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From: "Frank D. Engel, Jr." <fde101@fjrhome.net>
To: 9fans@9fans.net
Subject: Re: [9fans] building blocks speaking 9p
Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2022 06:56:38 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <a20edef9-bde2-e0c7-3a69-7f14f6ce3120@fjrhome.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAJSxfmJ-K7iSdGk2+N_tzpm-sae__bXmRMhcFRinNEASMs=U3Q@mail.gmail.com>

Apparently Linux includes drivers for tunneling IP over a USB connection 
(possibly to support mobile phones?  not sure...)

Making host drivers compatible with these (if not already available) to 
share an IP stack and creating the equivalent device-side support for 
the "blocks" would allow 9P to be tunneled not only from these devices 
but also from other existing solutions in a wider variety of ways, also 
making it easier to connect those devices to Linux as there are ways to 
talk 9P from there.

That may open up some additional flexibility?


On 1/29/22 4:16 AM, Skip Tavakkolian wrote:
> I've been working on something along those lines for IoT management
> and networking. Here's my laundry list of architectural and
> implementation pieces:
>
> 1. authentication: (a) tie devices to owner/user (b) authenticate
> users against third parties (via OIDC/SAML2, etc), (c) let the
> authenticated user provide the credentials to authenticate and use
> their devices via a namespace that follows an established convention
> (e.g. /joe/iot/0/secret).
> 2. device and capability discovery is a bootstrapping process,
> starting with a namespace that describes the availability of devices
> and features (analogous to '#c/drivers')
> 3. namespace to discover how to present the data from a particular
> source (e.g. a steam gauge widget would need to understand the
> namespace exported by a pressure sensor)
> 4. 9p libraries including fan-in, fan-out capability (i.e. mount,
> 9pserve) for FreeRTOS, Mbed OS,  ThreadX, Zephyr
> 5. libraries to localize user↔device 9p traffic, while keeping
> authentication centralized (e.g. how @tailscale works)
>
> Initially IoT's would 9p-enable the SPI, I²C, etc. sensors and
> actuators, until standards and conventions are established.
>
> For hardware, targeting things like SAMD21 boards seem more
> appropriate; they're cheap (e.g. Seeed XIAO). Even things like Nordic
> nRF52840 boards are below $10 and include the hardware to establish
> root-of-trust.
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 27, 2022 at 2:58 PM Bakul Shah <bakul@iitbombay.org> wrote:
>> The idea:
>> - make it very easy to create hardware gadgets by
>>    providing a firmware/hardware building block that
>>    talks 9p on the host interface side & interfaces
>>    with device specific hardware.
>>
>> - use a "universal" 9p driver on the host side that
>>    allows access to any such 9p device even from a shell.
>>
>> - provide a standard way to find out device capabilities.
>>
>> - together they provide a plug-and-play setup.
>>
>> Example: connect an LED and a current sensor to this
>> 9p device, other necessary hardware, add a few config
>> bits and plug this device kn]]into a host. Now you should
>> be able to turn on/off the light or sense its state.
>>
>> Similarly you should be able to control a stepper motor
>> servo, cameras, microphones, other actuators, sensors,
>> IO etc. Eventually you should be able to snap together
>> enough of these components to build larger assemblies
>> such as a 3D printer.
>>
>> Another example: a "hub" to multiplex such downstream
>> devices and make them available to a host.
>>
>> This will probably have to ride on USB first. A verilog
>> implementation would be useful in an FPGA!
>>
>> Would this be a useful component? If such a thing were
>> available, what would you want to build with it?
>>
>> Do you think 9p is the right protocol for this?
>>
>> Ideally
>> - connect anything to anything
>> - authenticated connections
>> - drive the device through a shell script
>> - no new low level drivers
>> - self-identifying devices with help and command syntax
>> - signicantly eases the task of creating new h/w devices.
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  reply	other threads:[~2022-01-29 11:57 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 34+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2022-01-27 22:57 Bakul Shah
2022-01-28  2:55 ` Thaddeus Woskowiak
2022-01-28  3:31 ` Lucio De Re
2022-01-28  5:16   ` Bakul Shah
2022-01-28 10:16     ` Lucio De Re
2022-01-28 19:01       ` Charles Forsyth
2022-01-28 21:26         ` Bakul Shah
2022-01-28 21:37           ` Eli Cohen
2022-01-28 20:54       ` Tony Mendoza
2022-01-28 20:59       ` Tony Mendoza
2022-01-28 21:03         ` ori
2022-01-28 21:07           ` Tony Mendoza
2022-01-28 21:06         ` Eli Cohen
2022-01-28 21:16           ` Tony Mendoza
2022-01-28 21:27             ` Eli Cohen
2022-01-28 21:33               ` david
2022-01-28 21:46                 ` Tony Mendoza
2022-01-28 22:23                   ` David Boddie
2022-01-29  1:04                 ` Lyndon Nerenberg (VE7TFX/VE6BBM)
2022-01-29  2:08                   ` David Boddie
2022-01-29  3:36                     ` Tony Mendoza
2022-01-29 18:03                     ` David Boddie
2022-01-29  2:32           ` Thaddeus Woskowiak
2022-01-29 20:04             ` [9fans] aiju boards Lyndon Nerenberg (VE7TFX/VE6BBM)
2022-01-28 19:32   ` [9fans] building blocks speaking 9p Kent R. Spillner
2022-01-28  4:54 ` ori
2022-01-28 20:55 ` Lyndon Nerenberg (VE7TFX/VE6BBM)
2022-01-29  9:16 ` Skip Tavakkolian
2022-01-29 11:56   ` Frank D. Engel, Jr. [this message]
2022-01-29 12:14     ` Frank D. Engel, Jr.
2022-01-29 12:30       ` Frank D. Engel, Jr.
2022-01-29 13:24         ` cinap_lenrek
2022-02-15  3:07 ` Lyndon Nerenberg (VE7TFX/VE6BBM)
2022-01-29 20:53 Lyndon Nerenberg (VE7TFX/VE6BBM)

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