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To: 9fans@9fans.net References: <4FB3A3BB-1CFA-4BC7-9DC2-CC9138B8325C@gmail.com> <2ff4cb73-352f-44e1-844b-5bb6cc92e1fe@posixcafe.org> <04a0afc1-6440-47b3-957c-0071ad88b117@posixcafe.org> Content-Language: en-US From: Jacob Moody In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Topicbox-Policy-Reasoning: allow: sender is a member Topicbox-Message-UUID: 03de5d62-12dd-11ef-b38e-2310008c7b06 Archived-At: =?UTF-8?B?PGh0dHBzOi8vOWZhbnMudG9waWNib3guY29tL2dyb3Vwcy85?= =?UTF-8?B?ZmFucy9UYWQzZGMwYzkzMDM5YTdkMi1NMDU2NWJmZjhkOTY3YmUxMTc3MTYw?= =?UTF-8?B?MWI2Pg==?= List-Help: List-Id: "9fans" <9fans.9fans.net> List-Post: List-Software: Topicbox v0 List-Subscribe: Precedence: list Reply-To: 9fans <9fans@9fans.net> List-Unsubscribe: , Topicbox-Delivery-ID: 2:9fans:437d30aa-c441-11e9-8a57-d036212d11b0:522be890-2105-11eb-b15e-8d699134e1fa:M0565bff8d967be11771601b6:1:DK5TvNfo-6LiX9sj8xpL00EOb4kCO48dnzbXm7JiXoQ On 5/15/24 11:20, Don Bailey wrote: >=20 > I have zero emotional attachment to Fossil. What I am asking for, not eve= n demanding, is a fact-based assessment of the asserted issue. Pointing at = the code is not an emotional attachment. It's literally the opposite. It's = asking to demonstrate and document the issues, instead of asserting that so= mething is awful because /you/ have had an emotional reaction to it failing= . How did it fail? Can you reproduce it? What code is bad? Why is the code = bad? If you can't answer=C2=A0these questions, maybe you > shouldn't have removed it.=C2=A0 The emotional accusation I understand, it really seems like it's just fossi= l that evokes this reaction out of people. Just fossil that makes people want us to prove with= out any reason of doubt that the code should have been removed. I also just don't understand why people are = so attached to fossil. Is it because people feel like there is a high burden of evidence for touch= ing the holy code as ordained by bell labs? We didn't want it so it went. If you think this i= s actually a mistake and there is a world of possibility to be had thanks to fossil in P= lan 9 I encourage you to maintain fossil yourself and prove to us that we were wrong in think= ing it was dead weight. I want to specifically compare the discussion that happened on this thread = between p9sk1 and fossil. We think that no one should be using p9sk1, and so we spent the= time to explain to others the very real, concrete and specific issues with the code and imp= lementation. We are not telling any other user of Plan 9 to not use fossil if they'd lik= e, we simply don't want to deal with it in 9front. I think the burden of proof you are putting on us t= o make this decision would only make sense if we were advocating for other distribution= s and current users of fossil to no longer use it. It's fine, we're just not interested i= n it, sorry. As I, and others, have pointed out now a couple of times. Adding fossil bac= k to 9front is trivial. Perhaps you haven't had the experience of having to sit in irc = and help new users get going with the system who really don't have opinions about an= ything and then dealing with the outcomes when things blow up. As you said fossil is n= ot exactly easy to deal with, it needs a lot of special consideration. So why then are= you complaining that 9front made the decision to remove that option for the uninformed user= ? Does it not make more sense to direct users towards a filesystem that is more resilient= and requires less watering? All of this is entirely moot with gefs right around the corner. I can't ima= gine someone willingly want to use fossil with gefs as a (soon to be) alternative. ------------------------------------------ 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tad3dc0c93039a7d2-M0565b= ff8d967be11771601b6 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription