[9fans] 9vx as a cpu server?

[9fans] 9vx as a cpu server?

[Mathieu]

Hello,

Simple question: how hard would it be to modify 9vx so it can be used
as a cpu server?

As I naively see it, the two main problems are:
1) to have 9vx running a cpu server kernel instead of a stand alone
terminal one (I don't even know if that's the case actually).
2) to have the host forwarding whatever packets should go to 9vx.

I had two goals in mind; obviously being able to have a cpu server
without having to dedicate another machine for that at home, but also
I will need to run some tests over the net for an app I will try to
write and that will require to have several plan 9 hosts being able to
talk to each other.
I realize vmware could cut it, but I find 9vx much easier to use, so I
was wondering if that would be at all possible...

Cheers,
Mathieu

Re: [9fans] 9vx as a cpu server?

[erik quanstrom]

> As I naively see it, the two main problems are:
> 1) to have 9vx running a cpu server kernel instead of a stand alone
> terminal one (I don't even know if that's the case actually).

i think there would be a little work in getting this going.

> 2) to have the host forwarding whatever packets should go to 9vx.

is this enough?

http://9fans.net/archive/2008/12/501
http://9fans.net/archive/2008/12/505

- erik

Re: [9fans] 9vx as a cpu server?

[Mathieu]

> > As I naively see it, the two main problems are:
> > 1) to have 9vx running a cpu server kernel instead of a stand alone
> > terminal one (I don't even know if that's the case actually).
>
> i think there would be a little work in getting this going.

Ok, so it's possible then. :)
I'll see if I can understand the 9vx code and have a go at that.

> > 2) to have the host forwarding whatever packets should go to 9vx.
>
> is this enough?
>
> http://9fans.net/archive/2008/12/501
> http://9fans.net/archive/2008/12/505

Hmm I'm not sure, do these modifications imply that the Linux/FreeBSD
host can "see" 9vx as another host? Hence making it possible to NAT the
relevant traffic to it?
If yes, then that's indeed what I'm after, thx.

Cheers,
Mathieu

Re: [9fans] 9vx as a cpu server?

[Devon H. O'Dell]

2009/2/1 Mathieu <lejatorn@gmail.com>:
>> > As I naively see it, the two main problems are:
>> > 1) to have 9vx running a cpu server kernel instead of a stand alone
>> > terminal one (I don't even know if that's the case actually).
>>
>> i think there would be a little work in getting this going.
>
> Ok, so it's possible then. :)
> I'll see if I can understand the 9vx code and have a go at that.
>
>> > 2) to have the host forwarding whatever packets should go to 9vx.
>>
>> is this enough?
>>
>> http://9fans.net/archive/2008/12/501
>> http://9fans.net/archive/2008/12/505
>
> Hmm I'm not sure, do these modifications imply that the Linux/FreeBSD
> host can "see" 9vx as another host? Hence making it possible to NAT the
> relevant traffic to it?
> If yes, then that's indeed what I'm after, thx.

You add an IP address to your system; with the changes, 9vx creates a
virtual network device. You assign the IP address to the 9vx virtual
network interface and it does the right thing. It isn't NAT, it's
passive traffic listening / injecting. I still have some work to do to
get the tap driver running, but it's been on the back burner.

--dho

> Cheers,
> Mathieu
>
>
>

Re: [9fans] 9vx as a cpu server?

[Russ Cox]

On Sun, Feb 1, 2009 at 10:19 AM, Mathieu <lejatorn@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Simple question: how hard would it be to modify 9vx so it can be used
> as a cpu server?
>
> As I naively see it, the two main problems are:
> 1) to have 9vx running a cpu server kernel instead of a stand alone
> terminal one (I don't even know if that's the case actually).
> 2) to have the host forwarding whatever packets should go to 9vx.
>
> I had two goals in mind; obviously being able to have a cpu server
> without having to dedicate another machine for that at home, but also
> I will need to run some tests over the net for an app I will try to
> write and that will require to have several plan 9 hosts being able to
> talk to each other.
> I realize vmware could cut it, but I find 9vx much easier to use, so I
> was wondering if that would be at all possible...

you don't need a cpu server kernel to be a cpu server.
the main difference between the two kernels is which
startup script (termrc or cpurc) gets run.  if you start
the listeners, you can be a cpu server.

as for listening, 9vx by default uses the host ip stack,
and plan 9 services tend to use their own port numbers,
so as long as you don't want, say, to split ssh to your
host away from ssh to your 9vx instance, you should
be able to just use the stock 9vx and run "aux/listen tcp".

of course, 9vx is running as an ordinary linux user,
which means that the concept of user when accessing
the local file system will not be meaningful -- everyone
will have the access of the user who started 9vx.

russ

Re: [9fans] 9vx as a cpu server?

[Roman V. Shaposhnik]

On Sun, 2009-02-01 at 20:27 -0800, Russ Cox wrote:
> as for listening, 9vx by default uses the host ip stack,
> and plan 9 services tend to use their own port numbers,

And sometimes these port # tend to be < 1024 which means that
you have to run 9vx as root.

Thanks,
Roman.

Re: [9fans] 9vx as a cpu server?

[roger peppe]

why hasn't that old unix restriction been removed yet?
is there any point to it at all any more?
localhost-only announcing i suppose.

2009/2/2 Roman V. Shaposhnik <rvs@sun.com>:
> On Sun, 2009-02-01 at 20:27 -0800, Russ Cox wrote:
>> as for listening, 9vx by default uses the host ip stack,
>> and plan 9 services tend to use their own port numbers,
>
> And sometimes these port # tend to be < 1024 which means that
> you have to run 9vx as root.
>
> Thanks,
> Roman.
>
>
>

Re: [9fans] 9vx as a cpu server?

[ron minnich]

On Mon, Feb 2, 2009 at 8:54 AM, roger peppe <rogpeppe@gmail.com> wrote:
> why hasn't that old unix restriction been removed yet?
> is there any point to it at all any more?

They depend on it now more than ever. Don't believe me? Just look at
what port many people use for NFS nowadays.

Lots of bad things have never been fixed, and this is one of them. I
guess it's more fun to lard GUI software over top and hope nobody
notices.

ron

Re: [9fans] 9vx as a cpu server?

[erik quanstrom]

> They depend on it now more than ever. Don't believe me? Just look at
> what port many people use for NFS nowadays.
>
> Lots of bad things have never been fixed, and this is one of them. I
> guess it's more fun to lard GUI software over top and hope nobody
> notices.

too bad that there seems to be more willingness to
break perfectly okay interfaces that there is to
fix broken interfaces.  the compatability argument
seems to run counter common sense in both cases.

- erik

Re: [9fans] 9vx as a cpu server?

[Charles Forsyth]

>why hasn't that old unix restriction been removed yet?

the old ones are best. there's nothing like a really good candle.
it couldn't be prised from their cold dead hands.
think of the expense!

i came across it recently, and couldn't quite believe it myself.