Arm Thumb compiler for Cortex-M

Arm Thumb compiler for Cortex-M

[Thaddeus Woskowiak]

I would like to know if anyone is working on or exists an Arm Thumb
compiler so one could use plan 9 to program Arm Cortex M0/3/4/7
microcontrollers directly. I know of Charles Forsyth's xc AVR compiler
which is also interesting. Though I have yet to try it out.

-taw

Re: [9fans] Arm Thumb compiler for Cortex-M

[Charles Forsyth]

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There was a 5[ac] variant for Inferno (ta, tc) that produced Thumb code,
and 5l could link Thumb and ARM32 code.
That wasn't extended once Thumb-2 was issued, since it was different enough
to require a fair amount of work and we had no immediate application on the
Cortex.


On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 11:38 PM Thaddeus Woskowiak <tswoskowiak@gmail.com>
wrote:

> I would like to know if anyone is working on or exists an Arm Thumb
> compiler so one could use plan 9 to program Arm Cortex M0/3/4/7
> microcontrollers directly. I know of Charles Forsyth's xc AVR compiler
> which is also interesting. Though I have yet to try it out.
>
> -taw
>
> ------------------------------------------
> 9fans: 9fans
> Permalink:
> https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tc22ac8ae61456f10-M53d9114f6a2c6402ef14fd63
> Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
>

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Re: [9fans] Arm Thumb compiler for Cortex-M

[Don A. Bailey]

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Any source available?

> On Nov 5, 2020, at 6:11 PM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> There was a 5[ac] variant for Inferno (ta, tc) that produced Thumb code, and 5l could link Thumb and ARM32 code.
> That wasn't extended once Thumb-2 was issued, since it was different enough to require a fair amount of work and we had no immediate application on the Cortex.
> 
> 
>> On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 11:38 PM Thaddeus Woskowiak <tswoskowiak@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I would like to know if anyone is working on or exists an Arm Thumb
>> compiler so one could use plan 9 to program Arm Cortex M0/3/4/7
>> microcontrollers directly. I know of Charles Forsyth's xc AVR compiler
>> which is also interesting. Though I have yet to try it out.
>> 
>> -taw
>> 
>> ------------------------------------------
>> 9fans: 9fans
>> Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tc22ac8ae61456f10-M53d9114f6a2c6402ef14fd63
>> Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
> 
> 9fans / 9fans / see discussions + participants + delivery options Permalink

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Re: [9fans] Arm Thumb compiler for Cortex-M

[Charles Forsyth]

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It's utils/tc in the Inferno tree. 5a does both ARM32 and Thumb (because
it's abstract assembly), as does 5l.

On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 12:28 AM Don A. Bailey <don.bailey@gmail.com> wrote:

> Any source available?
>
> On Nov 5, 2020, at 6:11 PM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> 
> There was a 5[ac] variant for Inferno (ta, tc) that produced Thumb code,
> and 5l could link Thumb and ARM32 code.
> That wasn't extended once Thumb-2 was issued, since it was
> different enough to require a fair amount of work and we had no
> immediate application on the Cortex.
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 11:38 PM Thaddeus Woskowiak <tswoskowiak@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I would like to know if anyone is working on or exists an Arm Thumb
>> compiler so one could use plan 9 to program Arm Cortex M0/3/4/7
>> microcontrollers directly. I know of Charles Forsyth's xc AVR compiler
>> which is also interesting. Though I have yet to try it out.
>>
>> -taw
>>
>> ------------------------------------------
>> 9fans: 9fans
>> Permalink:
>> https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tc22ac8ae61456f10-M53d9114f6a2c6402ef14fd63
>> Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
>>
> *9fans <https://9fans.topicbox.com/latest>* / 9fans / see discussions
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>

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Re: [9fans] Arm Thumb compiler for Cortex-M

[Charles Forsyth]

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tc is different because the register allocation and code generation
strategies are different from normal ARM

On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 12:46 AM Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com>
wrote:

> It's utils/tc in the Inferno tree. 5a does both ARM32 and Thumb (because
> it's abstract assembly), as does 5l.
>
> On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 12:28 AM Don A. Bailey <don.bailey@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Any source available?
>>
>> On Nov 5, 2020, at 6:11 PM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> 
>> There was a 5[ac] variant for Inferno (ta, tc) that produced Thumb code,
>> and 5l could link Thumb and ARM32 code.
>> That wasn't extended once Thumb-2 was issued, since it was
>> different enough to require a fair amount of work and we had no
>> immediate application on the Cortex.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 11:38 PM Thaddeus Woskowiak <tswoskowiak@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I would like to know if anyone is working on or exists an Arm Thumb
>>> compiler so one could use plan 9 to program Arm Cortex M0/3/4/7
>>> microcontrollers directly. I know of Charles Forsyth's xc AVR compiler
>>> which is also interesting. Though I have yet to try it out.
>>>
>>> -taw
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------
>>> 9fans: 9fans
>>> Permalink:
>>> https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tc22ac8ae61456f10-M53d9114f6a2c6402ef14fd63
>>> Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
>>>
>> *9fans <https://9fans.topicbox.com/latest>* / 9fans / see discussions
>> <https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans> + participants
>> <https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/members> + delivery options
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>> <https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tc22ac8ae61456f10-M9c7a0aed3d67c936891acdd7>
>>
>

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Re: [9fans] Arm Thumb compiler for Cortex-M

[Don A. Bailey]

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Where the heck is the inferno tree?

> On Nov 5, 2020, at 6:48 PM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> tc is different because the register allocation and code generation strategies are different from normal ARM
> 
>> On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 12:46 AM Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:
>> It's utils/tc in the Inferno tree. 5a does both ARM32 and Thumb (because it's abstract assembly), as does 5l.
>> 
>>> On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 12:28 AM Don A. Bailey <don.bailey@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Any source available?
>>> 
>>>>> On Nov 5, 2020, at 6:11 PM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> There was a 5[ac] variant for Inferno (ta, tc) that produced Thumb code, and 5l could link Thumb and ARM32 code.
>>>> That wasn't extended once Thumb-2 was issued, since it was different enough to require a fair amount of work and we had no immediate application on the Cortex.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 11:38 PM Thaddeus Woskowiak <tswoskowiak@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> I would like to know if anyone is working on or exists an Arm Thumb
>>>>> compiler so one could use plan 9 to program Arm Cortex M0/3/4/7
>>>>> microcontrollers directly. I know of Charles Forsyth's xc AVR compiler
>>>>> which is also interesting. Though I have yet to try it out.
>>>>> 
>>>>> -taw
>>>>> 
>>>>> ------------------------------------------
>>>>> 9fans: 9fans
>>>>> Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tc22ac8ae61456f10-M53d9114f6a2c6402ef14fd63
>>>>> Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
> 
> 9fans / 9fans / see discussions + participants + delivery options Permalink

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Re: [9fans] Arm Thumb compiler for Cortex-M

[Charles Forsyth]

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http://vitanuova.com/inferno/downloads.html

On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 12:51 AM Don A. Bailey <don.bailey@gmail.com> wrote:

> Where the heck is the inferno tree?
>
> On Nov 5, 2020, at 6:48 PM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> 
> tc is different because the register allocation and code generation
> strategies are different from normal ARM
>
> On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 12:46 AM Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> It's utils/tc in the Inferno tree. 5a does both ARM32 and Thumb (because
>> it's abstract assembly), as does 5l.
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 12:28 AM Don A. Bailey <don.bailey@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Any source available?
>>>
>>> On Nov 5, 2020, at 6:11 PM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>> There was a 5[ac] variant for Inferno (ta, tc) that produced Thumb code,
>>> and 5l could link Thumb and ARM32 code.
>>> That wasn't extended once Thumb-2 was issued, since it was
>>> different enough to require a fair amount of work and we had no
>>> immediate application on the Cortex.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 11:38 PM Thaddeus Woskowiak <
>>> tswoskowiak@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I would like to know if anyone is working on or exists an Arm Thumb
>>>> compiler so one could use plan 9 to program Arm Cortex M0/3/4/7
>>>> microcontrollers directly. I know of Charles Forsyth's xc AVR compiler
>>>> which is also interesting. Though I have yet to try it out.
>>>>
>>>> -taw
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------
>>>> 9fans: 9fans
>>>> Permalink:
>>>> https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tc22ac8ae61456f10-M53d9114f6a2c6402ef14fd63
>>>> Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
>>>>
>>> *9fans <https://9fans.topicbox.com/latest>* / 9fans / see discussions
> <https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans> + participants
> <https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/members> + delivery options
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> <https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tc22ac8ae61456f10-M19ec8971e0a6bf813470bdd5>
>

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Re: [9fans] Arm Thumb compiler for Cortex-M

[Don A. Bailey]

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Oh right. Thanks, Charles 

> On Nov 5, 2020, at 6:59 PM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> http://vitanuova.com/inferno/downloads.html
> 
>> On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 12:51 AM Don A. Bailey <don.bailey@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Where the heck is the inferno tree?
>> 
>>>> On Nov 5, 2020, at 6:48 PM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> tc is different because the register allocation and code generation strategies are different from normal ARM
>>> 
>>>> On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 12:46 AM Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> It's utils/tc in the Inferno tree. 5a does both ARM32 and Thumb (because it's abstract assembly), as does 5l.
>>>> 
>>>>> On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 12:28 AM Don A. Bailey <don.bailey@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Any source available?
>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Nov 5, 2020, at 6:11 PM, Charles Forsyth <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> There was a 5[ac] variant for Inferno (ta, tc) that produced Thumb code, and 5l could link Thumb and ARM32 code.
>>>>>> That wasn't extended once Thumb-2 was issued, since it was different enough to require a fair amount of work and we had no immediate application on the Cortex.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 11:38 PM Thaddeus Woskowiak <tswoskowiak@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> I would like to know if anyone is working on or exists an Arm Thumb
>>>>>>> compiler so one could use plan 9 to program Arm Cortex M0/3/4/7
>>>>>>> microcontrollers directly. I know of Charles Forsyth's xc AVR compiler
>>>>>>> which is also interesting. Though I have yet to try it out.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> -taw
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------
>>>>>>> 9fans: 9fans
>>>>>>> Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tc22ac8ae61456f10-M53d9114f6a2c6402ef14fd63
>>>>>>> Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
> 
> 9fans / 9fans / see discussions + participants + delivery options Permalink

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Re: [9fans] Arm Thumb compiler for Cortex-M

[Thaddeus Woskowiak]

On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 7:12 PM Charles Forsyth
<charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> There was a 5[ac] variant for Inferno (ta, tc) that produced Thumb code, and 5l could link Thumb and ARM32 code.
> That wasn't extended once Thumb-2 was issued, since it was different enough to require a fair amount of work and we had no immediate application on the Cortex.
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 11:38 PM Thaddeus Woskowiak <tswoskowiak@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I would like to know if anyone is working on or exists an Arm Thumb
>> compiler so one could use plan 9 to program Arm Cortex M0/3/4/7
>> microcontrollers directly. I know of Charles Forsyth's xc AVR compiler
>> which is also interesting. Though I have yet to try it out.
>>
>> -taw
>>
>> ------------------------------------------
>> 9fans: 9fans
>> Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tc22ac8ae61456f10-M53d9114f6a2c6402ef14fd63
>> Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
>
> 9fans / 9fans / see discussions + participants + delivery options Permalink

Charles, Thank you for the information. So Thumb compiling and
assembly is handled by tc and ta respectively while 5l can handle
linking both thumb code and arm 32.

I guess my next question is: does this mean Inferno can run on certain
Cortex-M micros since it can run MMU-less? (provided enough memory of
course) And has this been done before?

Re: [9fans] Arm Thumb compiler for Cortex-M

[Charles Forsyth]

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A slight correction (I made it earlier but didn't highlight it): 5a is also
used for Thumb code, as "5a -t" to restrict the input to thumb
constructions and tag the output as Thumb code (using .t files instead of
.5)
The thumb mkfile sets AS=5a -t
Since the Thumb-2 changes aren't supported, and it's the original Thumb, I
think that makes the supported architecture Armv6-M in current
documentation terms.
It looks to me as though it would work on Cortex M0, but I think the thumb
mode was only ever used by us on ARM's little Armv7-t Evaluator board,
which I can't even find documented now.
Normally even that board ran in (normal) ARM32 mode. The Thumb work on it
was just a stepping stone for using Thumb mode on a proprietary 3rd party
ARM implementation, although even there it was probably experimental.
Inferno can run without an MMU. Even given an MMU it sets a fairly flat map
across physical memory and the MMU functionality is mainly used to map
devices.
The os/ks32 directory is a guide to squashing the system down to fit modest
if not tiny memory (again, in ARM32 mode).

On Sat, Nov 7, 2020 at 2:24 PM Thaddeus Woskowiak <tswoskowiak@gmail.com>
wrote:

> On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 7:12 PM Charles Forsyth
> <charles.forsyth@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > There was a 5[ac] variant for Inferno (ta, tc) that produced Thumb code,
> and 5l could link Thumb and ARM32 code.
> > That wasn't extended once Thumb-2 was issued, since it was different
> enough to require a fair amount of work and we had no immediate application
> on the Cortex.
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 11:38 PM Thaddeus Woskowiak <
> tswoskowiak@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> I would like to know if anyone is working on or exists an Arm Thumb
> >> compiler so one could use plan 9 to program Arm Cortex M0/3/4/7
> >> microcontrollers directly. I know of Charles Forsyth's xc AVR compiler
> >> which is also interesting. Though I have yet to try it out.
> >>
> >> -taw
> >
> > 9fans / 9fans / see discussions + participants + delivery options
> Permalink
> 
> Charles, Thank you for the information. So Thumb compiling and
> assembly is handled by tc and ta respectively while 5l can handle
> linking both thumb code and arm 32.
> 
> I guess my next question is: does this mean Inferno can run on certain
> Cortex-M micros since it can run MMU-less? (provided enough memory of
> course) And has this been done before?

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Re: [9fans] Arm Thumb compiler for Cortex-M

[Anthony Martin]

While we're asking questions, how does utils/tl differ from utils/5l?

  Anthony

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Re: [9fans] Arm Thumb compiler for Cortex-M

[Charles Forsyth]

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That's a good question. utils/tl is the 5l I've referred to, which can do
ARM32 and Thumb interlinking. utils/5l is now fitfully
aligned (back-and-forth) with Plan9's 5l,
that couldn't do the interlinking.

On Sat, Nov 7, 2020 at 9:24 PM Anthony Martin <ality@pbrane.org> wrote:

> While we're asking questions, how does utils/tl differ from utils/5l?
> 
> Anthony

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