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From: Jon Harrop <jon@ffconsultancy.com>
To: caml-list@yquem.inria.fr
Subject: Re: [Caml-list] OCaml troll on Slashdot
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 19:51:48 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <200503161951.48923.jon@ffconsultancy.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.58.0503160931190.30293@shell2.speakeasy.net>

On Wednesday 16 March 2005 17:43, brogoff wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Mar 2005, Jacques Garrigue wrote:
> > Because tail-recursive versions do some extra work to ensure
> > tail-recursiveness. For instance building a list in reverse order, and
> > converting it back with List.rev at the end. This only pays off for
> > huge lists.
>
> No doubt the implementors will want me guillotined for bringing this up
> again, but using the (still functional!) set_cdr! tail recursive functions,
> which do *not* reverse the list, are always faster than the non tail
> recursive list functions, even for small lists, at least in my experience.
> So I suspect that your "for instance" is in fact the only reason for the
> disparity. I'd welcome a counterexample.

Here is one of the counterexamples given in my book, two implementations of a 
fold_right function over an implicit semi-inclusive range of integers [l..u):

# let rec fold_right1 f accu l u =
    if l < u then f (fold_right1 f accu (l + 1) u) l else accu;;
val fold_right1 : ('a -> int -> 'a) -> 'a -> int -> int -> 'a = <fun>
# let rec fold_right2 f accu l u =
    if l < u then let u = u - 1 in fold_right2 f (f accu u) l u else accu;;
val fold_right2 : ('a -> int -> 'a) -> 'a -> int -> int -> unit = <fun>

(A program for timing is at the end of this e-mail).

Here, the non-tail-recursive fold_left function is significantly faster on 
smaller lists and the tail-recursive fold_right functions is much faster in 
larger lists.

I believe there are many other counterexamples. Indeed, I would even say that 
most functions are counterexamples. Perhaps the reason is that non-tail 
recursion is used when it is natural for a given task, and transforming into 
tail-recursive form is then necessarily more complicating the function.

> Those Obj based List functions are what ExtLib provides, I think, and there
> are even ways to get this optimization neatly into ML style languages.
> Maybe in ML 20XY this will be addressed.

I don't know what the performance of such transformed code would be. Perhaps 
the transformation would slow code down. Consequently, it may be early days 
to call it an "optimisation".

Here's the timing program:

let rec fold_right1 f accu l u =
  if l < u then f (fold_right1 f accu (l + 1) u) l else accu
let rec fold_right2 f accu l u =
  if l < u then let u = u - 1 in fold_right2 f (f accu u) l u else accu

let rec test f n = if n>0 then (f (); test f (n-1))

let _ =
  let t = Unix.gettimeofday () in
  test (fun () -> ignore (fold_right1 ( + ) 0 1 5000)) 10000;
  Printf.printf "Non-tail-recursive took: %fs\n"
    (Unix.gettimeofday () -. t);
  let t = Unix.gettimeofday () in
  test (fun () -> ignore (fold_right2 ( + ) 0 1 5000)) 10000;
  Printf.printf "Tail-recursive took: %fs\n\n"
    (Unix.gettimeofday () -. t);
  let t = Unix.gettimeofday () in
  test (fun () -> ignore (fold_right1 ( + ) 0 1 50000)) 1000;
  Printf.printf "Non-tail-recursive took: %fs\n"
    (Unix.gettimeofday () -. t);
  let t = Unix.gettimeofday () in
  test (fun () -> ignore (fold_right2 ( + ) 0 1 50000)) 1000;
  Printf.printf "Tail-recursive took: %fs\n"
    (Unix.gettimeofday () -. t)

$ ./test
Non-tail-recursive took: 0.513307s
Tail-recursive took: 0.582472s

Non-tail-recursive took: 1.950229s
Tail-recursive took: 0.590756s

-- 
Dr Jon D Harrop, Flying Frog Consultancy Ltd.
Objective CAML for Scientists
http://www.ffconsultancy.com/products/ocaml_for_scientists


  reply	other threads:[~2005-03-16 19:50 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 71+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2005-03-15  1:29 Karl Zilles
2005-03-15  8:32 ` [Caml-list] " Oliver Bandel
2005-03-15  8:45   ` Michael Vanier
2005-03-15  8:59     ` Jon Harrop
2005-03-15 20:17       ` Yoann Padioleau
2005-03-15 20:36         ` Jon Harrop
2005-03-15 21:03           ` padiolea
2005-03-15 21:40             ` William D.Neumann
2005-03-15 22:12               ` Yoann Padioleau
2005-03-15 23:07                 ` William D.Neumann
2005-03-15 23:39                   ` Jon Harrop
2005-03-15 23:54                     ` Thomas Fischbacher
2005-03-16  0:03                   ` Christopher Dutchyn
2005-03-16  0:18                   ` Oliver Bandel
2005-03-16  1:05                     ` Yoann Padioleau
2005-03-16  2:55                       ` Oliver Bandel
2005-03-16 11:23                         ` Thomas Fischbacher
2005-03-16 23:41                           ` Oliver Bandel
2005-03-16 13:33                         ` Yoann Padioleau
2005-03-16 23:59                           ` Oliver Bandel
2005-03-16  3:01                     ` Jon Harrop
2005-03-16 13:10                       ` Yoann Padioleau
2005-03-16 13:41                         ` Jacques Garrigue
2005-03-16 14:14                           ` Yoann Padioleau
2005-03-17  0:27                             ` Oliver Bandel
2005-03-16 17:43                           ` brogoff
2005-03-16 19:51                             ` Jon Harrop [this message]
2005-03-17  3:35                               ` brogoff
2005-03-17  3:48                                 ` Yaron Minsky
2005-03-17 10:16                                   ` Jon Harrop
2005-03-17 10:47                                     ` Oliver Bandel
2005-03-17 18:06                                     ` brogoff
2005-03-17 19:15                                       ` Marcin 'Qrczak' Kowalczyk
2005-03-18 17:46                                         ` brogoff
2005-03-18 18:44                                           ` Marcin 'Qrczak' Kowalczyk
2005-03-17 21:31                                       ` Oliver Bandel
2005-03-17  9:45                                 ` Christian Szegedy
2005-03-17 10:31                                 ` Jon Harrop
2005-03-17 11:11                                   ` Ville-Pertti Keinonen
2005-03-17 11:31                               ` tail-recursion vs. no tail-recursion in list functions sebastian.egner
2005-03-17 21:41                                 ` [Caml-list] " Oliver Bandel
2005-03-18  0:04                                   ` David Brown
2005-03-18  0:06                                   ` Karl Zilles
2005-03-18  1:13                                 ` Jacques Garrigue
2005-03-17  0:21                             ` [Caml-list] OCaml troll on Slashdot Oliver Bandel
2005-03-17  1:05                             ` Jacques Garrigue
2005-03-17 17:32                             ` Jason Hickey
2005-03-17 19:06                               ` Marcin 'Qrczak' Kowalczyk
2005-03-17  0:14                           ` Oliver Bandel
2005-03-16  1:38             ` Jacques Garrigue
2005-03-31 11:42         ` Paul Argentoff
2005-03-31 11:41       ` Paul Argentoff
2005-03-15 20:06   ` Yoann Padioleau
2005-03-15  9:25 ` Richard Jones
2005-03-15 10:08   ` YANG Shouxun
2005-03-15 20:02     ` Yoann Padioleau
2005-03-15 22:33       ` Richard Jones
2005-03-16  1:33       ` YANG Shouxun
2005-03-15 10:34   ` padiolea
2005-03-15 10:52     ` Diego Olivier Fernandez Pons
2005-03-15 14:12     ` Eijiro Sumii
2005-03-15 15:25       ` Christophe TROESTLER
2005-03-15 18:05         ` Thomas Fischbacher
2005-03-15 18:26           ` Kip Macy
2005-03-16  0:32             ` Oliver Bandel
2005-03-16 11:26             ` David Fox
2005-03-15 18:55         ` Christopher A. Watford
2005-03-15 19:56           ` Jon Harrop
2005-03-16  0:35             ` Oliver Bandel
2005-03-16  0:34           ` Oliver Bandel
2005-03-18  6:04 Harrison, John R

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