caml-list - the Caml user's mailing list
 help / color / mirror / Atom feed
From: Christophe Raffalli <christophe.raffalli@univ-savoie.fr>
To: mgushee@havenrock.com, caml-list <caml-list@inria.fr>
Subject: [Caml-list] Monads was OCaml popularity
Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 15:46:19 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <3E6F9C9B.2060203@univ-savoie.fr> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <3E6DDAFC.19000.44771B6@localhost>

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2073 bytes --]


> My other big problem with Haskell was ... you guessed it: monads! I 
> must have read every introduction to monads that's available on line 
> (and there are at least half a dozen), but I still don't really 
> understand them. Without monads, you can't do any real work in 
> Haskell, and monads are universally acknowledged to be a difficult 
> concept. Yet every introductory text I have seen on Haskell insists 
> that you learn the theory of monads before you can learn how to do 
> things like I/O.
> 

Maybe if people where calling monads by their real name: quasi-morphism 
:-) that would be better !

- A monad M is given by a mapping M from type to type,

a function apply : M (a -> b) -> M a -> M b

and a function unit : a -> M a

such that unit (f a) = apply (unit f) (unit a)

- A real morphism M would be given by a mapping M from type to type,

a function unit : a -> M a

such that unit (f a) = (unit f) (unit a)

But this to be true enforces
M (a -> b) = M a -> Mb otherwise the previous equation makes no sense.
So monads introduces apply to be less restrictive : the equation
M (a -> b) = M a -> M b is replaced by a function
apply : M (a -> b) -> M a -> Mb

But when you see that, it is like morphism in math. There are very few 
result true for a morphism/monads, and when you use a specific monad, 
you may/have better to forget that this is a monad (do you really need 
to know that x |-> exp x is a group morphisme to use it even if this is 
an important remark ?)

PS: the bindlib library for data-types with bound variables is a monad 
<http://www.lama.univ-savoie.fr/~raffalli/bindlib.html>

-- 
Christophe Raffalli
Université de Savoie
Batiment Le Chablais, bureau 21
73376 Le Bourget-du-Lac Cedex

tél: (33) 4 79 75 81 03
fax: (33) 4 79 75 87 42
mail: Christophe.Raffalli@univ-savoie.fr
www: http://www.lama.univ-savoie.fr/~RAFFALLI
---------------------------------------------
IMPORTANT: this mail is signed using PGP/MIME
At least Enigmail/Mozilla, mutt or evolution
can check this signature
---------------------------------------------

[-- Attachment #2: Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 252 bytes --]

  parent reply	other threads:[~2003-03-12 16:58 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 88+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2003-03-06 23:27 [Caml-list] " Graham Guttocks
2003-03-10 20:43 ` Paul Steckler
2003-03-10 23:48 ` Gerd Stolpmann
2003-03-11  0:18   ` Brian Hurt
2003-03-17 23:49   ` Graham Guttocks
2003-03-11  1:43 ` Nicolas Cannasse
2003-03-11 10:23   ` Pierre Weis
2003-03-11 14:27     ` Guillaume Marceau
2003-03-11 16:16       ` David Brown
2003-03-11 16:47       ` [Caml-list] about -rectypes Christophe Raffalli
2003-03-12  2:32       ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity Nicolas Cannasse
2003-03-12  3:55         ` Cross-platform GUI (was Re: [Caml-list] OCaml popularity) mgushee
2003-03-12 10:51         ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity Alex Romadinoff
2003-03-12 18:24         ` Max Kirillov
2003-03-11 19:02     ` Graham Guttocks
2003-03-12 17:12       ` Richard W.M. Jones
2003-03-12 18:08         ` Alwyn Goodloe
2003-03-12 22:34           ` Michael Schuerig
2003-03-12 23:13             ` Martin Weber
2003-03-12 23:35               ` Michael Schuerig
2003-03-13  8:02                 ` Alessandro Baretta
2003-03-13 10:23                   ` Michael Schuerig
2003-03-12 23:35             ` Brian Hurt
2003-03-12 23:18         ` Daniel Bünzli
2003-03-12 23:47           ` Brian Hurt
2003-03-13  2:15         ` William Lovas
2003-03-13  3:44           ` Graham Guttocks
2003-03-13  9:31           ` Richard W.M. Jones
     [not found]           ` <20030313095232.GC347@first.in-berlin.de>
2003-03-13 20:50             ` William Lovas
2003-03-13 21:17               ` Oliver Bandel
2003-03-13 22:01                 ` Brian Hurt
2003-03-13 22:17                 ` Oliver Bandel
2003-03-14  6:33                 ` Michal Moskal
2003-03-14 11:50                   ` Markus Mottl
2003-03-14 15:38                     ` Oliver Bandel
2003-03-14 10:13               ` MikhailFedotov
2003-03-14 10:30                 ` Johann Spies
2003-03-13  8:09       ` Pierre Weis
2003-03-15  1:43     ` Tushar Samant
2003-03-15  8:19       ` Andreas Eder
2003-03-11 16:26   ` Fred Yankowski
2003-03-11 19:47     ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity (long!) mgushee
2003-03-12 11:23       ` Diego Olivier Fernandez Pons
2003-03-30  5:59         ` Belated thanks (was Re: [Caml-list] OCaml popularity) Matt Gushee
2003-03-31 15:27           ` [Caml-list] Re: Belated thanks cashin
2003-04-01  8:22           ` Belated thanks (was Re: [Caml-list] OCaml popularity) Johann Spies
2003-03-12 20:41       ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity (long!) Max Kirillov
2003-03-13  2:36         ` Haskell-like syntax (was: [Caml-list] OCaml popularity (long!)) Oleg
2003-03-13 18:33           ` [Caml-list] Re: Haskell-like syntax Max Kirillov
2003-03-14 19:30             ` Max Kirillov
2003-03-14 19:47               ` Max Kirillov
2003-03-14 20:01               ` Seth Kurtzberg
2003-03-14 20:34                 ` brogoff
2003-03-14 21:17                   ` Sebastien Carlier
2003-03-14 21:51                     ` brogoff
2003-03-15  2:27                 ` Max Kirillov
2003-03-15 10:58                   ` Markus Mottl
2003-03-15 15:52                     ` [Caml-list] globally valid symbols (was: Haskell-like syntax) Max Kirillov
2003-03-15 20:16                     ` [Caml-list] Re: Haskell-like syntax David Brown
2003-03-16  5:28                     ` Module recursion (Was Re: [Caml-list] Re: Haskell-like syntax) brogoff
2003-03-16 11:10                       ` Markus Mottl
2003-03-16 18:02                         ` brogoff
2003-03-16 18:34                           ` Markus Mottl
     [not found]                     ` <Pine.LNX.4.44.0303152112560.27230-100000@grace.speakeasy.n et>
2003-03-16  5:38                       ` Chris Hecker
2003-03-16 18:34                         ` brogoff
2003-03-17  2:20                           ` Jacques Garrigue
     [not found]                         ` <Pine.LNX.4.44.0303161020480.11736-100000@grace.speakeasy.n et>
2003-03-17  5:08                           ` Chris Hecker
2003-03-17 17:06                             ` brogoff
2003-03-17 19:01                               ` Ville-Pertti Keinonen
     [not found]                             ` <Pine.LNX.4.44.0303170836240.29039-100000@grace.speakeasy.n et>
2003-03-17 19:33                               ` Chris Hecker
2003-03-17 20:28                                 ` brogoff
     [not found]                                 ` <Pine.LNX.4.44.0303171145500.29039-100000@grace.speakeasy.n et>
2003-03-17 21:09                                   ` Chris Hecker
2003-03-19  2:34                                 ` [Caml-list] ocamlopt speed (was Re: Module recursion) Chris Hecker
2003-03-19 10:03                                   ` Michal Moskal
2003-03-19 10:38                                     ` Gerd Stolpmann
2003-03-19 20:36                                   ` Chris Hecker
2003-03-17  1:46                     ` [Caml-list] Re: Haskell-like syntax Nicolas Cannasse
2003-03-14 22:50               ` Oleg
2003-03-20 15:01                 ` Andreas Rossberg
2003-03-12 20:46       ` Christophe Raffalli [this message]
2003-03-13  0:03       ` [Caml-list] monads for dummies james woodyatt
2003-03-13  4:32         ` Christopher Quinn
2003-03-13 11:53         ` Christian Lindig
2003-03-12 18:59 ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity Martin Weber
2003-03-12 20:24   ` Xavier Leroy
2003-03-13  8:57     ` [Caml-list] how to interface with integer Bigarrays using camlidl francois bereux
2003-03-13  9:36       ` Xavier Leroy
2003-03-13  0:42   ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity Graham Guttocks

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to=3E6F9C9B.2060203@univ-savoie.fr \
    --to=christophe.raffalli@univ-savoie.fr \
    --cc=caml-list@inria.fr \
    --cc=mgushee@havenrock.com \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox;
as well as URLs for NNTP newsgroup(s).