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From: C H Forsyth <forsyth@vitanuova.com>
To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu
Subject: Re: [9fans] speaking of kenc
Date: Fri,  4 May 2007 10:24:03 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <ee84f61de310fd9a32418834d0e0da5d@vitanuova.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <b952c2ad7757d8665d735f788b91674e@coraid.com>

having to code anything in assembler is a significant sign of failure:
if it's on a general-puprose processor, we have failed to educate processor designers;
if it's on (say) a DSP, it's a bit of a mixture of that and people thinking that
language design stopped with C, so the language provides too little scope for a compiler sensibly to do the work.

as a small example of the first case, there are special device control registers on some
models of the power pc. these are essential for IO but require special instructions to access
them (even though the same devices often have memory-mapped IO space
as well). worse, the register (device) address is part of the instruction,
not an operand. (it's the same fault as the old SPARC's mmu control instructions.)
only recently has an instruction been added that allows the device register number
to be taken from a general-purpose register, but that seems mainly to have been
added because they'd run out of address space in the instruction.
stunning (in every sense).   i pick on that one because the DCRs were ADDED relatively late
in the powerpc history.  perhaps it was just a form of mid-life crisis.


  reply	other threads:[~2007-05-04  9:24 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 149+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2007-04-27  3:08 erik quanstrom
2007-04-27  3:44 ` David Leimbach
2007-04-27  4:56   ` Bruce Ellis
2007-04-27  6:21     ` Skip Tavakkolian
2007-04-27  4:54 ` Joel C. Salomon
2007-04-27  4:58   ` Bruce Ellis
2007-04-27 11:00   ` Charles Forsyth
2007-04-27 13:49     ` David Leimbach
2007-04-27 16:23       ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2007-04-29  2:02         ` erik quanstrom
2007-04-29  2:55           ` Tim Wiess
2007-04-29  6:42             ` Uriel
2007-04-29 20:47           ` Charles Forsyth
2007-04-30  8:29           ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2007-04-30 13:08             ` Uriel
2007-05-01  0:22             ` erik quanstrom
2007-05-01 14:45               ` Jon Snader
2007-05-01 14:56                 ` Devon H. O'Dell
2007-05-01 15:12                   ` erik quanstrom
2007-05-01 15:29                     ` Devon H. O'Dell
2007-05-01 21:32                   ` Jon Snader
2007-05-02  0:04                   ` Derek Fawcus
2007-05-02  8:44                     ` Charles Forsyth
2007-05-01 15:51                 ` Anthony Sorace
2007-05-02  8:32                   ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2007-05-02  9:00                     ` Steve Simon
2007-05-03  1:32                       ` David Arnold
2007-05-03  3:39                         ` Adrian Tritschler
2007-05-03  3:57                           ` Paul Lalonde
2007-05-03  4:11                             ` Federico Benavento
2007-05-03 13:34                               ` Anthony Sorace
2007-05-03 22:04                               ` LiteStar numnums
2007-05-04  1:45                               ` Roman Shaposhnick
2007-05-04  1:51                                 ` Lyndon Nerenberg
2007-05-04  2:00                                 ` erik quanstrom
2007-05-04  2:08                                   ` Roman Shaposhnick
2007-05-04  2:12                                     ` Lyndon Nerenberg
2007-05-04  2:20                                       ` Roman Shaposhnick
2007-05-04  2:35                                         ` Lyndon Nerenberg
2007-05-04  6:53                                           ` Bruce Ellis
2007-05-05  4:49                                             ` Roman Shaposhnick
2007-05-05  5:11                                           ` Roman Shaposhnick
2007-05-05  5:14                                             ` Bruce Ellis
2007-05-05 18:52                                               ` erik quanstrom
2007-05-05 19:13                                                 ` lucio
2007-05-05 23:09                                                   ` Bruce Ellis
2007-05-06  1:24                                                     ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  4:08                                                   ` erik quanstrom
2007-05-06  4:53                                                     ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06  5:01                                                     ` lucio
2007-05-06  5:01                                                     ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  5:07                                                       ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  5:15                                                         ` lucio
2007-05-06  5:37                                                           ` Bruce Ellis
2007-05-06  6:30                                                           ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  6:46                                                             ` lucio
2007-05-06  6:49                                                             ` lucio
2007-05-06  7:35                                                               ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  6:51                                                             ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06 10:25                                                               ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  6:04                                                         ` Skip Tavakkolian
2007-05-06  7:24                                                           ` lucio
2007-05-06 11:47                                                             ` Bruce Ellis
2007-05-07  1:55                                                           ` Roman Shaposhnik
2007-05-06  5:12                                                       ` lucio
2007-05-06 13:18                                                         ` Richard Miller
2007-05-06 20:23                                                           ` Roman Shaposhnik
2007-05-07  1:57                                                         ` Roman Shaposhnik
2007-05-07  4:29                                                           ` W B Hacker
2007-05-07 15:08                                                             ` Tim Wiess
2007-05-06  5:15                                                       ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06  7:43                                                         ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  8:02                                                           ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06  8:12                                                             ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  9:00                                                               ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06  8:03                                                           ` lucio
2007-05-06  8:42                                                             ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06 10:20                                                               ` matt
2007-05-06 10:29                                                                 ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  9:09                                                             ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06  5:10                                                     ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06  5:32                                                       ` lucio
2007-05-06  6:18                                                         ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  6:30                                                           ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06  6:21                                                         ` W B Hacker
2007-05-07  1:47                                                     ` Roman Shaposhnik
2007-05-06  1:13                                               ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  3:31                                                 ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06  4:10                                                 ` erik quanstrom
2007-05-06  4:55                                                   ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  5:10                                                     ` lucio
2007-05-06  6:05                                                       ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06  8:45                                                         ` matt
2007-05-06  6:45                                                       ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  6:52                                                         ` lucio
2007-05-06  7:09                                                           ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06  7:34                                                             ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  7:49                                                               ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06  7:54                                                               ` lucio
2007-05-06  8:35                                                                 ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-06  7:40                                                             ` lucio
2007-05-06  8:59                                                               ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06  7:03                                                         ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06  5:21                                                 ` Bruce Ellis
2007-05-06  7:01                                                   ` Rogelio Serrano
2007-05-05  5:30                                             ` lucio
2007-05-04  2:16                                     ` erik quanstrom
2007-05-04  9:24                                       ` C H Forsyth [this message]
2007-05-04 11:18                                         ` erik quanstrom
2007-05-04 16:19                                         ` Paul Lalonde
2007-05-04 21:58                                           ` Dave Eckhardt
2007-05-04 22:27                                             ` Paul Lalonde
2007-05-04  8:46                                 ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2007-05-05  4:47                                   ` Roman Shaposhnick
2007-05-02  8:33                 ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2007-05-02 11:25                   ` Jon Snader
2007-05-02  8:33               ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2007-05-02 11:30                 ` erik quanstrom
2007-04-27 16:21     ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2007-04-27 11:12   ` Charles Forsyth
2007-04-27 11:46   ` erik quanstrom
2007-04-27 14:21     ` Joel C. Salomon
2007-04-27 14:26       ` erik quanstrom
2007-04-27 14:41         ` Rob Pike
2007-04-27 14:55         ` Joel C. Salomon
2007-04-27 15:24           ` erik quanstrom
2007-04-27 15:53           ` C H Forsyth
2007-04-28  9:09   ` ron minnich
2007-04-28  9:17     ` Lucio De Re
2007-04-28 13:48       ` Eric Van Hensbergen
2007-04-28 13:57         ` Lucio De Re
2007-04-28 14:15         ` LiteStar numnums
2007-04-28 21:21         ` Roman Shaposhnik
2007-04-28 21:54           ` ron minnich
2007-04-28 22:33             ` Steve Simon
2007-04-28 15:45     ` Charles Forsyth
2007-04-28 17:58       ` Rodrigo Miranda
2007-04-28 20:12         ` Eric Van Hensbergen
2007-04-28 21:10           ` Roman Shaposhnik
2007-04-28 18:15       ` Lluís Batlle i Rossell
2007-04-29  2:39       ` Joel C. Salomon
2007-04-29 12:41         ` erik quanstrom
2007-04-29 16:00           ` Joel C. Salomon
2007-04-28 21:24     ` Roman Shaposhnik
2007-05-06 12:36 erik quanstrom
2007-05-06 15:18 ` lucio
2007-05-06 16:23   ` W B Hacker
2007-05-06 17:53     ` Benn Newman
2007-05-06 17:56       ` Francisco J Ballesteros

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