From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: from tb-ob1.topicbox.com (tb-ob1.topicbox.com [64.147.108.173]) by inbox.vuxu.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 165162A59A for ; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 20:57:20 +0200 (CEST) Received: from tb-mx0.topicbox.com (tb-mx0.nyi.icgroup.com [10.90.30.73]) by tb-ob1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF2632FCF4 for ; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 14:57:19 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from bounce.mMb1f097cea874604a9466012d.r522be890-2105-11eb-b15e-8d699134e1fa@9fans.bounce.topicbox.com) Received: by tb-mx0.topicbox.com (Postfix, from userid 1132) id DC1CC1B9483B; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 14:57:19 -0400 (EDT) ARC-Authentication-Results: i=2; topicbox.com; arc=pass; dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=kergis.com; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=tlaronde@kergis.com smtp.helo=5.mo552.mail-out.ovh.net; x-internal-arc=fail (as.1.topicbox.com=pass, ams.1.topicbox.com=fail (message has been altered)) (Message modified while forwarding at Topicbox) ARC-Message-Signature: i=2; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:content-type:in-reply-to:list-help:list-id :list-post:list-subscribe:reply-to:content-transfer-encoding :list-unsubscribe; s=sysmsg-1; t=1718132239; bh=QW3+LAGm6MYAUBbO nz3i5Ds6TTbhOpxYVCPV7vjlFXc=; b=IRKabfHE7Y7efd7wZMhW06Ug3Prrrr1h 5LlqdmL21lWLNJLnpfjpVuttZ5/k4u/g3tsnykII7zjgcDVaR8npMbWasfqyYCU5 OkeuPF99sifn4UsfInCrMbFChibRh+37Y2xJiFRUcaDOfinDvATNb/pqbekyuhBg lpoG9BEuqhc= ARC-Seal: i=2; a=rsa-sha256; cv=pass; d=topicbox.com; s=sysmsg-1; t= 1718132239; b=pZVZ92A8eYYJ8uyhcRtFFJSEdfAqT3eWtj3/NsiYTcTTrZd10V Tk1RK4+/M34+cvhZqzrSPMT+EBHfemPzIVeHVZ4a87eKyCmKy5iCU+WZiS9WODyx /4BCNxsfEUKuFaDKo/6KYFUvhANb0pqHrWmZC7TDsfQ5demvKIp+f5820= Authentication-Results: topicbox.com; arc=pass; dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=kergis.com; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=tlaronde@kergis.com smtp.helo=5.mo552.mail-out.ovh.net; x-internal-arc=fail (as.1.topicbox.com=pass, ams.1.topicbox.com=fail (message has been altered)) (Message modified while forwarding at Topicbox) X-Received-Authentication-Results: garm.ovh; auth=pass (GARM-105G006c204c875-0de3-41a6-903f-df5bbf60d0b8, 1E3C769B90D0995552E7D84D32711440E1DE52DC) smtp.auth=tlaronde@kergis.com X-Received-Authentication-Results: tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); bimi=skipped (DMARC did not pass); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=kergis.com; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=188.165.45.220 (5.mo552.mail-out.ovh.net); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=tlaronde@kergis.com smtp.helo=5.mo552.mail-out.ovh.net; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-me-sender=none; x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=5.mo552.mail-out.ovh.net policy.ptr=5.mo552.mail-out.ovh.net; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=kergis.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Records found: mx2.ovh.net,mx1.ovh.net,mxb.ovh.net); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=kergis.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Records found: mx2.ovh.net,mx1.ovh.net,mxb.ovh.net); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed; d=9fans.net; h=date:from :to:subject:message-id:references:mime-version:content-type :in-reply-to:list-help:list-id:list-post:list-subscribe:reply-to :content-transfer-encoding:list-unsubscribe; s=dkim-1; t= 1718132239; x=1718218639; bh=hyWndpfrxjf+m7Qu4AweDwex8LI3XmD+zJ5 Dqs5zVDU=; b=A453jTCtzcDrJHQqb/RVBe2KdW9S0P9pFD5RS3+QP4dkO4cVpDq UJrIUh+NffqGEW3fu8hSDGWzipCjam2y1zMK/9JR+1c+D1CgfnQ/F09lG7jts95W W0JLswnxYff6HG1w+rU4/ENubOJCcr8GG0emGL+MpLAcXkfiMqya78cQ= Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost.local [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2B9E1B1E0C8 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 14:57:08 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from tlaronde@kergis.com) Received: from tb-mx1.topicbox.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Authentication Milter) with ESMTP id BCB61133BFF; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 14:57:08 -0400 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; d=topicbox.com; s=arcseal; t= 1718132228; b=cijMf8sMxvAkBKOmAALk4d9AohQOe1KOaTGckMj5e2x9fkYn0R sqLE2x3h1KqYR0HBu9sJFkMHFL7aYnWCrTdbRrn8IKxjc9UHyQX0/SNJcCDY1DMN isTbvJYHu+T/7sg6i23stVxUpoFBIu5Pd8fQmUQG/bzF0tLUbgI3cIAqeTJiA2cQ n8POuTiuB9amL0NIJ1imPxJsFeS2SeIQs6QPMBn0t/BFvcMrf0AUSPRT20XRCAvE VlksrDUzAGA4k9+j0sAOvTxJ+CdB7gJMs8UDgJN7THKJIyO2cZJMJtLJCRqZUhpm 43wWnT88fIV3n20wAF3eg6KVTqP8w5ED79xg== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= topicbox.com; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:content-type:in-reply-to; s=arcseal; t=1718132228; bh=FEIRaaMCI0gJzY9S05sEN7BU0wUFpMwbDBv5+n6gjeE=; b=mVSQ1Jh0oXHO 7MYpw5s2JJcFLDM89Lg0VU0aT3A7r+xT7a/vZ2UZAmkI3LJdAa0dm11RFbkBzO4v 0gGdi14RhY9W/FW1j95VQm+vD1czdADCF+TlWFXE6yNxesmaafTOMqsZq+x6NuVg DIzaiQTugBoBSpYDca5MBNVo+Dj706Z9fhMDwqsn7kUDxk9NI+Et3EUYLneDSRmV 5Hzf5jkMG5XtTxkPnXhe5xC263uGiABmoy6GOifkXob5FnDMNB87wPMqHfpws7VL 0kYNmxveBp17iKg1oQoqwJxnu2jvvcJ6L0u+GG6eB+f693dBP8MYNeyUbQartojp OEkmUlyk6w== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tb-mx1.topicbox.com; arc=none (no signatures found); bimi=skipped (DMARC did not pass); dkim=none (no signatures found); dmarc=none policy.published-domain-policy=none policy.applied-disposition=none policy.evaluated-disposition=none (p=none,d=none,d.eval=none) policy.policy-from=p header.from=kergis.com; iprev=pass smtp.remote-ip=188.165.45.220 (5.mo552.mail-out.ovh.net); spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=tlaronde@kergis.com smtp.helo=5.mo552.mail-out.ovh.net; x-aligned-from=pass (Address match); x-me-sender=none; x-ptr=pass smtp.helo=5.mo552.mail-out.ovh.net policy.ptr=5.mo552.mail-out.ovh.net; x-return-mx=pass header.domain=kergis.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Records found: mx2.ovh.net,mx1.ovh.net,mxb.ovh.net); x-return-mx=pass smtp.domain=kergis.com policy.is_org=yes (MX Records found: mx2.ovh.net,mx1.ovh.net,mxb.ovh.net); x-tls=pass smtp.version=TLSv1.2 smtp.cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 smtp.bits=256/256; x-vs=clean score=0 state=0 X-ME-VSCause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvledrfeduvddguddvlecutefuodetggdotefrod ftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpggftfghnshhusghstghrihgsvgdp uffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepfffhvf fukfhfgggtuggjihesthdtredttddtvdenucfhrhhomhepoehtlhgrrhhonhguvgeskhgv rhhgihhsrdgtohhmqeenucggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpeffheegtdehhfdtvddthfefteefke efffefvedtveelveevvefgtdelhfejjeehkeenucffohhmrghinhepthhophhitggsohig rdgtohhmpdhkvghrghhishdrtghomhdpnhhunhgtqdgvthdqhhhitgdrfhhrnecukfhppe dukeekrdduieehrdeghedrvddvtddpfeejrdehledrudegvddruddthedpvddufedrgeeg rddvgeegrdehleenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepihhnvghtpe dukeekrdduieehrdeghedrvddvtddphhgvlhhopeehrdhmohehhedvrdhmrghilhdqohhu thdrohhvhhdrnhgvthdpmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpeeothhlrghrohhnuggvsehkvghrghhish drtghomheqpdhnsggprhgtphhtthhopedupdhrtghpthhtohepoeelfhgrnhhsseelfhgr nhhsrdhnvghtqe X-ME-VSScore: 0 X-ME-VSCategory: clean Received-SPF: pass (kergis.com: Sender is authorized to use 'tlaronde@kergis.com' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'include:mx.ovh.com' matched)) receiver=tb-mx1.topicbox.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="tlaronde@kergis.com"; helo=5.mo552.mail-out.ovh.net; client-ip=188.165.45.220 Received: from 5.mo552.mail-out.ovh.net (5.mo552.mail-out.ovh.net [188.165.45.220]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tb-mx1.topicbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS for <9fans@9fans.net>; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 14:57:06 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from tlaronde@kergis.com) Received: from mxplan4.mail.ovh.net (unknown [10.109.176.153]) by mo552.mail-out.ovh.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4VzHwK0Wc1z1Lv0 for <9fans@9fans.net>; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 18:57:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: from kergis.com (37.59.142.105) by DAG1EX1.mxp4.local (172.16.2.1) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) id 15.1.2507.39; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 20:57:04 +0200 X-OVh-ClientIp: 213.44.244.59 Received: from cauchy.polynum.local (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cauchy.polynum.local (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPS id 45BIv2Zt026877 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO) for <9fans@9fans.net>; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 20:57:03 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from tlaronde@localhost) by cauchy.polynum.local (8.16.1/8.14.9/Submit) id 45BIv2ds009996 for 9fans@9fans.net; Tue, 11 Jun 2024 20:57:02 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2024 20:57:02 +0200 From: To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: print server Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Originating-IP: [37.59.142.105] X-ClientProxiedBy: DAG8EX2.mxp4.local (172.16.2.16) To DAG1EX1.mxp4.local (172.16.2.1) X-Ovh-Tracer-GUID: 85c9bd04-f28a-455b-8192-8c8b4ce33989 X-Ovh-Tracer-Id: 11385099859042962199 X-VR-SPAMSTATE: OK X-VR-SPAMSCORE: 0 X-VR-SPAMCAUSE: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvledrfeduvddguddvlecutefuodetggdotefrodftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfqggfjpdevjffgvefmvefgnecuuegrihhlohhuthemucehtddtnecunecujfgurhepfffhvffukfhfgggtuggjihesthdtredttddtvdenucfhrhhomhepoehtlhgrrhhonhguvgeskhgvrhhgihhsrdgtohhmqeenucggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpeffheegtdehhfdtvddthfefteefkeefffefvedtveelveevvefgtdelhfejjeehkeenucffohhmrghinhepthhophhitggsohigrdgtohhmpdhkvghrghhishdrtghomhdpnhhunhgtqdgvthdqhhhitgdrfhhrnecukfhppeduvdejrddtrddtrddupdefjedrheelrddugedvrddutdehpddvudefrdeggedrvdeggedrheelnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehinhgvthepuddvjedrtddrtddruddpmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehtlhgrrhhonhguvgeskhgvrhhgihhsrdgtohhmpdhnsggprhgtphhtthhopedupdhrtghpthhtoheplehfrghnsheslehfrghnshdrnhgvthdpoffvtefjohhsthepmhhoheehvddpmhhouggvpehsmhhtphhouhht Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 6a412bfa-2824-11ef-8023-f5401589664e Archived-At: =?UTF-8?B?PGh0dHBzOi8vOWZhbnMudG9waWNib3guY29tL2dyb3Vwcy85?= =?UTF-8?B?ZmFucy9UMDEwNDE3MDM3YmJiN2MyMy1NYjFmMDk3Y2VhODc0NjA0YTk0NjYw?= =?UTF-8?B?MTJkPg==?= List-Help: List-Id: "9fans" <9fans.9fans.net> List-Post: List-Software: Topicbox v0 List-Subscribe: Precedence: list Reply-To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable List-Unsubscribe: , Topicbox-Delivery-ID: 2:9fans:437d30aa-c441-11e9-8a57-d036212d11b0:522be890-2105-11eb-b15e-8d699134e1fa:Mb1f097cea874604a9466012d:1:B_mXPMr2JUKf1yKmLfeVxjzwgwkTBOaWsfh4FZtGS5M On Tue, Jun 11, 2024 at 07:40:50PM +0100, Charles Forsyth wrote: > Jim McKie used to relate how, when he joined Edinburgh's computing > facility, one of his first tasks was to write something to link Unix to t= he > big line printers, which were on EMAS. > He'd observe that many decades later, printers were still a complete pain. > (He used other words but I don't want to corrupt any listening AI.) >=20 And it is still a... pain, and cups is a ton of things wrap around basic ones but removing the simplicity and flexibility. I'm still using (on *BSD; never connected Plan9 to it) the venerable lp with /etc/printcap and following "4.3 BSD Line Printer Spooler Manual". Not to mention that in a network of nodes running different OSes, MS Windows ones manage to not have the exact same driver for the same exact network printer, meaning that a user has to change options when he uses not the same Windows (even with the same OS version...) and that the sharing capabilities of the printers with Windows impose to have the driver on every node: not able to send a generic PostScript or GDI version of a document to whatever node to translate it to code understandable by the end consumer (the printer device). Since I never looked at the printer part of Plan9, the question is naive: are the facilities reminiscent of BSD lp? Because I imagine that it should be relatively easy to send from a Plan9 to a Unix servicing by lpd(8). T. Laronde > On Tue, 11 Jun 2024 at 19:35, Charles Forsyth > wrote: >=20 > > I forgot to add that although the target printer controlled by the serv= er > > is a network printer, it is a shared printer some distance from > > some of the Linux, MacOS, Windows and Chromebook clients (I forgot to > > mention the last two). Chromebooks in particular are a little > > odd if the printer isn't immediately available. Google Cloud Print work= ed > > perfectly but that's no longer available. > > > > On Tue, 11 Jun 2024 at 16:13, Charles Forsyth > > wrote: > > > >> Is anyone using Plan 9 as the print server for Linux and MacOS systems? > >> Currently I'm using a Linux Rpi, but it's CUPS, and I've had my fill of > >> that thing. > >> It's always looking for an excuse to skive. > >> I haven't used the Plan 9 printer code in perhaps a decade, > >> but switching to Plan 9 on Rpi with something running there might work > >> well, > >> or at least I could fix it (compared to having to Google CUPS to find > >> decades old problems unfixed). > >> Probably I should be using systemd-lp these days. > >> --=20 Thierry Laronde http://www.kergis.com/ http://kertex.kergis.com/ http://nunc-et-hic.fr/ Key fingerprint =3D 0FF7 E906 FBAF FE95 FD89 250D 52B1 AE95 6006 F40C ------------------------------------------ 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T010417037bbb7c23-Mb1f09= 7cea874604a9466012d Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription