From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Original-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Delivered-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Received: from mail3-relais-sop.national.inria.fr (mail3-relais-sop.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.104]) by sympa.inria.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B573C820A1 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 2013 21:01:27 +0200 (CEST) Received-SPF: None (mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of rudi.grinberg@gmail.com) identity=pra; client-ip=209.85.223.180; receiver=mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="rudi.grinberg@gmail.com"; x-sender="rudi.grinberg@gmail.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: Pass (mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: domain of rudi.grinberg@gmail.com designates 209.85.223.180 as permitted sender) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=209.85.223.180; receiver=mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="rudi.grinberg@gmail.com"; x-sender="rudi.grinberg@gmail.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1" Received-SPF: None (mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of postmaster@mail-ie0-f180.google.com) identity=helo; client-ip=209.85.223.180; receiver=mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="rudi.grinberg@gmail.com"; x-sender="postmaster@mail-ie0-f180.google.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Av0DAJW8MFLRVd+0lGdsb2JhbABbgz9ShEioboNghi+IPYEUCBYOAQEBAQcLCwkSKoIlAQEEAUABGxILAQMBCwYFCw0NISIBEQEFAQoEAQ0GEwkJCIdVAQMJBgyiL4xRgweEHAoZJwMKZIhBAQUMjQmCUQQHhB0Dl3mBL45aGCmEZiA X-IPAS-Result: Av0DAJW8MFLRVd+0lGdsb2JhbABbgz9ShEioboNghi+IPYEUCBYOAQEBAQcLCwkSKoIlAQEEAUABGxILAQMBCwYFCw0NISIBEQEFAQoEAQ0GEwkJCIdVAQMJBgyiL4xRgweEHAoZJwMKZIhBAQUMjQmCUQQHhB0Dl3mBL45aGCmEZiA X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.90,885,1371074400"; d="scan'208";a="26528123" Received: from mail-ie0-f180.google.com ([209.85.223.180]) by mail3-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr with ESMTP/TLS/RC4-SHA; 11 Sep 2013 21:01:26 +0200 Received: by mail-ie0-f180.google.com with SMTP id 10so17176761ied.11 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 2013 12:01:25 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=s4PtztJFqCUj028WVJdFrzh/vsrlroeKMT/wIyBLFcA=; b=ZkWTd9pIplaYD5uHbVeo9xrBxdJtjY9j91P5Ep9A1sWSKLcqZEhhzCsIDrG/iW122S UCulVkrmGdayLknouZ+bXkMcCOjYHJVZMMZYXe09R/QYY+OlhfaN4dyq7Wm4xiUriJA+ pgXMTiyC4U5Qo+EJea5lrQX7Q+aBcpL0X6nyPmNCOBc37mGFt7TnAVwB+jVQHajDy3fb ualu5tqFc514xHZ90jPIRvX8Z0DOwHencvT/+AGQkFSsJAL866io1hOkmRbnvChK2wmZ WFTuXUgqtVK8l+75VglUmklZbtor6CbGMPreQMV+2kdFNHvHMupp9qaLADJyFaTHNfYO fu0Q== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.50.127.197 with SMTP id ni5mr785482igb.54.1378926085233; Wed, 11 Sep 2013 12:01:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.43.118.6 with HTTP; Wed, 11 Sep 2013 12:01:25 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20130911185750.GE3764@notk.org> References: <20130910230928.2d51cd39@atmarama.noip.me> <20130911052437.GA9514@notk.org> <20130911185750.GE3764@notk.org> Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 15:01:25 -0400 Message-ID: From: Rudi Grinberg To: Adrien Nader Cc: Paolo Donadeo , OCaml mailing list Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e013a286e7b637a04e6203f43 Subject: Re: [Caml-list] OCaml vs Ada and/or GUI options --089e013a286e7b637a04e6203f43 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Also, it doesn't help that the GTK devs don't mind breaking themes every release. http://www.linuxuser.co.uk/news/a-linux-conspiracy-theory (Apologies in advance for the slightly inflammatory nature of that article) On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 2:57 PM, Adrien Nader wrote: > On Wed, Sep 11, 2013, Paolo Donadeo wrote: > > On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 7:24 AM, Adrien Nader wrote: > > > I'm trying to get a list of things that people find bad in (labl)gtk. > > > Would you be able to put clear words on what you dislike? > > > > Very simple. Each and every time I open the GTK API reference [1] I > > feel like being catapulted in a distopian world, where nothing is > > clear. Compare with the documentation of QT. > > It's a bit strange. Each and every time I've been feeling the same but > with Qt and GTK swapped. Only proves that people are different though. > (and makes me wonder what is the fundamental difference) > > > Second, I notice that there isn't a single GTK program with a decent > > GUI, from the look and feel point of view. I use GTK programs everyday > > (as a Linux user) but this doesn't mean I don't consider it > > essentially... ugly. Compare with the average GUIs of an average OSX > > application, but even Windows is probably better and more refined. > > > > It's *NOT* a problem with LablGTK, but with GTK itself. > > As Kakadu mentionned, I believe it's mostly a matter of themes. > Unfortunately they tend to not evolve much. > > That said, visually appealing themes are much easier to write with a DSL > and that's pretty much Edje (EFL) and QtQuick. It's both simpler and > more powerful. > Hopefully, these are getting more widespread (yay, people discover DSLs > again!). > > > [1] for example: http://www.gtk.org/api/2.6/gtk/gtk-General.html > (I found that it mostly matched what I'd like for a fairly low-level > documentation =/ ) > > -- > Adrien Nader > > -- > Caml-list mailing list. Subscription management and archives: > https://sympa.inria.fr/sympa/arc/caml-list > Beginner's list: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ocaml_beginners > Bug reports: http://caml.inria.fr/bin/caml-bugs > --089e013a286e7b637a04e6203f43 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Also, it doesn't help that the GTK devs don't mind= breaking themes every release.


(Apologies in advance for the slightly inflammato= ry nature of that article)


On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 2:57 PM, Adrien Nader <adri= en@notk.org> wrote:
On Wed, Sep 11, 2013, Paol= o Donadeo wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 7:24 AM, Adrien Nader <adrien@notk.org> wrote:
> > I'm trying to get a list of things that people find bad in (l= abl)gtk.
> > Would you be able to put clear words on what you dislike?
>
> Very simple. Each and every time I open the GTK API reference [1] I
> feel like being catapulted in a distopian world, where nothing is
> clear. Compare with the documentation of QT.

It's a bit strange. Each and every time I've been feeling the= same but
with Qt and GTK swapped. Only proves that people are different though.
(and makes me wonder what is the fundamental difference)

> Second, I notice that there isn't a single GTK program with a dece= nt
> GUI, from the look and feel point of view. I use GTK programs everyday=
> (as a Linux user) but this doesn't mean I don't consider it
> essentially... ugly. Compare with the average GUIs of an average OSX > application, but even Windows is probably better and more refined.
>
> It's *NOT* a problem with LablGTK, but with GTK itself.

As Kakadu mentionned, I believe it's mostly a matter of themes. Unfortunately they tend to not evolve much.

That said, visually appealing themes are much easier to write with a DSL
and that's pretty much Edje (EFL) and QtQuick. It's both simpler an= d
more powerful.
Hopefully, these are getting more widespread (yay, people discover DSLs
again!).

> [1] for example: http://www.gtk.org/api/2.6/gtk/gtk-General.html
(I found that it mostly matched what I'd like for a fairly low-le= vel
documentation =3D/ )

--
Adrien Nader

--
Caml-list mailing list. =A0Subscription management and archives:
ht= tps://sympa.inria.fr/sympa/arc/caml-list
Beginner's list: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ocaml_beginners
Bug reports: http://caml.inria.fr/bin/caml-bugs

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