= If you have trouble viewing or submitting this form, you can fill it out on= line:
https://docs.goo= gle.com/spreadsheet/viewform?fromEmail=3Dtrue&formkey=3DdE1jM1JSTGdHVV8= wTWZxenV4cEkwVlE6MQ

OASIS, package managers and misc.

One day, OASIS-DB will be abl= e to automatically create package and repositories. We need to know what OA= SIS user wish to focus our effort on a few package manager.

Preferred package manager Choose the package manager oasis-db should suppor= t

GODI
<= input type=3D"radio" name=3D"entry.0.group" value=3D"odb.ml" class=3D"ss-q-= radio" id=3D"group_0_2" style=3D""> odb.ml
OPAM
<= input type=3D"radio" name=3D"entry.0.group" value=3D"native Debian packages= " class=3D"ss-q-radio" id=3D"group_0_4" style=3D""> native Debian packages
native RPM packages (Fedora, Centos)
non, OASIS should provide a package manager itself

Preferred build system OASIS support by design ocamlbuild, but there are= some other build system around. Which one do you think are worth to be sup= ported by OASIS.

ocamlbuild
OCamlMakefile
OMake
= ocp-build
custom scripts
native Makefile

= --20cf301af4932e937504ce13462b-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Original-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Delivered-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Received: from mail1-relais-roc.national.inria.fr (mail1-relais-roc.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.82]) by sympa.inria.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5820A7EE20 for ; Wed, 14 Nov 2012 07:01:42 +0100 (CET) Received-SPF: None (mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of berenger@riken.jp) identity=pra; client-ip=134.160.33.176; receiver=mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="berenger@riken.jp"; x-sender="berenger@riken.jp"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: Pass (mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr: domain of berenger@riken.jp designates 134.160.33.176 as permitted sender) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=134.160.33.176; receiver=mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="berenger@riken.jp"; x-sender="berenger@riken.jp"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1" Received-SPF: Pass (mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr: domain of postmaster@postman.riken.jp designates 134.160.33.176 as permitted sender) identity=helo; client-ip=134.160.33.176; receiver=mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="berenger@riken.jp"; x-sender="postmaster@postman.riken.jp"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1" X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AhMDAFQzo1CGoCGwmWdsb2JhbABEjjizewQEgSYBAQEBAQYNCwcUJ4IfAQU4QBEsFg8JAwIBAgFFEwgBAYgGuyOPL4MnA4hYjSSFa41W X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.83,248,1352070000"; d="scan'208";a="181400598" Received: from postman4.riken.jp (HELO postman.riken.jp) ([134.160.33.176]) by mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr with ESMTP; 14 Nov 2012 07:01:40 +0100 Received: from postman.riken.jp (postman4.riken.jp [127.0.0.1]) by postman.riken.jp (Postfix) with SMTP id B04E98280B7 for ; Wed, 14 Nov 2012 15:01:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from [172.27.98.103] (rikad98.riken.jp [134.160.214.98]) by postman.riken.jp (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 90ADC7F8040 for ; Wed, 14 Nov 2012 15:01:36 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <50A333C0.2060801@riken.jp> Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2012 15:01:36 +0900 From: Francois Berenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:16.0) Gecko/20121028 Thunderbird/16.0.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: caml-list@inria.fr References: <20cf301af4932e938004ce13462e@google.com> In-Reply-To: <20cf301af4932e938004ce13462e@google.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-PMX-Version: 5.6.0.2009776, Antispam-Engine: 2.7.2.376379, Antispam-Data: 2012.11.14.55416 Subject: [Caml-list] OASIS, how to pass options to ocamldoc Hello, Is there an "oasis-way" to tell ocamldoc to run with the following options: " -keep-code -colorize-code " for a given project. I guess these options are for code inlining in the output of ocamldoc (HTML in my case). Thanks a lot, F. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Original-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Delivered-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Received: from mail4-relais-sop.national.inria.fr (mail4-relais-sop.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.105]) by sympa.inria.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 528CB7EE86 for ; Wed, 14 Nov 2012 23:30:52 +0100 (CET) Received-SPF: None (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of nexinexi@msn.com) identity=pra; client-ip=65.55.116.40; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-sender="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: Pass (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: domain of nexinexi@msn.com designates 65.55.116.40 as permitted sender) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=65.55.116.40; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-sender="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1" Received-SPF: None (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of postmaster@blu0-omc1-s29.blu0.hotmail.com) identity=helo; client-ip=65.55.116.40; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-sender="postmaster@blu0-omc1-s29.blu0.hotmail.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AmICAGIbpFBBN3QolGdsb2JhbABEwjwEgQIjAQEBAQkLEhQDJIIfAQWBCVFXBogLARIEqSmHaRGKGoxmgkyCRmEDiCWFS4JjgXeWZIIZ X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.83,252,1352070000"; d="scan'208";a="162502442" Received: from blu0-omc1-s29.blu0.hotmail.com ([65.55.116.40]) by mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr with ESMTP; 14 Nov 2012 23:30:45 +0100 Received: from BLU172-W33 ([65.55.116.7]) by blu0-omc1-s29.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 14 Nov 2012 14:30:43 -0800 Message-ID: X-Originating-IP: [88.189.81.31] From: Alexis Irlande To: Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2012 22:30:44 +0000 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <50A333C0.2060801@riken.jp> References: <20cf301af4932e938004ce13462e@google.com>,<50A333C0.2060801@riken.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Nov 2012 22:30:43.0965 (UTC) FILETIME=[AF4FAAD0:01CDC2B7] Subject: [Caml-list] =?ISO-8859-1?Q?OCaml_messages_in_French_/_messages_d?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?=27OCaml_en_fran=E7ais?= Hello everybody, I am new on the list. I have been teaching (O)Caml for 14 years, in France = and South America. I wasn't able to find a way to easily customize OCaml interpreter spoken la= nguage, the way Caml-light did, so I decided to make a source patch, mainly designed for my classroom compu= ters, in order to translate OCaml interpreter messages (errors, warnings, tracing, interruptions, and s= o on) in French. It now works quite well, so I was wondering if someone could be interested = by that tool... I have some questions : - Is it the right place to talk about that? - Am I duplicating some previous translating work?=20 - Is there some license issues about spreading such a patch? - May I post an alpha version here, as an attachment, so as to get members'= feedback? Given the subject matter, you can go on with the discussion in French, of c= ourse. Thanks for your attention. Alexis Irlande =20=09=09=20=09=20=20=20=09=09=20=20= From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Original-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Delivered-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Received: from mail1-relais-roc.national.inria.fr (mail1-relais-roc.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.82]) by sympa.inria.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 524B87EE20 for ; Fri, 16 Nov 2012 10:25:21 +0100 (CET) Received-SPF: None (mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of gabriel.scherer@gmail.com) identity=pra; client-ip=209.85.223.182; receiver=mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="gabriel.scherer@gmail.com"; x-sender="gabriel.scherer@gmail.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: Pass (mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr: domain of gabriel.scherer@gmail.com designates 209.85.223.182 as permitted sender) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=209.85.223.182; receiver=mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="gabriel.scherer@gmail.com"; x-sender="gabriel.scherer@gmail.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1" Received-SPF: None (mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of postmaster@mail-ie0-f182.google.com) identity=helo; client-ip=209.85.223.182; receiver=mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="gabriel.scherer@gmail.com"; x-sender="postmaster@mail-ie0-f182.google.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AnwBAA0GplDRVd+2mGdsb2JhbABEsBSSMAgjAQEBAQEICQ0HFCeCHgEBBAFAARsSCwEDAQsGBQsDCg0hIgERAQUBChIGExKHaAEDCQYLnyWMM4J4hHQKGScDCgdSiHUBBQyLPGmFDQOSSoMygRyNRhYphBKBWgc X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.83,263,1352070000"; d="scan'208";a="181800968" Received: from mail-ie0-f182.google.com ([209.85.223.182]) by mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr with ESMTP/TLS/RC4-SHA; 16 Nov 2012 10:25:11 +0100 Received: by mail-ie0-f182.google.com with SMTP id k10so5825108iea.27 for ; Fri, 16 Nov 2012 01:25:10 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=N4nrU3VDoXxpxzai/JFFirkzFc7nDB0Z4zh2kpQV7dw=; b=UGVGyXS5QDFeM+hTS6cViDFZoBULVay5/XrC0/mVMMPDqkV1xI6FHDP4IFvDhw6AtJ R6qeXh1UdhwhM3sh6PsAef4PmkPbiMxVN63+ZA9uPJrTqY4pfkpcr4yCXFSB/SmlO1Rt XPNyDwAKSPvOYY3YGh2MSB/l3GEB7+LGELTvBVAGovzRgUVW9ZiiPdhwohK+K0bKhL3T rrSKfBmQ5jV2cZsTCrU0UrujrNk3YPe7HE4XMRAfYcpMTwzKB8UIAteVawzd5uwwNrLt QVrAmGVvH2msYDmAgiI2Hbb1txMNKsiooYStehCr0kjDcwQBFnTrvxQQ0WOnAzR7M7Ip vtqQ== Received: by 10.50.173.34 with SMTP id bh2mr2440276igc.70.1353057910714; Fri, 16 Nov 2012 01:25:10 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.184.199 with HTTP; Fri, 16 Nov 2012 01:24:30 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <20cf301af4932e938004ce13462e@google.com> <50A333C0.2060801@riken.jp> From: Gabriel Scherer Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2012 10:24:30 +0100 Message-ID: To: Alexis Irlande Cc: caml-list@inria.fr Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Subject: Re: [Caml-list] =?ISO-8859-1?Q?OCaml_messages_in_French_/_message?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?s_d=27OCaml_en_fran=E7ais?= > I have some questions : > - Is it the right place to talk about that? Yes, definitely. I have more reserves about encouraging people to participate to the discussion in French: given that a notable proportion of the people subscribed to the list don't understand french, I'm not sure it's nice to send them unwanted french messages or take them out of the discussion. (There are other non-english-speaking communities using OCaml, for example in Russia and Japan, and they apparently haven't felt the need to communicate through the caml-list in their native language.) > - Am I duplicating some previous translating work? I'm not aware of any, but the Caml Light error messages used to be localized, so there are french translations available for Caml Light. I heard that there is some work ongoing to evaluate the feasability of using OCaml in the French junior high school, those people may be interested in such a translation (or have done one, but I don't know). You should definitely share your patch in case someone is interested. > - Is there some license issues about spreading such a patch? OCaml's free software license requests that you make it clear what's your code and what's the original work by distributing your changes as a separate patch (instead of distributing the complete code of the modifier compiler in only one step). Distributing only a patch is fine. It is also generally accepted that pointing to a source-versioning repository (a SVN or git repo for example) is correct, as the commit history makes it clear what your modification is. > - May I post an alpha version here, as an attachment, so as to get members' feedback? Of course, but it may be simpler and lighter to host this patch somewhere and refer list members to it. It would also make it easier for you in the future to point other people to this same patch. On a strictly personal level, I'm not terribly interested in such a feature: I have only interacted with OCaml beginners that, if maybe not completely comfortable with English, accepted to read technical english as part of their programming activity. If such a localization feature was available I'm not sure I would encourage people to use it -- if only because a single format for error message makes it easier to ask for help and search the web about it. That doesn't mean, of course, that I think nobody would care: I'm quite confident some people would have a use of localized error messages. I would be interested in more information on the profile of your students, that made such a change an important part of the teaching process. On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 11:30 PM, Alexis Irlande wrote: > > > Hello everybody, > > I am new on the list. I have been teaching (O)Caml for 14 years, in France and South America. > > I wasn't able to find a way to easily customize OCaml interpreter spoken language, the way Caml-light did, > so I decided to make a source patch, mainly designed for my classroom computers, in order to translate > OCaml interpreter messages (errors, warnings, tracing, interruptions, and so on) in French. > > It now works quite well, so I was wondering if someone could be interested by that tool... > > > I have some questions : > - Is it the right place to talk about that? > - Am I duplicating some previous translating work? > - Is there some license issues about spreading such a patch? > - May I post an alpha version here, as an attachment, so as to get members' feedback? > > Given the subject matter, you can go on with the discussion in French, of course. > > Thanks for your attention. > > > Alexis Irlande > > -- > Caml-list mailing list. Subscription management and archives: > https://sympa.inria.fr/sympa/arc/caml-list > Beginner's list: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ocaml_beginners > Bug reports: http://caml.inria.fr/bin/caml-bugs From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Original-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Delivered-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Received: from mail4-relais-sop.national.inria.fr (mail4-relais-sop.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.105]) by sympa.inria.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4FF677EE20 for ; Sat, 17 Nov 2012 20:08:16 +0100 (CET) Received-SPF: None (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of nexinexi@msn.com) identity=pra; client-ip=65.55.116.44; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-sender="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: Pass (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: domain of nexinexi@msn.com designates 65.55.116.44 as permitted sender) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=65.55.116.44; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-sender="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1" Received-SPF: None (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of postmaster@blu0-omc1-s33.blu0.hotmail.com) identity=helo; client-ip=65.55.116.44; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-sender="postmaster@blu0-omc1-s33.blu0.hotmail.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Ag4EAJTfp1BBN3QslGdsb2JhbABFgkmFcLZahBsjAQEBAQkLCQkUAySCHgEBBAFsAQYDCAsLLRlXBgEnBIdhAQwGBK04gTKFbhGKGo4OglJhA4glhUuCY5hbghk X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.83,270,1352070000"; d="scan'208,217";a="162850311" Received: from blu0-omc1-s33.blu0.hotmail.com ([65.55.116.44]) by mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr with ESMTP; 17 Nov 2012 20:08:15 +0100 Received: from BLU172-W15 ([65.55.116.9]) by blu0-omc1-s33.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Sat, 17 Nov 2012 11:08:13 -0800 Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_288eab60-e7ae-40a3-86aa-67d8d3cd60ea_" X-Originating-IP: [88.189.81.31] From: Alexis Irlande To: , Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2012 19:08:13 +0000 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: References: <20cf301af4932e938004ce13462e@google.com> <50A333C0.2060801@riken.jp>,, MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Nov 2012 19:08:13.0733 (UTC) FILETIME=[E472A550:01CDC4F6] Subject: RE: [Caml-list] =?ISO-8859-1?Q?OCaml_messages_in_French_/_message?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?s_d=27OCaml_en_fran=E7ais?= --_288eab60-e7ae-40a3-86aa-67d8d3cd60ea_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Gabriel, Thanks for all your comments. I will take them into account. > the Caml Light error messages used to be > localized, so there are french translations available for Caml Light. Yes, I tried to reuse a lot of things from there. Actually, I first wrote a patch for Spanish, but less complete. > You should definitely share your patch in case someone is interested. Thomas Gazagnaire offered me to put it in OPAM. Duly noted. > I heard that there is some work ongoing to evaluate the feasability of > using OCaml in the French junior high school [...] If you have some reference, I would be interested. > On a strictly personal level, I'm not terribly interested in such a > feature: I have only interacted with OCaml beginners that, if maybe > not completely comfortable with English, accepted to read technical > english as part of their programming activity. In a "perfect" world, made of young graduated polyglot engineers, you are t= otally right. But in a world like planet Earth, where 70% of people never learnt English, only 7% have a computer and 1% have an academic diploma, things are a bit complicated. There is the problem of aged people and children, too. > I would be interested in more information on the profile of your > students, that made such a change an important part of the teaching > process. I have been professor at the National University of Bogota (Colombia) where I taught Mathematics and Computer science for 5 years. There, the students have very diverse origins. Some are teachers from other universities that come to learn more,=20 but some are young people that come from very little villages and have difficulties to even correctly speak Spanish. Their parents sometimes barely knew how to read and write, they have no idea how to behave in a classroom, how to redact an exam, etc. But their good willing is not in cause... they just don't know. They are doing a big cultural effort to come to study in a big city. If you, the "gringo" (with all that it means), show that you are doing a cultural effort too, you gain some respect. This effort must be at least linguistic. If you are involved in the development of what you are teaching (if only adapting, debugging, deploying, documenting it) and not just only = copying someone else's book to the blackboard, you gain some credibility. If you present something modern, tailor-made and experimental, you gain som= e interest. All of that is indispensable if you want to sincerely convince the students to play the game of intellectual rigour, what is really difficult, taking i= nto account the state of the educational system (especially public) of the country. CAML is interesting from that point of view, because it helps to have clear ratiocination, it automates almost all that can be automated in programming and the error explanation is really instructive and sufficient to solve the= problem. (no "segmentation fault " but "this pattern-matching is not exhaustive. Here is an example of a value that is not matched: 0" ) If everything goes well, the student is autonomous, and can progress alone. But if a student really can't understand the sentences, the magic is not wo= rking.=20 And all you get is a polite but definitive "Sir, it doesn't work !" My experience shows that most of the time, in a classroom, when a student is blocked by a CAML error, reading the error slowly and carefully with words easy to understand by him, is sufficient to solve the problem. And curiously, this fact is independent of the country... :-) As a consequence, a big part of your job is... translating! Here comes the idea of translating once and for all. Moreover, IMHO, in a normal process, one obtains every error just once (well, let's say... "a little number of times") and then learns how not to do the same error again, until having problems with another error, etc. Until, at last, just obtaining typos or very uncommon errors. So, for the student, investing time learning the precise translation of an = error, thinking he will use that knowledge a lot in his whole life, is not the rea= lity. The reality is that he is learning how not to obtain it again, and he needs to concentrate on that fact, the rest of the process being immediate and tr= ansparent. The only one that will obtain the same basic errors, again and again, in hi= s whole life is... the teacher. Second reason for translating those errors once and for all. That's why I wrote a Spanish patch for my Colombian students. (I hope to be able to finalize it in a few weeks) I also wrote a more complete and precise one for French, which is my langua= ge. (That one is ready and I will share it soon) Hope this answers your question. > If such a localization > feature was available I'm not sure I would encourage people to use it > -- if only because a single format for error message makes it easier > to ask for help and search the web about it. You are right. But what do you actually find on the web? An very explicit clarification, from people like you, who speak with your w= ords, of a message in English, that was very explicit too (as usual in CAML). Finally, some kind of... translation! (Third reason?) > I have more reserves about encouraging people to > participate to the discussion in French [...] That wasn't my intention ;-) I was just trying not to exclude people who have big difficulties writing in English, because the topic is all about that. Nothing more. Sorry for that. Alexis =20=09=09=20=09=20=20=20=09=09=20=20= --_288eab60-e7ae-40a3-86aa-67d8d3cd60ea_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Dear Gabriel,

Thanks for all your comments. I will take them int= o account.

> the Caml Light error messages used to be
>= localized, so there are french translations available for Caml Light.
<= br> Yes, I tried to reuse a lot of things from there.
Actually, I first wrote a patch for Spanish, but less complete.

= > You should definitely share your patch in case someone is interested.<= br>
Thomas Gazagnaire offered me to put it in OPAM. Duly noted.

> I heard that there is some work ongoing to evaluate the feasability of=
> using OCaml in the French junior high school [...]

If you have some reference, I would be interested.

> On a strictly perso= nal level, I'm not terribly interested in such a
> feature: I have on= ly interacted with OCaml beginners that, if maybe
> not completely co= mfortable with English, accepted to read technical
> english as part = of their programming activity.

In a "perfect" world, made of young graduated polyglot engineers, you are t= otally right.

But in a world like planet Earth, where 70% of people never learnt English,=
only 7% have a computer and 1% have an academic diploma,
things are a bi= t complicated.
There is the problem = of aged people and children, too.

> I would be interes= ted in more information on the profile of your
> students, that made = such a change an important part of the teaching
> process.

I h= ave been professor at the National University of Bogota (Colombia)
where= I taught Mathematics and Computer science for 5 years.
There, the stude= nts have very diverse origins.
Some are teachers from other universities= that come to learn more,
but some are young people that come from very= little villages and have
difficulties to even correctly speak Spanish.<= br>Their parents sometimes barely knew how to read and write,
they have = no idea how to behave in a classroom, how to redact an exam, etc.
But th= eir good willing is not in cause... they just don't know.
They are doing= a big cultural effort to come to study in a big city.

If you, the "= gringo" (with all that it means), show that you are doing
a cultural eff= ort too, you gain some respect.
This effort must be at least linguistic.=

If you are involved in the deve= lopment of what you are teaching
(if only adapting, debugging, deploying= , documenting it) and not just only copying
someone else's book to the b= lackboard, you gain some credibility.
If you present something modern, t= ailor-made and experimental, you gain some interest.

All of that is = indispensable if you want to sincerely convince the students
to play the= game of intellectual rigour, what is really difficult, taking into account=
the state of the educational system (especially public) of the country.=

CAML is interesting from that point of view, because it helps to ha= ve clear
ratiocination, it automates almost all that can be automated in= programming
and the error explanation is really instructive and suffici= ent to solve the problem.
(no "segmentation fault " but "this pattern-ma= tching is not exhaustive.
Here is an example of a value that is not matc= hed: 0" )
If everything goes well, the student is autonomous, and can pr= ogress alone.

But if a student really can't understand the sentences= , the magic is not working.
And all you get is a polite but definitive = "Sir, it doesn't work !"

= My experience shows that most of the time, in a classroom, when a studentis blocked by a CAML error, reading the error slowly and carefully
wit= h words easy to understand by him, is sufficient to solve the problem.
<= br>And curiously, this fact is independent of the country... :-)

As = a consequence, a big part of your job is... translating!
Here comes the = idea of translating once and for all.

Moreover, IMHO, in a normal = process, one obtains every error just once
(well, let's say... "a little= number of times") and then learns how not
to do the same error again, u= ntil having problems with another error, etc.
Until, at last, just obtai= ning typos or very uncommon errors.

So, for the student, investing t= ime learning the precise translation of an error,
thinking he will use t= hat knowledge a lot in his whole life, is not the reality.
The reality i= s that he is learning how not to obtain it again, and he needs
to concen= trate on that fact, the rest of the process being immediate and transparent= .
The only one that will obtain the same basic errors, again and again, = in his whole life is... the teacher.
Second reason for translating those errors once and for all.

That's why I wrote a Spanish patch for my Colombian students.(I hope to be able to finalize it in a few weeks)
I also wrote a more complete and precise one for Fren= ch, which is my language.
(That one is ready and I will share it soon)
Hope this answers your question.

> If such a localizat= ion
> feature was available I'm not sure I would encourage people to = use it
> -- if only because a single format for error message makes i= t easier
> to ask for help and search the web about it.

You ar= e right.
But what do you actually find on the web?
An very explicit c= larification, from people like you, who speak with your words,
of a mess= age in English, that was very explicit too (as usual in CAML).
Finally, = some kind of... translation!
(Third reason?)

> I have more= reserves about encouraging people to

> participate to the discussion in French [...]

That wasn't my intention ;-)
I was just trying not to exclude people who have big difficulties writing in English, because the topic is all about that. Nothing more.
Sorry for that.

Alexis

= --_288eab60-e7ae-40a3-86aa-67d8d3cd60ea_-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Original-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Delivered-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Received: from mail4-relais-sop.national.inria.fr (mail4-relais-sop.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.105]) by sympa.inria.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 869307EE20 for ; Sun, 18 Nov 2012 01:53:16 +0100 (CET) Received-SPF: None (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of nexinexi@msn.com) identity=pra; client-ip=65.55.116.45; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-sender="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: Pass (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: domain of nexinexi@msn.com designates 65.55.116.45 as permitted sender) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=65.55.116.45; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-sender="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1" Received-SPF: None (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of postmaster@blu0-omc1-s34.blu0.hotmail.com) identity=helo; client-ip=65.55.116.45; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="nexinexi@msn.com"; x-sender="postmaster@blu0-omc1-s34.blu0.hotmail.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AscCANkwqFBBN3Qtk2dsb2JhbABFwicEgQQjAQEBAQkJCwkUAySCHwEFgQlRVwaIDQEJCQQHrVSDZoMUEYoajGmBMYJGYQOIJYVLgmOYW4IZ X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.83,271,1352070000"; d="scan'208";a="162863556" Received: from blu0-omc1-s34.blu0.hotmail.com ([65.55.116.45]) by mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr with ESMTP; 18 Nov 2012 01:53:15 +0100 Received: from BLU172-W32 ([65.55.116.7]) by blu0-omc1-s34.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Sat, 17 Nov 2012 16:53:14 -0800 Message-ID: X-Originating-IP: [88.189.81.31] From: Alexis Irlande To: Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2012 00:53:14 +0000 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: References: <20cf301af4932e938004ce13462e@google.com>,<50A333C0.2060801@riken.jp>,,, Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Nov 2012 00:53:14.0432 (UTC) FILETIME=[1706A400:01CDC527] Subject: [Caml-list] =?ISO-8859-1?Q?OCaml_messages_in_French_/_messages_d?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?=27OCaml_en_fran=E7ais_-_link?= Here is a link to an alpha version of my patch that translates ocaml messag= es to French. http://dl.dropbox.com/u/59215589/ocaml-4.00.1_french_alpha.tgz This is the first "public" release so I would greatly appreciate comments especially about installation instructions, grammar, spelling, typography, oversights and "official" french OCaml jargon. I hope to be able to release the same for Spanish soon. Alexis Irlande =20=09=09=20=09=20=20=20=09=09=20=20= From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Original-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Delivered-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Received: from mail4-relais-sop.national.inria.fr (mail4-relais-sop.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.105]) by sympa.inria.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7EBAF7EE20 for ; Sun, 18 Nov 2012 12:09:49 +0100 (CET) Received-SPF: None (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of pierreetienne.meunier@gmail.com) identity=pra; client-ip=74.125.82.182; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="pierreetienne.meunier@gmail.com"; x-sender="pierreetienne.meunier@gmail.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: Pass (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: domain of pierreetienne.meunier@gmail.com designates 74.125.82.182 as permitted sender) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=74.125.82.182; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="pierreetienne.meunier@gmail.com"; x-sender="pierreetienne.meunier@gmail.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1" Received-SPF: None (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of postmaster@mail-we0-f182.google.com) identity=helo; client-ip=74.125.82.182; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="pierreetienne.meunier@gmail.com"; x-sender="postmaster@mail-we0-f182.google.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AqUBAJrBqFBKfVK2kGdsb2JhbABEsBuTDAgjAQEBAQkJDQcUBCOCHgEBBAFAARsSDAMMBgULGiEjEQEFAQoSBiWHaAEDBgMGBAehPYwzgnhugwoKGScDClmIdQEFDIwohCxhA5V8gRyET4h3P4QS X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.83,273,1352070000"; d="scan'208";a="162887579" Received: from mail-we0-f182.google.com ([74.125.82.182]) by mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr with ESMTP/TLS/RC4-SHA; 18 Nov 2012 12:09:48 +0100 Received: by mail-we0-f182.google.com with SMTP id u54so571315wey.27 for ; Sun, 18 Nov 2012 03:09:48 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=content-type:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to:x-mailer; bh=OpmfCgEFLwvb9uMSyb6Cycughd8sT+Fb26ASwlhQyyw=; b=nor2GYywcOIGnNe/AYkquVMEIHfTi/xsHVoz0sWL2VI03kxwuGT/rODPPWMhWiW646 kGHAeoTGbaYiSEW6gHxrosEOFXkUHDxUtL8JhoqIaVMBmXI+bZEedWgYbPetAuIBTRYF 463PSZmDhP9gLRTZRz8pPNXRJ6xwdl9TFci+Y0bbNA/JHwLHaJW5lhw1ICnFmMnScIMb s2RH0Rp4AB8xfnuk70M552AbBKEeg0XabosipxAF1NRF9NjLwKjmzMJ65pfK9sJSzDr0 bwBcZ/Ej+ZFMvLUWOZjPKMaJsZrr9DI2yU6IyK8O1fKrt9VhIyJI8uXXUAHavRvJKOah M4Zg== Received: by 10.180.97.72 with SMTP id dy8mr4843310wib.6.1353236988671; Sun, 18 Nov 2012 03:09:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.45] (msl73-1-82-247-167-128.fbx.proxad.net. [82.247.167.128]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id p2sm8587748wic.7.2012.11.18.03.09.47 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sun, 18 Nov 2012 03:09:48 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1085) From: Pierre-Etienne Meunier In-Reply-To: Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2012 12:09:46 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <72B92FDB-38E7-4108-A907-E1032FC141B0@gmail.com> References: <20cf301af4932e938004ce13462e@google.com>,<50A333C0.2060801@riken.jp>,,,

To: O Caml X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1085) Subject: Re: [Caml-list] =?ISO-8859-1?Q?OCaml_messages_in_French_/_message?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?s_d=27OCaml_en_fran=E7ais_-_link?= Would it be even possible to make a kind of "generic" translation module, s= o that each new translation could be done easily by anyone, and integrated = to linux distributions such as debian which provide lots of translated prog= rams ? Also, a cool idea is see in this feature is the ability for an external pro= gram to understand ocaml's error messages without parsing messages in engli= sh, if you can provide a translation to integers, or even to for example. Pierre Em 18/11/2012, =E0s 01:53, Alexis Irlande escreveu: >=20 >=20 > Here is a link to an alpha version of my patch that translates ocaml mess= ages to French. >=20 > http://dl.dropbox.com/u/59215589/ocaml-4.00.1_french_alpha.tgz >=20 > This is the first "public" release so I would greatly appreciate comments > especially about installation instructions, grammar, spelling, typography, > oversights and "official" french OCaml jargon. >=20 > I hope to be able to release the same for Spanish soon. >=20 >=20 > Alexis Irlande >=20=09=09=20=09=20=20=20=09=09=20=20 > --=20 > Caml-list mailing list. Subscription management and archives: > https://sympa.inria.fr/sympa/arc/caml-list > Beginner's list: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ocaml_beginners > Bug reports: http://caml.inria.fr/bin/caml-bugs From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Original-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Delivered-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Received: from mail1-relais-roc.national.inria.fr (mail1-relais-roc.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.82]) by sympa.inria.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F217C7EE20 for ; Mon, 19 Nov 2012 02:19:54 +0100 (CET) Received-SPF: None (mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of berenger@riken.jp) identity=pra; client-ip=134.160.33.175; receiver=mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="berenger@riken.jp"; x-sender="berenger@riken.jp"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: Pass (mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr: domain of berenger@riken.jp designates 134.160.33.175 as permitted sender) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=134.160.33.175; receiver=mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="berenger@riken.jp"; x-sender="berenger@riken.jp"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1" Received-SPF: Pass (mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr: domain of postmaster@postman.riken.jp designates 134.160.33.175 as permitted sender) identity=helo; client-ip=134.160.33.175; receiver=mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="berenger@riken.jp"; x-sender="postmaster@postman.riken.jp"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1" X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AlsEAOuIqVCGoCGvgWdsb2JhbABFv1KCUgQEgSoBARYmJ4IeAQEFOEARCxgJFg8JAwIBAgFFEwgBARCHeb8pjDSBZoMnA4hYjSSFa41WgUwH X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.83,275,1352070000"; d="scan'208";a="182064573" Received: from postman3.riken.jp (HELO postman.riken.jp) ([134.160.33.175]) by mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr with ESMTP; 19 Nov 2012 02:19:53 +0100 Received: from postman.riken.jp (postman3.riken.jp [127.0.0.1]) by postman.riken.jp (Postfix) with SMTP id 59D1A38380C7 for ; Mon, 19 Nov 2012 10:19:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from [172.27.98.103] (rikad98.riken.jp [134.160.214.98]) by postman.riken.jp (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 1AC323820138 for ; Mon, 19 Nov 2012 10:19:50 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <50A98936.9090009@riken.jp> Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2012 10:19:50 +0900 From: Francois Berenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:16.0) Gecko/20121028 Thunderbird/16.0.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: caml-list@inria.fr References: <20cf301af4932e938004ce13462e@google.com> <50A333C0.2060801@riken.jp>

In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-PMX-Version: 5.6.0.2009776, Antispam-Engine: 2.7.2.376379, Antispam-Data: 2012.11.19.11220 Subject: Re: [Caml-list] =?ISO-8859-1?Q?OCaml_messages_in_French_/_message?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?s_d=27OCaml_en_fran=E7ais?= On 11/16/2012 06:24 PM, Gabriel Scherer wrote: >> I have some questions : >> - Is it the right place to talk about that? > > Yes, definitely. I have more reserves about encouraging people to > participate to the discussion in French: given that a notable > proportion of the people subscribed to the list don't understand > french, I'm not sure it's nice to send them unwanted french messages > or take them out of the discussion. > > (There are other non-english-speaking communities using OCaml, for > example in Russia and Japan, and they apparently haven't felt the need > to communicate through the caml-list in their native language.) But maybe they should communicate on caml-list in English to less fragment the community... From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Original-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Delivered-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Received: from mail1-relais-roc.national.inria.fr (mail1-relais-roc.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.82]) by sympa.inria.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 20DE87EE20 for ; Mon, 19 Nov 2012 11:04:48 +0100 (CET) Received-SPF: None (mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of gabriel.scherer@gmail.com) identity=pra; client-ip=209.85.223.182; receiver=mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="gabriel.scherer@gmail.com"; x-sender="gabriel.scherer@gmail.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: Pass (mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr: domain of gabriel.scherer@gmail.com designates 209.85.223.182 as permitted sender) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=209.85.223.182; receiver=mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="gabriel.scherer@gmail.com"; x-sender="gabriel.scherer@gmail.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1" Received-SPF: None (mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of postmaster@mail-ie0-f182.google.com) identity=helo; client-ip=209.85.223.182; receiver=mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="gabriel.scherer@gmail.com"; x-sender="postmaster@mail-ie0-f182.google.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AvsBAEkDqlDRVd+2kWdsb2JhbABFsCWTEQgjAQEBAQkJDQcSKYIeAQEFQAEbEgsBAwwGBQsNDSEiAREBBQEKEgYTEgKHZgEDDwuhH4wzgniENQoZJwMKWYh1AQUMjCiFDQOVfIEcjUYWKYQSgVoH X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.83,278,1352070000"; d="scan'208";a="182119623" Received: from mail-ie0-f182.google.com ([209.85.223.182]) by mail1-smtp-roc.national.inria.fr with ESMTP/TLS/RC4-SHA; 19 Nov 2012 11:04:47 +0100 Received: by mail-ie0-f182.google.com with SMTP id k10so11414091iea.27 for ; Mon, 19 Nov 2012 02:04:46 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=BNCDBAPcYPgumd2/aw1phiWcbAALHbyNYQMi7IFEPo8=; b=aItBS7fpEPmlNjnCDsHDT/WTZ1c3FRj6bnswz8Cy/ZVonK4yZmd8ax4Z36mZwTt+I0 dQ/KGVAKjrQVipaUowU3OPpsiY6ltiNia6qVgVWbKdBYvmbnqNL+nJBWJhxudSh+ft3v 7GVCM/lIuc1ny5ue3IYz21g8bbkuw235Q5JvEirXxxTgeeXJh90talRJzyll4l4XdKQM k02XPNiqTYmlIKT0GC90MOpkFo0zojSBaa6K6nEenaiC8XaeFfugXSOvkG6N8hFx3gOc MAlCGXfS9QcZOU82CgW5Zq3jUfihD+k2T19AyAKH3pML7OUOiV0V5zJaW/3OJNht+14O Cc2w== Received: by 10.50.173.34 with SMTP id bh2mr5991691igc.70.1353319486477; Mon, 19 Nov 2012 02:04:46 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.184.199 with HTTP; Mon, 19 Nov 2012 02:04:05 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <50A98936.9090009@riken.jp> References: <20cf301af4932e938004ce13462e@google.com> <50A333C0.2060801@riken.jp>

<50A98936.9090009@riken.jp> From: Gabriel Scherer Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2012 11:04:05 +0100 Message-ID: To: Francois Berenger Cc: caml-list@inria.fr Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Subject: Re: [Caml-list] =?ISO-8859-1?Q?OCaml_messages_in_French_/_message?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?s_d=27OCaml_en_fran=E7ais?= I'll let people decide where they choose to communicate. On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 2:19 AM, Francois Berenger wrote: > On 11/16/2012 06:24 PM, Gabriel Scherer wrote: >>> >>> I have some questions : >>> - Is it the right place to talk about that? >> >> >> Yes, definitely. I have more reserves about encouraging people to >> participate to the discussion in French: given that a notable >> proportion of the people subscribed to the list don't understand >> french, I'm not sure it's nice to send them unwanted french messages >> or take them out of the discussion. >> >> (There are other non-english-speaking communities using OCaml, for >> example in Russia and Japan, and they apparently haven't felt the need >> to communicate through the caml-list in their native language.) > > > But maybe they should communicate on caml-list in English to less > fragment the community... > > > > -- > Caml-list mailing list. Subscription management and archives: > https://sympa.inria.fr/sympa/arc/caml-list > Beginner's list: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ocaml_beginners > Bug reports: http://caml.inria.fr/bin/caml-bugs From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Original-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Delivered-To: caml-list@sympa.inria.fr Received: from mail4-relais-sop.national.inria.fr (mail4-relais-sop.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.105]) by sympa.inria.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 58A457F2B5 for ; Sun, 23 Dec 2012 11:27:36 +0100 (CET) Received-SPF: None (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of camaradetux@gmail.com) identity=pra; client-ip=209.85.220.50; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="camaradetux@gmail.com"; x-sender="camaradetux@gmail.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: Pass (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: domain of camaradetux@gmail.com designates 209.85.220.50 as permitted sender) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=209.85.220.50; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="camaradetux@gmail.com"; x-sender="camaradetux@gmail.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1" Received-SPF: None (mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr: no sender authenticity information available from domain of postmaster@mail-pa0-f50.google.com) identity=helo; client-ip=209.85.220.50; receiver=mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr; envelope-from="camaradetux@gmail.com"; x-sender="postmaster@mail-pa0-f50.google.com"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: ApUCACbb1lDRVdwylGdsb2JhbABDvgEIFg4BAQEBCQkLGymCHgEBBUABGx0BAwwGBQsNLiEBAREBBQEcBhMIE4dlAQMPlw6MM4J7g3AKGScNWYh2AQUMi2FqhEMDjhiGHoFWizeDMRYphBY X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.84,341,1355094000"; d="scan'208";a="166661767" Received: from mail-pa0-f50.google.com ([209.85.220.50]) by mail4-smtp-sop.national.inria.fr with ESMTP/TLS/RC4-SHA; 23 Dec 2012 11:27:35 +0100 Received: by mail-pa0-f50.google.com with SMTP id hz10so3633287pad.9 for ; Sun, 23 Dec 2012 02:27:33 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=zaH3ZoRvMTfaoISLVYfE44JY5R1XOj8VyHkGXV65XYU=; b=vdMLDatHwQArMZZJursZn+khToJ1Vv1hMZKwTjQvZuUp42ijLDZDh61RycCX0WwVBh cob2poaRtVAf/F+74GJ1HlL0nuTAISbjw3J8NBDGLhHFWSZuhuiI64DJpUbmpYNSOOVV pyBZO5Gq1po0nqNN+ufHZNR7a9YyFxYNTEJUsPiqZ0qqTBZy44NU2JODvRjd1JisTovL jltOjCE07JgyiMc3d2yfn25K+LuvXWQdjxBZ46WUvaP7fPIxJHz3AxZo3q6Tb1YSya2J HE6WZYAEUO1CM/7x4jOSlYRqbUxMRpm+gjVqhYBqpkAvTSJhcDVzd4gCegXoA7q5qKGB goLw== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.68.239.99 with SMTP id vr3mr56189859pbc.154.1356258453556; Sun, 23 Dec 2012 02:27:33 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.68.23.162 with HTTP; Sun, 23 Dec 2012 02:27:33 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <72B92FDB-38E7-4108-A907-E1032FC141B0@gmail.com> References: <20cf301af4932e938004ce13462e@google.com> <50A333C0.2060801@riken.jp>

<72B92FDB-38E7-4108-A907-E1032FC141B0@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 23 Dec 2012 11:27:33 +0100 Message-ID: From: Adrien To: Pierre-Etienne Meunier Cc: O Caml Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Subject: Re: [Caml-list] =?ISO-8859-1?Q?OCaml_messages_in_French_/_message?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?s_d=27OCaml_en_fran=E7ais_-_link?= Hi, On 18/11/2012, Pierre-Etienne Meunier wrote: > Would it be even possible to make a kind of "generic" translation module, so > that each new translation could be done easily by anyone, and integrated to > linux distributions such as debian which provide lots of translated programs > ? With such an infrastructure it would be possible to have messages that are not only localized but also of varying verbosity with messages for beginners which would be more verbose. It could also make it easier and nicer to improve the current messages. About the technical aspect, the only sane solution I know of is gettext (catgets() is the POSIX standard and noone uses it because it's awful). There is an ocaml library for gettext support but unless it is integrated into ocaml, there will be a bootstrapping issue. By the way, Alexis, I think the license of this translation (GPLv3) is unfortunately incompatible with the QPL that OCaml uses for the compiler [actually this might depend on the exact interpretation of the QPL and I think Xavier Leroy's makes it compatible]. A typical way to license translations is "under the same license as the code" since they're more than mere data. In any case, thanks for thinking about it; most people skip that important part. -- Adrien Nader