Re: [Caml-list] [ANN] OCaml Batteries Included, alpha 3

From: "Mikkel Fahnøe Jørgensen" <mikkel@dvide.com>
To: David Rajchenbach-Teller <David.Teller@ens-lyon.org>
Cc: OCaml <caml-list@inria.fr>
Subject: Re: [Caml-list] [ANN] OCaml Batteries Included, alpha 3
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 15:21:17 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <caee5ad80902070621v3771af6cu5cfc692ca37a7fec@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1233936696.6216.65.camel@Blefuscu>

Great work.

I just quickly scanned the Batteries slideshow.
Regarding the analysis of popular languages, I agree.
But I think one very important aspect is being overlooked:

I think the build system is extremely important, just after library support.

I believe the success of "scripting" and especially dynamic typing is
that you can just write some code and run it. Rarely do have to
consider make files etc. Of course, the problem sometimes just
multiplies so all end users have to deal with installing the proper
libraries, but this is partially offset by having good standard
libraries.

I also believe the success of dynamic typing is mostly due to the fact
that you can just get starting doing whatever you like. Fortunately
for OCaml this is also true for type inference, and I think this is
why so many Ruby programmers also look a little into OCaml.

I think the build environment is one of OCamls great weaknesses and
that we need to improve here before the language well ever go
mainstream. Most of these problems relate to a comparatively complex
ocaml tool chain, but another problem is the tendency of library
writers to delibarately use non-portable tools where they are not
really needed - simply because others do the same and eventually it
just becomes to difficult to support cross platform builds.

So in conclusion, Batteries is a very important contribution but we
must also improve on the tool chains and build environment.
ocamlbuild, flexdll, cross platform findlib and ocamlmklib are all
steps in the right direction.

Mikkel

2009/2/6 David Rajchenbach-Teller <David.Teller@ens-lyon.org>:
>     Dear list,
>
>  We're happy to inform you  that OCaml Batteries Included alpha 3 is now
> available for download [1] and/or GODI installation. You may find the
> new documentation on-line [2], as well as release notes [3], extended
> release notes [4] and the slides for the OCaml Meeting talk [5]. The
> list of changes is a tad too long to present here, but the important
> part is that we're progressing towards maturity.
>
> Enjoy!
>
> The OCaml Batteries Included team
>
> [1] http://forge.ocamlcore.org/frs/?group_id=17&release_id=73
> [2]
> http://forge.ocamlcore.org/docman/index.php?group_id=17&selected_doc_group_id=59&language_id=1
> [3]  https://forge.ocamlcore.org/frs/shownotes.php?release_id=73
> [4]
> http://dutherenverseauborddelatable.wordpress.com/2009/02/06/ocaml-batteries-included-alpha-3/
> [5]
> http://forge.ocamlcore.org/docman/index.php?group_id=77&selected_doc_group_id=84&language_id=1
>
> --
> David Teller-Rajchenbach
>  Security of Distributed Systems
>  http://www.univ-orleans.fr/lifo/Members/David.Teller
>   « Ce matin Un crétin A tué un chercheur. » (air connu)
>   Latest News of French Research: System being liquidated. Researchers angry.
>
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