* [9fans] revision control @ 2006-01-23 22:50 Chris Silva 2006-01-23 23:09 ` uriel 0 siblings, 1 reply; 27+ messages in thread From: Chris Silva @ 2006-01-23 22:50 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 9fans Forgive my ignorance but are there any alternatives to the CVS port? I suppose I could use replica but that doesn't seem proper. Thanks, Chris ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-23 22:50 [9fans] revision control Chris Silva @ 2006-01-23 23:09 ` uriel 2006-01-23 23:18 ` Ronald G Minnich 0 siblings, 1 reply; 27+ messages in thread From: uriel @ 2006-01-23 23:09 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 9fans > Forgive my ignorance but are there any alternatives to the CVS port? I > suppose I could use replica but that doesn't seem proper. See yesterday(1) and history(1). uriel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-23 23:09 ` uriel @ 2006-01-23 23:18 ` Ronald G Minnich 2006-01-23 23:37 ` Dan Cross ` (2 more replies) 0 siblings, 3 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: Ronald G Minnich @ 2006-01-23 23:18 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs uriel@cat-v.org wrote: >>Forgive my ignorance but are there any alternatives to the CVS port? I >>suppose I could use replica but that doesn't seem proper. > > See yesterday(1) and history(1). These are wonderful things, don't get me wrong, but they're not really good enough to be an SCM. CVS is ok. The xen guys use mercurial now, which is written in python, and seems to work well. Could this python system be ported to python on plan 9? ron ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-23 23:18 ` Ronald G Minnich @ 2006-01-23 23:37 ` Dan Cross 2006-01-24 0:02 ` Christopher Nielsen ` (2 more replies) 2006-01-23 23:42 ` Paul Lalonde 2006-01-24 1:07 ` uriel 2 siblings, 3 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: Dan Cross @ 2006-01-23 23:37 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs uriel@cat-v.org wrote: > See yesterday(1) and history(1). As Ron said, that's not really sufficient. You loose a lot with the dump filesystem; log messages, branching, granularity, etc. It's an answer, but not a universally good one. But, more to the point, snappy one-liners like the above just smack of elitism and don't convey any real information. Just because it's not the fashionable way to do something in the Plan 9 world doesn't mean it may not be necessary due to circumstances beyond an individual's control. Yeah, I've done enough elitist bitching in my time, too, but ultimately, did anyone benefit? Not really. On Mon, Jan 23, 2006 at 04:18:36PM -0700, Ronald G Minnich wrote: > CVS is ok. > > The xen guys use mercurial now, which is written in python, and seems to > work well. Could this python system be ported to python on plan 9? I like Subversion; it's a decent tool and has a textual on-disk representation reminescent of RCS files. It appears to be, ``CVS done right.'' Sure, some things are suboptimal, but on the whole, it's pleasant enough to work with. But it requires the Apache runtime, which I guess would be non-trivial to port (because it's big and requires more patience than I have). Personally, I'd like to see ports of unison and subversion to Plan 9. That'd make me a happy guy. Of course, I'd also like to have a machine running Plan 9 again. That'd also make me a happy guy. Oh yeah, and time to mess with it, too. And time to reply to people who try and help me out of 9fans (hi, Erik!). Mainly, it's a time thing. - Dan C. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-23 23:37 ` Dan Cross @ 2006-01-24 0:02 ` Christopher Nielsen 2006-01-24 0:54 ` Charles Forsyth 2006-01-24 0:04 ` Ronald G Minnich [not found] ` <000301c6207f$763f4070$14aaa8c0@utelsystems.local> 2 siblings, 1 reply; 27+ messages in thread From: Christopher Nielsen @ 2006-01-24 0:02 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs On Mon, Jan 23, 2006 at 06:37:20PM -0500, Dan Cross wrote: > > I like Subversion; it's a decent tool and has a textual on-disk > representation reminescent of RCS files. It appears to be, ``CVS done > right.'' Sure, some things are suboptimal, but on the whole, it's > pleasant enough to work with. But it requires the Apache runtime, > which I guess would be non-trivial to port (because it's big and > requires more patience than I have). My last full-time tech job, I worked at the company that funds the development of Subversion by employing the core developers. Everyone knew I really liked Plan 9, and there was talk then about portin the Apache Runtime to Plan 9. It didn't happen mostly because I didn't have time; I was too busy on the ops side to do much dev. You get Apache for free if you port APR; I'm not sure if that's good or bad. -- Christopher Nielsen "They who can give up essential liberty for temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." --Benjamin Franklin ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-24 0:02 ` Christopher Nielsen @ 2006-01-24 0:54 ` Charles Forsyth 2006-01-24 3:19 ` Skip Tavakkolian 2006-01-25 7:36 ` Dave Eckhardt 0 siblings, 2 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: Charles Forsyth @ 2006-01-24 0:54 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 9fans i think it would be possible, and might be interesting, to do a file system type (or types) that did better what these things are trying to do. in particular, the disadvantage of most of the systems i've used in the past, with the exception of Clearcase, which i used only briefly (but was largely file-system based), is that they were neither automatic nor invisible. furthermore, i've found the scope of most systems (again Clearcase was an exception) to be insufficient, compared to the use of a time machine, as hume observed many years ago. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-24 0:54 ` Charles Forsyth @ 2006-01-24 3:19 ` Skip Tavakkolian 2006-01-24 2:38 ` Ronald G Minnich 2006-01-24 8:33 ` Steve Simon 2006-01-25 7:36 ` Dave Eckhardt 1 sibling, 2 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: Skip Tavakkolian @ 2006-01-24 3:19 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 9fans this gets my vote. i've not tried cvsfs to understand the user experience; assuming it is not limited, perhaps the internal format could stay cvs. > i think it would be possible, and might be interesting, to do a file > system type (or types) that did better what these things are trying to do. > in particular, the disadvantage of most of the systems i've used > in the past, with the exception of Clearcase, which i used only > briefly (but was largely file-system based), > is that they were neither automatic nor invisible. > furthermore, i've found the scope of most systems (again Clearcase > was an exception) to be insufficient, compared to the use > of a time machine, as hume observed many years ago. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-24 3:19 ` Skip Tavakkolian @ 2006-01-24 2:38 ` Ronald G Minnich 2006-01-24 8:33 ` Steve Simon 1 sibling, 0 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: Ronald G Minnich @ 2006-01-24 2:38 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs Skip Tavakkolian wrote: > this gets my vote. i've not tried cvsfs to understand the user > experience; assuming it is not limited, perhaps the internal format > could stay cvs. > > >>i think it would be possible, and might be interesting, to do a file >>system type (or types) that did better what these things are trying to do. >>in particular, the disadvantage of most of the systems i've used >>in the past, with the exception of Clearcase, which i used only >>briefly (but was largely file-system based), >>is that they were neither automatic nor invisible. >>furthermore, i've found the scope of most systems (again Clearcase >>was an exception) to be insufficient, compared to the use >>of a time machine, as hume observed many years ago. > > Where cvs fell down for us (well, the place it was worse for us; it was pretty awful in so many ways ...) was that commits were not atomic. So, you get half way through, it fails, oh too bad, your tree is now in an inconsistent state. bummer. maybe subversion code is ugly, I don't know, I just use the it. Where it has been useful to a number of projects is that once you commit, you get a simple integer back, and you can us that little number to get any version you want. The state of the tree is consistent at that point. Ah well, this has turned into another low signal-to-noise ratio, full of pointless quotes and naughty words, discussion that seems to characterise 9fans from time to time. ron ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-24 3:19 ` Skip Tavakkolian 2006-01-24 2:38 ` Ronald G Minnich @ 2006-01-24 8:33 ` Steve Simon 2006-01-24 10:24 ` Skip Tavakkolian 1 sibling, 1 reply; 27+ messages in thread From: Steve Simon @ 2006-01-24 8:33 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 9fans > i've not tried cvsfs to understand the user > experience; assuming it is not limited, perhaps the internal format > could stay cvs. Not sure, but I think there may be a misunderstanding, cvsfs creates a dump-like filesystem (with a ChangeLog) from a network connection to a remote cvs file server, not by parsing the repository directly. WRT CVS, I use it at work but often wish I could move the projects to a plan9 fileserver and use dump. As Uriel says I would want some more tools but nothing major. my 2¢ worth -Steve ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-24 8:33 ` Steve Simon @ 2006-01-24 10:24 ` Skip Tavakkolian 2006-01-24 10:53 ` Charles Forsyth 0 siblings, 1 reply; 27+ messages in thread From: Skip Tavakkolian @ 2006-01-24 10:24 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 9fans in respect to cvsfs, i meant that the user interface part would remain the same - minus the read-only aspect of the "dump-like" file system. the internals would change so that it would mount a cvs parsing service. in my muddled thinking i was imagining something like upasfs that could parse each rcs file and the cvsfs would just build a filter for the right names for each version and serve that as an fs. i agree about kenfs. that's all we use here. With several people having a hand in the code the only person so far that has managed to merge poorly has been me. thankfully i can always retract my changes. > WRT CVS, I use it at work but often wish I could move the projects to > a plan9 fileserver and use dump. As Uriel says I would want some more > tools but nothing major. > > my 2¢ worth ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-24 10:24 ` Skip Tavakkolian @ 2006-01-24 10:53 ` Charles Forsyth 0 siblings, 0 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: Charles Forsyth @ 2006-01-24 10:53 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 9fans > i agree about kenfs. that's all we use here. With several people > having a hand in the code the only person so far that has managed to > merge poorly has been me. thankfully i can always retract my changes. i can believe, as others have suggested here, that just using dump/snap alone isn't quite sufficient for some functions, and might not scale well, especially in larger development environments. that's why i wondered whether another service (or services) could provide the extra support in as unobtrusive way as the dump currently does, and with a similar all-encompassing scope. i admit it would be hard to beat mercurial for size (and i think it's a good example why people use python or ruby) but it hasn't the same scope and certainty as dump. it's actually dump's certainty that i find compensates for such limitations (for me), but that isn't to say those limitations don't exist. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-24 0:54 ` Charles Forsyth 2006-01-24 3:19 ` Skip Tavakkolian @ 2006-01-25 7:36 ` Dave Eckhardt 2006-01-25 14:25 ` Wes Kussmaul 1 sibling, 1 reply; 27+ messages in thread From: Dave Eckhardt @ 2006-01-25 7:36 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 9fans > i think it would be possible, and might be interesting, to do a file > system type (or types) that did better what these things are trying > to do. One piece of work in this area is VESTA: http://gatekeeper.dec.com/pub/DEC/SRC/technical-notes/SRC-1999-001.pdf http://www.research.compaq.com/SRC/vesta Dave Eckhardt ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-25 7:36 ` Dave Eckhardt @ 2006-01-25 14:25 ` Wes Kussmaul 0 siblings, 0 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: Wes Kussmaul @ 2006-01-25 14:25 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1148 bytes --] Dave Eckhardt wrote: >>i think it would be possible, and might be interesting, to do a file >>system type (or types) that did better what these things are trying >>to do. >> >> > >One piece of work in this area is VESTA: > http://gatekeeper.dec.com/pub/DEC/SRC/technical-notes/SRC-1999-001.pdf > http://www.research.compaq.com/SRC/vesta > > That second url doesn't seem to work, but I found http://www.vestasys.org/ -- Wes Kussmaul CIO The Village Group 738 Main Street Waltham, MA 02451 781-647-7178 My uncle likes to say that the world's biggest troubles started when the serpent said, "Try this fruit, and by the way if a bunch of people collectively calling themselves Arthur Andersen signs something it's the same as if a person named Arthur Andersen signed it." I don't get the serpent and fruit part. Must be some Swiss mythology thing. He can be a bit obscure. P.K. Iggy _How I Like Fixed The Internet_ (Tales from the Great Infodepression of 2009 and the prosperity that followed) [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1903 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-23 23:37 ` Dan Cross 2006-01-24 0:02 ` Christopher Nielsen @ 2006-01-24 0:04 ` Ronald G Minnich 2006-01-24 1:17 ` Charles Forsyth 2006-01-24 2:19 ` uriel [not found] ` <000301c6207f$763f4070$14aaa8c0@utelsystems.local> 2 siblings, 2 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: Ronald G Minnich @ 2006-01-24 0:04 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs Dan Cross wrote: > But, more to the point, snappy > one-liners like the above just smack of elitism and don't convey any > real information. Just because it's not the fashionable way to do > something in the Plan 9 world doesn't mean it may not be necessary due > to circumstances beyond an individual's control. yes, it's a plan 9 problem. "We don't have it, so it must not be good". Sometimes, it's true; not having a lot of stupid things is a plus on Plan 9. Other times, however, we don't have things that we ought. Subversion is very nice. You don't really need apache, andrey has set up svn on xcpu.org without apache. i have no idea of how much work it is to port, except ... it's c++, I think. mercurial might be easier. don't know. ron ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-24 0:04 ` Ronald G Minnich @ 2006-01-24 1:17 ` Charles Forsyth 2006-01-24 2:06 ` andrey mirtchovski 2006-01-24 2:19 ` uriel 1 sibling, 1 reply; 27+ messages in thread From: Charles Forsyth @ 2006-01-24 1:17 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 9fans > yes, it's a plan 9 problem. "We don't have it, so it must not be good". > Sometimes, it's true; not having a lot of stupid things is a plus on > Plan 9. Other times, however, we don't have things that we ought. oh yes, but it depends what those `things' are. as in the exchange two years ago: > audio support! i've never had audio on Plan 9, few people do ... That's really sad, and shows how we've lost our way. The only reason there was a Plan 9 is because someone wanted a way to store and play chess endgames and old rock and roll. frankly, revision control is like any other form of accountancy--worthy but dull. audio and video? now you're talking(!) more strange devices! odd applications! why can't we live a little, before it's too late and we're all absorbed into Web Services. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-24 1:17 ` Charles Forsyth @ 2006-01-24 2:06 ` andrey mirtchovski 0 siblings, 0 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: andrey mirtchovski @ 2006-01-24 2:06 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs > audio and video? now you're talking(!) more strange devices! odd applications! > why can't we live a little, before it's too late and we're all absorbed into Web Services. we're working on it. stay tuned(!) :) ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-24 0:04 ` Ronald G Minnich 2006-01-24 1:17 ` Charles Forsyth @ 2006-01-24 2:19 ` uriel 2006-01-24 2:34 ` Ronald G Minnich 1 sibling, 1 reply; 27+ messages in thread From: uriel @ 2006-01-24 2:19 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 9fans > Dan Cross wrote: >> But, more to the point, snappy >> one-liners like the above just smack of elitism and don't convey any >> real information. Just because it's not the fashionable way to do >> something in the Plan 9 world doesn't mean it may not be necessary due >> to circumstances beyond an individual's control. > > yes, it's a plan 9 problem. "We don't have it, so it must not be good". That is presumptuous, to say the least, some of us have had to deal with that crap for way longer than it's healthy, and are still recovering (ditto for all the misinformed talk that always goes around about web browsers) I might not be the brightest person around, but I can smell shit when I have had to swim thru various Km of it. > Sometimes, it's true; not having a lot of stupid things is a plus on > Plan 9. Other times, however, we don't have things that we ought. Sorry, but I come from there, and I can tell you currently all VCS in Unix are _SHIT_, with the possible exceptions of Mercurial, Darcs and Git (in that order, mercurial is the only one I can use without being overwhelmed with nausea, and we use it for wmii and I plan to use it for kencc). And I still think Plan 9 doesn't need them, maybe it needs some small tools built around patch and yesterday/history, but even that has been demonstrated to not be a big problem for the development of Plan 9. Have you seen /n/sources/contrib/extra/changes? I'm sure patch(1) could be improved a lot, but it works well enough so far, and there are much more important things to do. > Subversion is very nice. You don't really need apache, andrey has set up > svn on xcpu.org without apache. I will quote viro: (http://www.uwsg.indiana.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0210.0/2508.html) | Damn you. That thread got me to download subversion source and read it - | mistake I won't repeat any time soon. I've spent several months wading | through fairly disgusting code - block device drivers are not pretty, | ditto for devfs. I had more than once found myself grabbing Lovecraft | to read something that would be less nightmare-inducing. But _THAT_ takes | the fscking cake - I don't _care_ what Larry (or anybody else for that | matter) does to people who had excreted that code. No, wait - I _do_ care. | I want video of the... event. | | I don't use BK, but you can be damn sure that I won't touch SVN. Ever. > i have no idea of how much work it is to port, except ... it's c++, I think. The design and implementation of Subversion should be taught in every engineering class, as the best example(except maybe Apache 2) of Second System Effect abomination. Quoting from a recent comparison of many versions control systems: "Subversion is out of the running. [...] it's massively overengineered and fragile, and it has as many sketchy entanglements as a submariner on a weekend's shore leave."[1] There are similar comments all over the net for anyone that bothers to minimally research the subject, or just go for the source, as viro did, but you will regret it. > mercurial might be easier. don't know. Mercurial is probably trivial to port, 7000 lines of Python without any other external dependencies. (Svn is around 150.000 of convoluted C, plus dependencies in about every braindamaged XML/threading/DB library you can dream of) If you want lunix, you know where to find it; I come from spending there a long time, and I'm certainly not going back, even if I have to be the last Plan 9 user on earth. And now I'm done with this thread, it's been discussed before, and it's a waste of time to go over it again, go dig the 9fans archives if you like. Paraphrasing 20h's question in #plan9: how many of you, asking for a VCS in this thread, use Plan 9 every day? uriel [1] http://www.serpentine.com/blog/software/mercurial.html ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-24 2:19 ` uriel @ 2006-01-24 2:34 ` Ronald G Minnich 0 siblings, 0 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: Ronald G Minnich @ 2006-01-24 2:34 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs uriel@cat-v.org wrote: > Paraphrasing 20h's question in #plan9: how many of you, asking for a > VCS in this thread, use Plan 9 every day? me. That is a senseless question, in my view. ron ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
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* Re: [9fans] revision control [not found] ` <000301c6207f$763f4070$14aaa8c0@utelsystems.local> @ 2006-01-24 8:00 ` "Nils O. Selåsdal" 0 siblings, 0 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: "Nils O. Selåsdal" @ 2006-01-24 8:00 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs Ronald G Minnich wrote: > Dan Cross wrote: >> But, more to the point, snappy >> one-liners like the above just smack of elitism and don't convey any >> real information. Just because it's not the fashionable way to do >> something in the Plan 9 world doesn't mean it may not be necessary due >> to circumstances beyond an individual's control. > > yes, it's a plan 9 problem. "We don't have it, so it must not be good". > Sometimes, it's true; not having a lot of stupid things is a plus on > Plan 9. Other times, however, we don't have things that we ought. > > Subversion is very nice. You don't really need apache, andrey has set up > svn on xcpu.org without apache. > > i have no idea of how much work it is to port, except ... it's c++, I > think. It's C. You need to port the apr/apr-util library first, most things are built on top of those libraries. People seem to fancy darcs too these days. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-23 23:18 ` Ronald G Minnich 2006-01-23 23:37 ` Dan Cross @ 2006-01-23 23:42 ` Paul Lalonde 2006-01-23 23:55 ` Christopher Nielsen 2006-01-24 1:07 ` uriel 2 siblings, 1 reply; 27+ messages in thread From: Paul Lalonde @ 2006-01-23 23:42 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs On 23-Jan-06, at 3:18 PM, Ronald G Minnich wrote: > These are wonderful things, don't get me wrong, but they're not > really good enough to be an SCM. Agreed. > CVS is ok. Barely. I can't believe how difficult it is to put together a good revision control system. The last couple of months were an interesting recapitulation of revision control for me. Started a new job, at a startup, without an SCM. CVS it was, and within the first branch/integrate cycle we were using Subversion. A month later we've dropped coin on Perforce just for it's ability to manage branches and integrations in a sane way - something I haven't seen in any of the open source offerings. The key problem is that most of the open source seem to support the open source development model: one person does all the integration into the main branch, usually re-writing the bulk of the change on the way through. Integration into dev branches is rare, done only (it seems) at releases. Heck, dev branches seem rare, and frequently seem to be interpreted as forks rather than concurrent efforts. Instead, at least in my work, dev branches are common: I run 2-3 at a time, corresponding to different bugs/features that I'm working on at the moment. Integration into the main tree happens 2-3 times a week, integrations from the main tree daily. The other developers do the same - integration *has* to work smoothly in that kind of environment. If only subversion could understand what changes had and hadn't been applied to various branches. Does anyone know an alternative to Perforce (which doesn't work so well disconnected) that does branching and integration so easily? Paul ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-23 23:42 ` Paul Lalonde @ 2006-01-23 23:55 ` Christopher Nielsen 0 siblings, 0 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: Christopher Nielsen @ 2006-01-23 23:55 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs On Mon, Jan 23, 2006 at 03:42:37PM -0800, Paul Lalonde wrote: > > If only subversion could understand what changes had and hadn't been > applied to various branches. > > Does anyone know an alternative to Perforce (which doesn't work so > well disconnected) that does branching and integration so easily? you might have a look at codeville http://www.codeville.org/. i haven't used it extensively, but it tries to solve some of the complaints you have about subversion. -- Christopher Nielsen "They who can give up essential liberty for temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." --Benjamin Franklin ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-23 23:18 ` Ronald G Minnich 2006-01-23 23:37 ` Dan Cross 2006-01-23 23:42 ` Paul Lalonde @ 2006-01-24 1:07 ` uriel 2 siblings, 0 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: uriel @ 2006-01-24 1:07 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 9fans > uriel@cat-v.org wrote: >>>Forgive my ignorance but are there any alternatives to the CVS port? I >>>suppose I could use replica but that doesn't seem proper. >> >> See yesterday(1) and history(1). > > > These are wonderful things, don't get me wrong, but they're not really > good enough to be an SCM. > > CVS is ok. > > The xen guys use mercurial now, which is written in python, and seems to > work well. Could this python system be ported to python on plan 9? The question is, do we need it? I have used mercurial, and it's far better than any of the hideous alternatives in Lunix, but I don't think Plan 9 needs it. uriel ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control @ 2006-01-26 2:25 FernanBolando 2006-01-26 2:44 ` David Leimbach 2006-01-26 15:53 ` "Nils O. Selåsdal" 0 siblings, 2 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: FernanBolando @ 2006-01-26 2:25 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/html, Size: 1761 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-26 2:25 FernanBolando @ 2006-01-26 2:44 ` David Leimbach 2006-01-26 15:53 ` "Nils O. Selåsdal" 1 sibling, 0 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: David Leimbach @ 2006-01-26 2:44 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1433 bytes --] On 1/25/06, FernanBolando@astec-power.com <FernanBolando@astec-power.com> wrote: > > From: Ronald G Minnich rminnich@lanl.gov > >Dan Cross wrote: > >> But, more to the point, snappy > >> one-liners like the above just smack of elitism and don't convey any > >> real information. Just because it's not the fashionable way to do > >> something in the Plan 9 world doesn't mean it may not be necessary due > >> to circumstances beyond an individual's control. > > > >yes, it's a plan 9 problem. "We don't have it, so it must not be good". > >Sometimes, it's true; not having a lot of stupid things is a plus on > >Plan 9. Other times, however, we don't have things that we ought. > > > >Subversion is very nice. You don't really need apache, andrey has set up > >svn on xcpu.org without apache. > > > >i have no idea of how much work it is to port, except ... it's c++, I > think. > > >mercurial might be easier. don't know. > > In linux I use darcs it's written in haskell. I tried once or twice to > look into > ghc source and try to get it running under plan9 so I can run darcs but > failed. > I dont have much experience with haskell except for darcs. > > Maybe someone with more knowledge with haskell can take a look. > > ,Fernan > You are supposed to be able to generate some intermediate C to port haskell to new platforms. I took a swipe at this once... it did not go well :) Dave [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 3253 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-26 2:25 FernanBolando 2006-01-26 2:44 ` David Leimbach @ 2006-01-26 15:53 ` "Nils O. Selåsdal" 2006-01-26 16:27 ` uriel 1 sibling, 1 reply; 27+ messages in thread From: "Nils O. Selåsdal" @ 2006-01-26 15:53 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs FernanBolando@astec-power.com wrote: > From: Ronald G Minnich rminnich@lanl.gov <mailto:rminnich@lanl.gov> > >Dan Cross wrote: > >> But, more to the point, snappy > >> one-liners like the above just smack of elitism and don't convey any > >> real information. Just because it's not the fashionable way to do > >> something in the Plan 9 world doesn't mean it may not be necessary due > >> to circumstances beyond an individual's control. > > > >yes, it's a plan 9 problem. "We don't have it, so it must not be good". > >Sometimes, it's true; not having a lot of stupid things is a plus on > >Plan 9. Other times, however, we don't have things that we ought. > > > >Subversion is very nice. You don't really need apache, andrey has set up > >svn on xcpu.org without apache. > > > >i have no idea of how much work it is to port, except ... it's c++, I > think. > > >mercurial might be easier. don't know. > > In linux I use darcs it's written in haskell. I tried once or twice to > look into > ghc source and try to get it running under plan9 so I can run darcs but > failed. > I dont have much experience with haskell except for darcs. > > Maybe someone with more knowledge with haskell can take a look. There's an old port of hugs at http://pages.cpsc.ucalgary.ca/~mirtchov/p9/hugs/ It might do, or not. At any rate, hugs looks a bit friendlier to port than ghc. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-26 15:53 ` "Nils O. Selåsdal" @ 2006-01-26 16:27 ` uriel 2006-01-27 23:29 ` andrey mirtchovski 0 siblings, 1 reply; 27+ messages in thread From: uriel @ 2006-01-26 16:27 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 9fans > There's an old port of hugs at > http://pages.cpsc.ucalgary.ca/~mirtchov/p9/hugs/ As far as I know that site might go away any moment, all the stuff there is(or should be) in: /n/sources/contrib/andrey/ There are enough pointers all over the net to that site, please lets not add more. Andrey: it would be nice if you could replace the whole site with a note pointing to sources, also I think there are some bits (documentation in particular) that are missing from sources. And I hope this serves of example to everyone else: Please don't put things on random sites all over the place, use sources/contrib instead. uriel - tired of fixing broken links ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
* Re: [9fans] revision control 2006-01-26 16:27 ` uriel @ 2006-01-27 23:29 ` andrey mirtchovski 0 siblings, 0 replies; 27+ messages in thread From: andrey mirtchovski @ 2006-01-27 23:29 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs the site has moved in its entirety to http://www.sdgm.net/who/andrey/p9 (thanks to Dan Cross). i'll put redirection at ucalgary once i get around to it. i would like to extend my gratitude to uriel for fixing all the broken links. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 27+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2006-01-27 23:29 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 27+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed) -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2006-01-23 22:50 [9fans] revision control Chris Silva 2006-01-23 23:09 ` uriel 2006-01-23 23:18 ` Ronald G Minnich 2006-01-23 23:37 ` Dan Cross 2006-01-24 0:02 ` Christopher Nielsen 2006-01-24 0:54 ` Charles Forsyth 2006-01-24 3:19 ` Skip Tavakkolian 2006-01-24 2:38 ` Ronald G Minnich 2006-01-24 8:33 ` Steve Simon 2006-01-24 10:24 ` Skip Tavakkolian 2006-01-24 10:53 ` Charles Forsyth 2006-01-25 7:36 ` Dave Eckhardt 2006-01-25 14:25 ` Wes Kussmaul 2006-01-24 0:04 ` Ronald G Minnich 2006-01-24 1:17 ` Charles Forsyth 2006-01-24 2:06 ` andrey mirtchovski 2006-01-24 2:19 ` uriel 2006-01-24 2:34 ` Ronald G Minnich [not found] ` <000301c6207f$763f4070$14aaa8c0@utelsystems.local> 2006-01-24 8:00 ` "Nils O. Selåsdal" 2006-01-23 23:42 ` Paul Lalonde 2006-01-23 23:55 ` Christopher Nielsen 2006-01-24 1:07 ` uriel 2006-01-26 2:25 FernanBolando 2006-01-26 2:44 ` David Leimbach 2006-01-26 15:53 ` "Nils O. Selåsdal" 2006-01-26 16:27 ` uriel 2006-01-27 23:29 ` andrey mirtchovski
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