From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Original-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Delivered-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Received: from mail3-relais-sop.national.inria.fr (mail3-relais-sop.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.104]) by sympa.inria.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BCD3C7FE44 for ; Mon, 4 Jul 2016 16:45:58 +0200 (CEST) IronPort-PHdr: 9a23:/M5mAh8L6EsqxP9uRHKM819IXTAuvvDOBiVQ1KB91uMcTK2v8tzYMVDF4r011RmSDN2dsagP1LSempujcFRI2YyGvnEGfc4EfD4+ouJSoTYdBtWYA1bwNv/gYn9yNs1DUFh44yPzahANS47AblHf6ke/8SQVUk2mc1EkfqKvQMWN0Yye7KObw9XreQJGhT6wM/tZDS6dikHvjPQQmpZoMa0ryxHE8TNicuVSwn50dxrIx06vru/5xpNo8jxRtvQ97IYAFPyiJ+VrBYBfWRgrOmZ92M3ssAHYSg3HsncRW2MNkhdSHwjC6QnhWZHZvS7zt+470y6fa57YV7cxDC+6x6BxQh70gSMJMC5/+2bS2Z84t75SvB/0/083+IXTeozAcaMmJq4= Authentication-Results: mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; spf=None smtp.pra=sp@orbitalfox.com; spf=None smtp.mailfrom=sp@orbitalfox.com; spf=None smtp.helo=postmaster@portal.orbitalfox.com Received-SPF: None (mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of sp@orbitalfox.com) identity=pra; client-ip=95.172.232.202; receiver=mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="sp@orbitalfox.com"; x-sender="sp@orbitalfox.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: None (mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of sp@orbitalfox.com) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=95.172.232.202; receiver=mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="sp@orbitalfox.com"; x-sender="sp@orbitalfox.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: None (mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of postmaster@portal.orbitalfox.com) identity=helo; client-ip=95.172.232.202; receiver=mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="sp@orbitalfox.com"; x-sender="postmaster@portal.orbitalfox.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: A0CqBADIdXpX/8rorF9bwD+GGAIMgWYQAQEBAQEBAQFkJ4IyghoBAQQBOj8FCwsNCwklDwUoISeIFAwBuS4BAQEBAQUBAQEBAQEhinWEDIEXgkmCLwEEmROOPY80kAo1H4NxiXkBAQE X-IPAS-Result: A0CqBADIdXpX/8rorF9bwD+GGAIMgWYQAQEBAQEBAQFkJ4IyghoBAQQBOj8FCwsNCwklDwUoISeIFAwBuS4BAQEBAQUBAQEBAQEhinWEDIEXgkmCLwEEmROOPY80kAo1H4NxiXkBAQE X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.26,575,1459807200"; d="scan'208";a="183735625" Received: from w-202.cust-20351.ip.static.uno.uk.net (HELO portal.orbitalfox.com) ([95.172.232.202]) by mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr with ESMTP; 04 Jul 2016 16:45:57 +0200 Received: from Razor (unknown [213.205.253.9]) by portal.orbitalfox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3CAB5AA0059; Mon, 4 Jul 2016 14:45:53 +0000 (UTC) Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2016 15:45:12 +0100 From: sp@orbitalfox.com To: Dean Thompson Cc: "caml-list@inria.fr" Message-ID: <20160704144512.GB2458@Razor> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.6.1 (2016-04-27) Subject: Re: [Caml-list] how to encourage adoption of OCaml? On Thu, Jun 30, 2016 at 06:01:41AM -0400, Dean Thompson wrote: > But this feels like a fragile new home unless we can build a bigger community! > For one thing, if our community shrinks much, it may no longer be viable. > Also, while I love 1,000 packages on opam, I want 100,000! OCaml's community size has advantages and disadvantages. I started taking interest almost a year ago, after Haskell. One thing I didn't like about it's community was that every other month there would be an reincarnation of an implementation using the latest (immature or ill-conceived at times) conceptual abstraction. I'm not suggesting that we should enforce the size; I'm just sayin don't overstimate the size of the community or volume of packages. > As a newcomer to the community, I have to say that there are daunting barriers > to a potential new user considering OCaml for a new project. If you like > starting on a new programming language with a book, as I do, you likely start > with Real World OCaml. That book is very inspiring! But then when you try to > move from RWO to, well, using OCaml in the real world, you discover that there > is no consensus on Core as a standard library, and that Camlp4 is deprecated. I agree with you, same findings. You should checkout the IRC channel if you haven't already. I got a lot of help from the people there in terms of choosing between options (Core / Batteries) and explanation of the latest advancments (camlp4). My feeling is that most of the folk in the community are serious and to the point.. like OCaml ;) > It appears to me that if, instead, you come to OCaml as a potential new user > through ocaml.org, there are other barriers. It is hard for me to judge > because I came through RWO, but it appears to me that the lack of consensus on > standard library comes up pretty quickly. This is recognised in the community and others have already answered. One day, hopefully we can have an effective merge of the parallel efforts. I for one avoid both as much as I can until there is a merge :) -- SP