From: Ashish Agarwal <agarwal1975@gmail.com>
To: Roberto Di Cosmo <roberto@dicosmo.org>
Cc: Amir Chaudhry <amc79@cam.ac.uk>,
Fabrice Le Fessant <Fabrice.Le_fessant@inria.fr>,
caml-list@inria.fr, Early Subscribers <opam-users@inria.fr>,
opam-devel@lists.ocaml.org
Subject: Re: [Caml-list] OPAM mailing-lists ERRATUM
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2013 17:08:27 -0500 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAMu2m2J9_f9izMGwEaY1Vjh2vbrvsBMfSHzj-=wG0acjBj8w5g@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20130307114854.GB7281@voyager>
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Maybe it's just the name "opam-devel" that is sub-optimal. If it is for
users and developers, why not just call it "opam@lists.ocaml.org". If the
"devel" traffic ever gets too high, then later "opam-devel@lists.ocaml.org"
can be created, leaving the shorter "opam@lists.ocaml.org" for users.
On Thu, Mar 7, 2013 at 6:48 AM, Roberto Di Cosmo <roberto@dicosmo.org>wrote:
> Hi Amir,
> just to sum up my feeling, let me say that a mailing
> list, albeit old-fashioned, is still a good compromise
> between cost and benefits, and has the great advantage
> to keep all relevant content in one place, and not
> depend on pagerank magic and google cache to summon it up
> and make it persistent...
>
> But I agree we should bring this off the list (and by the way,
> my apologies for the OCaml list subscribers for wasting
> bandwidth :-))...
>
> --
> Roberto
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 07, 2013 at 11:33:56AM +0000, Amir Chaudhry wrote:
> >
> > On 7 Mar 2013, at 07:22, Roberto Di Cosmo <roberto@dicosmo.org> wrote:
> >
> > > I think that opam fills a major need of OCaml users:
> > > even if it is still young, needs polishing and will
> > > surely evolve quickly, it already provides a very
> > > valuable tool.
> > >
> > > But tools are useless without a user community, and
> > > users need a place to discuss, exchange ideas, ask
> > > for help, share tips and tricks, without fear of
> > > asking silly questions.
> >
> > I agree!
> >
> > > Hundreds of successful free software projects use a
> > > -devel mailing list for developer discussions, and a
> > > -users mailing list for user exchanges.
> >
> > Ok, but is this a _necessary_ requirement to being successful? That's
> not quite what you state but you seem to support that suggestion. I
> completely understand the usefulness of a -devel list but less so the
> -users list (since I'm not power user by any means).
> >
> > > So I strongly believe we need an opam-users list
> > > too (and I actually do not care where the list is
> > > hosted, as far as the hosting service is solid, and
> > > archives are searchable and backed up).
> >
> > I'm not against the idea of a -users list but I'm not one of the people
> who'd use it (though perhaps I'm misunderstanding the use-case). When I
> have any kind of question or confusion about something, my first resort is
> to google it. I'd typically look to see if others have had similar issues
> and would expect to find things on stack-overflow, blogs and other things
> on the web. This is usually sufficient for most of my problems.
> >
> > The following might help explain my viewpoint. I think of a 'software
> community' as a series of concentric circles with creators/maintainers
> right in the middle and the random public in the outermost ring. I'd argue
> that mailing lists only serve those nearer the centre (to varying degrees).
> Information scattered around the web, and well-indexed by search engines,
> better serves those nearer the outer rings (where I'd put myself).
> >
> > While I completely and whole-heartedly agree with your point about
> needing a vibrant user community, I'm essentially (1) questioning what that
> actually looks like and (2) trying to decouple it from mailing-lists. I'm
> basically arguing that the needs once served by user lists can largely be
> met by other means.
> >
> > I don't have particularly strong opinions on this (other than
> "<your-favourite-search-engine> should be able to get you to the answer",
> wherever that is). I merely wanted to present a counterpoint to what I
> felt could be taken as 'mailing list -> community'. If you, or others,
> have more information or resources on community-building in open-source
> projects I'd be very keen to learn more (though perhaps we should do that
> off the main list).
> >
> > Best wishes,
> > Amir
> >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Roberto
> > >
> > > On Thu, Mar 07, 2013 at 12:19:24AM +0100, Fabrice Le Fessant wrote:
> > >> Finally, there will be only one mailing-list devoted to OPAM (for
> > >> both users and developers discussions), it is now
> > >> opam-devel@lists.ocaml.org, and you can subscribe on this page:
> > >>
> > >> http://lists.ocaml.org/listinfo/opam-devel
> > >>
> > >> --Fabrice
> > >>
> > >> On 03/06/2013 11:51 PM, Fabrice Le Fessant wrote:
> > >>> Hi,
> > >>>
> > >>> I was proposed to either move these two mailing-lists to
> > >>> http://lists.ocaml.org/, to improve their visibility, or to have
> them
> > >>> merged into the more generic platform@lists.ocaml.org mailing-list.
> > >>>
> > >>> I will send a new mail when we have reached a consensus on the best
> > >>> solution, but in the meantime, don't subscribe to them as I won't be
> > >>> able to easily move subscriptions from one system to the other one.
> > >>>
> > >>> --Fabrice
> > >>>
> > >>> On 03/06/2013 09:46 PM, Fabrice Le Fessant wrote:
> > >>>> Hi,
> > >>>>
> > >>>> I just created two mailing-lists for questions and specific
> > >>>> discussions about OPAM, "opam-users@inria.fr" for discussions
> about how
> > >>>> to use OPAM, and "opam-devel@inria.fr" for discussions about the
> code of
> > >>>> OPAM (for developers only, or interactions with them).
> > >>>>
> > >>>> --Fabrice
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> Caml-list mailing list. Subscription management and archives:
> > >> https://sympa.inria.fr/sympa/arc/caml-list
> > >> Beginner's list: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ocaml_beginners
> > >> Bug reports: http://caml.inria.fr/bin/caml-bugs
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Roberto Di Cosmo
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > Professeur En delegation a l'INRIA
> > > PPS E-mail: roberto@dicosmo.org
> > > Universite Paris Diderot WWW : http://www.dicosmo.org
> > > Case 7014 Tel : ++33-(0)1-57 27 92 20
> > > 5, Rue Thomas Mann
> > > F-75205 Paris Cedex 13 Identica: http://identi.ca/rdicosmo
> > > FRANCE. Twitter: http://twitter.com/rdicosmo
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > Attachments:
> > > MIME accepted, Word deprecated
> > > http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > Office location:
> > >
> > > Bureau 320 (3rd floor)
> > > Batiment Sophie Germain
> > > Avenue de France
> > > Metro Bibliotheque Francois Mitterrand, ligne 14/RER C
> > > -----------------------------------------------------------------
> > > GPG fingerprint 2931 20CE 3A5A 5390 98EC 8BFC FCCA C3BE 39CB 12D3
> > >
> > > --
> > > Caml-list mailing list. Subscription management and archives:
> > > https://sympa.inria.fr/sympa/arc/caml-list
> > > Beginner's list: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ocaml_beginners
> > > Bug reports: http://caml.inria.fr/bin/caml-bugs
> >
>
> --
> Roberto Di Cosmo
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> Professeur En delegation a l'INRIA
> PPS E-mail: roberto@dicosmo.org
> Universite Paris Diderot WWW : http://www.dicosmo.org
> Case 7014 Tel : ++33-(0)1-57 27 92 20
> 5, Rue Thomas Mann
> F-75205 Paris Cedex 13 Identica: http://identi.ca/rdicosmo
> FRANCE. Twitter: http://twitter.com/rdicosmo
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> Attachments:
> MIME accepted, Word deprecated
> http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> Office location:
>
> Bureau 320 (3rd floor)
> Batiment Sophie Germain
> Avenue de France
> Metro Bibliotheque Francois Mitterrand, ligne 14/RER C
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> GPG fingerprint 2931 20CE 3A5A 5390 98EC 8BFC FCCA C3BE 39CB 12D3
>
> --
> Caml-list mailing list. Subscription management and archives:
> https://sympa.inria.fr/sympa/arc/caml-list
> Beginner's list: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ocaml_beginners
> Bug reports: http://caml.inria.fr/bin/caml-bugs
>
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next prev parent reply other threads:[~2013-03-07 22:08 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 8+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2013-03-06 20:46 [Caml-list] OPAM mailing-lists Fabrice Le Fessant
2013-03-06 22:51 ` [Caml-list] OPAM mailing-lists ERRATUM Fabrice Le Fessant
2013-03-06 23:19 ` Fabrice Le Fessant
2013-03-07 7:22 ` Roberto Di Cosmo
2013-03-07 11:33 ` Amir Chaudhry
2013-03-07 11:48 ` Roberto Di Cosmo
2013-03-07 22:08 ` Ashish Agarwal [this message]
2013-03-07 22:53 ` [Caml-list] OPAM mailing-lists Johan Grande
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