32F75; Wed, 24 Jan 2024 22:49:59 -0500 (EST) ARC-Authentication-Results: i=2; topicbox.com; arc=pass; dkim=pass (2048-bit rsa key sha256) header.d=gmail.com header.i=@gmail.com header.b=MHrJwVd9 header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=20230601 x-bits=2048; dmarc=pass policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.published-subdomain-policy=quarantine policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,sp=quarantine,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=don.bailey@gmail.com smtp.helo=mail-io1-f50.google.com; x-internal-arc=fail (as.1.topicbox.com=pass, ams.1.topicbox.com=fail (message has been altered)) (Message modified while forwarding at Topicbox) ARC-Message-Signature: i=2; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=content-type:content-transfer-encoding:from :mime-version:subject:date:message-id:references:in-reply-to:to :list-help:list-id:list-post:list-subscribe:reply-to :list-unsubscribe; s=sysmsg-1; t=1706154598; bh=YFdNZfSRzAgYDqwb 3G8yCu+LGPLkd+FPbKA496qOq0Y=; b=Zb+pp/xRDTtxFYo+wfSJDVxuTeYQoe5u xEsiSsuenxb6iRIwBigw8uDm/Rout4UI8qHbvkEVGXZgo7Y7jKWipr1tAkKK0kxj ZdQi/b1qecWnMacDPDcS76Sjd+SnGG6BslBSfRu2UP5OtjW/GD0IExskHWUR8F9Y PQa9Qv7AFc0= ARC-Seal: i=2; a=rsa-sha256; cv=pass; d=topicbox.com; s=sysmsg-1; t= 1706154598; b=qCkYUoWDNkkoyvkqzq+Nt73wEs5bHfAb4N8Mt9vb6gfT0xiVJu 7xlSER1IUr7QHLuXRbLFjBiUMFTJZptWGHONQZckitFLEn6nThPEuOauWPXBFvAR QeOxDukFJeEOlXnhnSS0jc+RoYTLdRQT6RQIU9/QOoPhHm8+6uQwwBCN8= Authentication-Results: topicbox.com; arc=pass; dkim=pass (2048-bit rsa key sha256) header.d=gmail.com header.i=@gmail.com header.b=MHrJwVd9 header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=20230601 x-bits=2048; dmarc=pass policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.published-subdomain-policy=quarantine policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,sp=quarantine,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=don.bailey@gmail.com smtp.helo=mail-io1-f50.google.com; x-internal-arc=fail (as.1.topicbox.com=pass, ams.1.topicbox.com=fail (message has been altered)) (Message modified while forwarding at Topicbox) X-Received-Authentication-Results: tb-mx0.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); bimi=skipped (DMARC Policy is not at enforcement); dkim=pass (2048-bit rsa key sha256) header.d=gmail.com header.i=@gmail.com header.b=MHrJwVd9 header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=20230601 x-bits=2048; dmarc=pass policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.published-subdomain-policy=quarantine policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,sp=quarantine,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=gmail.com; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=209.85.166.50 (mail-io1-f50.google.com); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=don.bailey@gmail.com smtp.helo=mail-io1-f50.google.com; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-google-dkim=pass (2048-bit rsa key) header.d=1e100.net header.i=@1e100.net header.b=dh4qShAQ; x-me-sender=none; x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=mail-io1-f50.google.com policy.ptr=mail-io1-f50.google.com; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=gmail.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Records found: alt1.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,alt2.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,alt4.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=gmail.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Records found: alt1.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,alt2.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,alt4.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed; d=9fans.net; h= content-type:content-transfer-encoding:from:mime-version:subject :date:message-id:references:in-reply-to:to:list-help:list-id :list-post:list-subscribe:reply-to:list-unsubscribe; s=dkim-1; t=1706154598; x=1706240998; bh=YFdNZfSRzAgYDqwb3G8yCu+LGPLkd+FP bKA496qOq0Y=; b=H3Dh/kGtndDVd/M2S3H9kutPSWoOSoWwSw1V7CbkGtFmOvc3 FLJQia0e7otpCOF4YqpPOT2NRVscdb/VNlNYkpdDDlo7BZwrwYK6EifG982aDQ4u JNqfPFpwsba/jZt9cbMV8QY+grQ7trdBk0CZgR6ln1zR3TX/ckVufo8NM9I= Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96A642EF08F2 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Wed, 24 Jan 2024 22:49:45 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from don.bailey@gmail.com) Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id 9EB3E22A965; Wed, 24 Jan 2024 22:49:45 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1706154585; b=suoiwtWpD0IB6xZhEhMWjqrGuW5nB8Wo2wWJL5C+2qJ1C2DFoi gb8YphaFxx8k6s6OJhDuiYx1WdW+zLSf5JwqVO4uRaUu5Kj6VBw17jzt0zgZXG3c fI0MuANhG8F4+OgWe5jC2ktxq0QOXqBw1IruJLEiPztFwzVkBiDc3GU2pQEDNLo0 rRjBSFgxfukjOlcfeMRjB1ZDYVXiLefIaHeFsTJzr62BzJ0f7K8VA3uQpp2qnFm2 Gi8R/TnCKUbK/6fERQuUFK5VK14uPaBO6HVGbleP5QDYSWLTaIicI2KI/z3ZUMh+ vdMzdbaApZkrKEOOh8FAl5ORkPPa/Wqr/I4Q== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=content-type:content-transfer-encoding:from :mime-version:subject:date:message-id:references:in-reply-to:to; s=arcseal; t=1706154585; bh=FjudA9mNH+JLwtDWj6z4aDeoFmYiuWn4zic esgRhrvU=; b=GQWDVYAA6b5cZeKxav+MV2FOZSNXmwBWCEfi/Vqx/X+nNOD7C5W JQQOknUzkzUwMvsnlSVqi+NM5RfgaLkU/WsrVbbQXGJwI054cArJ0bNndIcWBgAG BVlJLCEbtxfB4uU/Gf5cfPs0tnCAihWrngKaMWJlHn1E4SdG1iC6Q6tRhQM8tccS k+cs2IaiFyTHc7gV5hHDqOlo3bvE4gL9AVCObB6+frtqvcXtcxvd4WuOB0fL3Xra CtD5kmEoVHSrLZLiPPZB9w7Lg2C1m/yXDgGKjo1LKpLqWe4P3e18pYWMEP9Qb1Po Bj+y6bOQ3mksfze+kIWO3zBg4sqCvu2rGUA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tb-mx0.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); bimi=skipped (DMARC Policy is not at enforcement); dkim=pass (2048-bit rsa key sha256) header.d=gmail.com header.i=@gmail.com header.b=MHrJwVd9 header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=20230601 x-bits=2048; dmarc=pass policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.published-subdomain-policy=quarantine policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,sp=quarantine,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=gmail.com; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=209.85.166.50 (mail-io1-f50.google.com); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=don.bailey@gmail.com smtp.helo=mail-io1-f50.google.com; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-google-dkim=pass (2048-bit rsa key) header.d=1e100.net header.i=@1e100.net header.b=dh4qShAQ; x-me-sender=none; x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=mail-io1-f50.google.com policy.ptr=mail-io1-f50.google.com; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=gmail.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Records found: alt1.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,alt2.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,alt4.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=gmail.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Records found: alt1.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,alt2.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,alt4.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com,gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvkedrvdelvddgiedvucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdggtfgfnhhsuhgsshgtrhhisggvpdfu rfetoffkrfgpnffqhgenuceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpegtgffhgg fufffkfhgjvffosehtqhhmtdhhtdejnecuhfhrohhmpedfffhonhcutedruceurghilhgv hidfuceoughonhdrsggrihhlvgihsehgmhgrihhlrdgtohhmqeenucggtffrrghtthgvrh hnpeeguddvveeiieeufeegueetudegudefgfdvvdeggeeukedvtdeuieehgeelvdetffen ucffohhmrghinhepthhophhitggsohigrdgtohhmnecukfhppedvtdelrdekhedrudeiie drhedtpdelkedrleejrddurdduleehnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghr rghmpehinhgvthepvddtledrkeehrdduieeirdehtddphhgvlhhopehmrghilhdqihhoud dqfhehtddrghhoohhglhgvrdgtohhmpdhmrghilhhfrhhomhepoeguohhnrdgsrghilhgv hiesghhmrghilhdrtghomheq X-ME-VSScore: 0 X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (gmail.com ... _spf.google.com: Sender is authorized to use 'don.bailey@gmail.com' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'include:_netblocks.google.com' matched)) receiver=tb-mx0.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="don.bailey@gmail.com"; helo=mail-io1-f50.google.com; client-ip=209.85.166.50 Received: from mail-io1-f50.google.com (mail-io1-f50.google.com [209.85.166.50]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Wed, 24 Jan 2024 22:49:45 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from don.bailey@gmail.com) Received: by mail-io1-f50.google.com with SMTP id ca18e2360f4ac-7bf0f3bf331so292992839f.3 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Wed, 24 Jan 2024 19:49:45 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1706154584; x=1706759384; h=to:in-reply-to:references:message-id:date:subject:mime-version:from :content-transfer-encoding:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject :date:message-id:reply-to; bh=FjudA9mNH+JLwtDWj6z4aDeoFmYiuWn4zicesgRhrvU=; b=dh4qShAQoE/ZwdAej0IEhArspsG5zEVsObwPMbHWkt2K6VgTHcJyqyumX2hwObPUcP TDSRGR1v2OKyMpuMdFIVIoJRo5JdbXojSoHt0n6EuERHeawC9jAVAozX9upKWdO38UXm 6tZtHugDc3LSo8/HgK5OWyTc9EuGQcRGH1wbcXqmPDxCQTJ7sWdS4bwEMda01Tngthqq FQfQcOzBjO6Sh/z7Y7HzWKYbnPLiJUOJ2UyBMtJUZb2a8Z/h4Oab0zZQpWySBpnJUvSq 9DXEr/JCeli31Ap03Dj5VMQV66Wa9efaFBK4P5048Gk2Tv/ja4+jP3165jC38/f7ALkt 0Apg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YxJrNOkGmnd1f6ktha0KE82HUXUKFjhi4i72e0wRe9j30/dlsL3 6MUdHYE4i4wfJEMrcoNIACqo3HIospBBQEkeQohELJMMjCDkI9BEjODqZqrA X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFGmhTi/66/iO5WSX7UX3grxZADwOdgi8DT+EmgnhmoIfMzF2f1o1UrjOAnJ9A68ywNKqb4dA== X-Received: by 2002:a5e:df49:0:b0:7ba:85e4:f8de with SMTP id g9-20020a5edf49000000b007ba85e4f8demr564975ioq.42.1706154584183; Wed, 24 Jan 2024 19:49:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpclient.apple ([98.97.1.195]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id h14-20020a05660208ce00b007bf021d13ebsm7674369ioz.49.2024.01.24.19.49.43 for <9fans@9fans.net> (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 24 Jan 2024 19:49:43 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: "Don A. Bailey" Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Subject: Re: Charting the Future: Envisioning Plan 9 Release 5 for the 9fans Community. [Was:Re: [9fans] Supported Notebooks] Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2024 22:49:33 -0500 Message-Id: References: In-Reply-To: To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (21C66) Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: ca7d7792-bb34-11ee-83aa-1d5f058c7b06 Archived-At: =?UTF-8?B?PGh0dHBzOi8vOWZhbnMudG9waWNib3guY29tL2dyb3Vwcy85?= =?UTF-8?B?ZmFucy9UNDJmMTFlMDI2NWJjZmExOC1NY2UwNjcxNWIwOWJmMzUxMzk5Yjdh?= =?UTF-8?B?YzAzPg==?= List-Help: List-Id: "9fans" <9fans.9fans.net> List-Post: List-Software: Topicbox v0 List-Subscribe: Precedence: list Reply-To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> List-Unsubscribe: , Topicbox-Delivery-ID: 2:9fans:437d30aa-c441-11e9-8a57-d036212d11b0:522be890-2105-11eb-b15e-8d699134e1fa:Mce06715b09bf351399b7ac03:1:7GTTTSQIOWZZA0DRMvqAiycPl1cdkfCPVjfj9c6jdV4 I use it. It=E2=80=99s also my advice. It wasn=E2=80=99t =E2=80=9Cadvice=E2= =80=9D from Rob, it was a design choice. There=E2=80=99s more value in that= than =E2=80=9Cadvice=E2=80=9D.=20 Not interested in your theoretical discussions or trolling. Thanks. D > On Jan 24, 2024, at 10:44=E2=80=AFPM, Kurt H Maier via 9fans <9fans@9fans= .net> wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFOn Wed, Jan 24, 2024 at 08:53:30PM -0500, Don A. Bailey wrote: >> Tbf I took it as genuine. >>=20 >> One reason I responded with no is that Rob noted that further 9 releases= should not be a release at all, but should be fluid updates through the ne= twork. I think if 9 lives on it should be that was, as intended. >=20 > might want to focus on advice from people who use plan 9, instead >=20 >> I am not a fan of the weird 9front split from the standard repo. I=E2=80= =99d prefer the sources to be managed by the foundation and would like to o= nly receive patches through them. >=20 > what is weird about forking unmaintained software? >=20 > khm ------------------------------------------ 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T42f11e0265bcfa18-Mce067= 15b09bf351399b7ac03 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription