From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: <9front-bounces@9front.inri.net> X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.3 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU,HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, NICE_REPLY_A autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: from 9front.inri.net (9front.inri.net [168.235.81.73]) by inbox.vuxu.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A40525A4F for ; Wed, 8 May 2024 05:44:25 +0200 (CEST) Received: from mimir.eigenstate.org ([206.124.132.107]) by 9front; Tue May 7 23:41:17 -0400 2024 Received: from mimir.eigenstate.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mimir.eigenstate.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id e0b678e2; Tue, 7 May 2024 20:41:11 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=eigenstate.org; h=date :from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=mail; bh=TpSkaACvObP3AAvyiywb+iZ7RvM=; b=GANC7WnWyOctUk9f+2U+0N9uLIvf pJTaSC/DOGuxR9hMbkVmtBT/CFp6Ob0BfDK9QtUIVpWjbcHFyXJDehA6nHMUok1S 5kNPwdQlVtu2krvHXmeaARg7B8ABVHg3Br0KlQ4Y5ho3Jepk3l3CV/iWQpqU20qn v7F8rZL++kLTtow= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=eigenstate.org; h=date:from :to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; q=dns; s=mail; b=HDzbjP Dbti31KWKAJIOIQL/SMTEpyJHuG+Gs4xCgbn2afmp1MlPV7RlxWbZanWJ3LCtsFg xmMX/Do+1bgdJ9Zv+vu3FTQnUkkjR5XO7GKGVaFMyLKCGkY6T4C6zHu0jZ6JjGKW 9QmQ3otgeABUN+xLtprBQKgrkqwLw9wOePZ9k= Received: from oneeye (pool-108-6-24-2.nycmny.fios.verizon.net [108.6.24.2]) by mimir.eigenstate.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id b3b1b083 (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256:NO); Tue, 7 May 2024 20:41:11 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 7 May 2024 23:41:09 -0400 From: Ori Bernstein To: 9front@9front.org Cc: Jacob Moody Message-Id: <20240507234109.5e46e5abaf50a6f0df261047@eigenstate.org> In-Reply-To: <102b2835-4207-4f8c-9f29-9da8b459dc2e@posixcafe.org> References: <021A5DC3A3EB95E2C477B02B69C922D3@gaff.inri.net> <102b2835-4207-4f8c-9f29-9da8b459dc2e@posixcafe.org> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.33; amd64-portbld-freebsd14.0) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit List-ID: <9front.9front.org> List-Help: X-Glyph: ➈ X-Bullshit: secure hypervisor reduce/map dependency-scale solution Subject: Re: [9front] Enabling a service Reply-To: 9front@9front.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 7 May 2024 20:05:21 -0500, Jacob Moody wrote: > > pick this apart, but this is me telling you what worked and didn't > > work for me, and i'm happy to answer questions in detail. > > I want to expand this with some of my experiences. I tend to run a > filesystem on the laptop and just sync file between the FS at home > and the laptop at regular intervals (typically before I travel) but > I am home more times than not so my experience is a bit different. > I tend to keep any code of interest checked in to shithub, that way > its impossible to be caught without access to what I need. I sync the > .git and go about my day. > I tend to hack from coffee shops quite often, and don't sync, but will instead pull things into my namespace, pop up subrios on my home cpu server, etc. Contrary to many people's experience, I actually find that for the kind of latency I get over coffee shop wifi to my home, remote rio sessions behave fairly well (though displaying static images is quite painful). > > > >> trying to preserve the labs experience > > > > personally, i don't care at all about preserving the labs experience. > > we already dumped fossil, made tons of changes. but before you start > > proposing all sorts of changes to the system it's important to > > understand exactly what you're changing. plan 9 was not designed by > > idiots, or by accident. everything that went in is the way it is for > > a reason. you may disagree with the reason, but it's important to > > understand that reason before blowing it off. and yes, people > > involved with 9front will challenge you on every little detail, > > because the details are important, and that's why we're all here. > > > > this isn't linux. > > Laptops are generally outside of the purview of what the labs intended, > computing has gone in interesting directions. However this is not much of > hurdle really, people lug around operating systems that would really prefer > to think of themselves as giant computers running in a dedicated room > servicing a dozen teletypes. Linux has put a lot of makeup on this pig, > but you can not change its core design principles. Linux folks make do > with little hacks here and there to improve the experience, you can likewise > find whatever fits your fancy for how you'd like to reconcile the world of > modern computing on to a 9front system. We've gained a fair bit of modern > conveniences (git), the world is your oyster. > > In general though sl here is right, before we ship something with the system > we will want to make sure things make sense. We don't shove things in just because > they can be or because someone has expectations that are not met. There is an open question about how mobile computers should fit into a Plan 9; so far, I don't have a good answer. I don't think turning every plan 9 machine into an island is the answer. -- Ori Bernstein