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From: Marco Grandis <grandis@dima.unige.it>
To: Michael Barr <barr@math.mcgill.ca>, categories@mta.ca
Subject: Re: Question on exact sequence
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 15:44:57 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <E1N8EYa-0004nF-GA@mailserv.mta.ca> (raw)

Dear Michael,

The following lemma extends both results.

We have a sequence of consecutive morphisms indexed on the integers

	...  ---->   An  ---->  An+1  ---->  An+2  ---->  ...

(if your sequence is finite, you extend by zero's). Call  f(n,m)  the
composite
from  An  to  Am  (n < m).

Then, writing  H/K  a subquotient  H/(H intersection K),
there is an unbounded exact sequence of induced morphisms:

    ...  ---->   Ker f(n,n+2) / Im f(n-1,n)
    	---->   Ker f(n+1,n+2) / Im f(n-1,n+1)
    	---->   Ker f(n+1,n+3) / Im f(n,n+1) ---->  ...

where morphisms are alternatively induced by an 'elementary' morphism
(say An  -->  An+1) or by an identity.

At each step, one increases of one unit the first index in the numerator
and the second index in the denominator, or the opposite
(alternatively); after
two steps, all indices are increased of one unit, and we go along in
the same way.

-  Your lemma comes out of a sequence  A ----> B ----> C  (extended
with zeros).

-  Snake's lemma, with your letters, comes out of a sequence of three
morphisms
whose total composite is 0

      					 A ----> B ----> B' ----> C
taking into account that  A' = Ker(B' ----> C')  and  C = Cok(A ---->
B).

I like your lemma (and the Snake's). The form above does not look
really nice.
Perhaps someone else will find a nicer solution?

However, if one looks at the universal model of a sequence of
consecutive morphisms,
in my third paper on Distributive Homological Algebra, Cahiers 26,
1985, p.186,
the exact sequence above is obvious. (Much in the same way as for the
sequence of
the Snake Lemma, p. 188, diagrams (10) and (11).) This is how I found
it.

Best wishes

Marco




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             reply	other threads:[~2009-11-10 14:44 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 20+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2009-11-10 14:44 Marco Grandis [this message]
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2009-11-13  2:05 F William Lawvere
2009-11-12 19:58 Michael Barr
2009-11-11 17:29 Marco Grandis
2009-11-11 17:15 Marco Grandis
2009-11-11 16:36 George Janelidze
2009-11-11 16:34 Clemens.BERGER
2009-11-11 15:04 George Janelidze
2009-11-12 12:41 ` Michael Barr
2009-11-13 16:06   ` Michael Barr
     [not found]   ` <00a001ca63f6$80936b50$0b00000a@C3>
     [not found]     ` <Pine.LNX.4.64.0911122132300.27416@msr03.math.mcgill.ca>
     [not found]       ` <000f01ca644d$065eb590$0b00000a@C3>
     [not found]         ` <Pine.LNX.4.64.0911131101330.27416@msr03.math.mcgill.ca>
2009-11-13 18:15           ` George Janelidze
2009-11-14 16:24   ` Michael Barr
2009-11-15 14:35     ` George Janelidze
2009-11-16 16:43       ` Marco Grandis
2009-11-13  0:16 ` George Janelidze
2009-11-11 11:05 Steve Lack
2009-11-10 20:14 Ross Street
2009-11-10 16:15 Michael Barr
2009-11-10  3:22 Steve Lack
2009-11-09 22:57 Michael Barr

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