From: "Joyal, André" <joyal.andre@uqam.ca>
To: "Marco Grandis" <grandis@dima.unige.it>
Subject: Re: Equality again
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2010 10:38:04 -0400 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <E1OJnW1-0005rK-5q@mailserv.mta.ca> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <E1OJQGh-0002Ks-Di@mailserv.mta.ca>
Dear Marco,
We could use of the dotted-equality symbol only when the
canonical isomorphism under consideration is part of
a contractible network of isomorphisms. The network does
not need to be explicitly identified if the context is clear enough.
For example, the dotted equality
(A times B)times C =. A times (B times C)
is refering to the associativity constraint.
The dotted equality
A times B =. B times A
is refering to the symmetry constraint. But
the dotted equality
A times A =. A times A
is ambiguous and should be excluded (actually, it
is not ambiguous, since the identity of A times A
is denoted A times A = A times A ).
I am proposing a rule of thumb, not a new formalism.
Mathematics is as much an art as it is an exact science.
Best,
André
-------- Message d'origine--------
De: categories@mta.ca de la part de Marco Grandis
Date: mar. 01/06/2010 02:36
À: Prof. Peter Johnstone; categories@mta.ca
Objet : categories: Re: Equality again
On 27 May 2010, at 13:30, Prof. Peter Johnstone wrote:
>
> TeX provides a command \doteq for an equality sign with a dot over it;
> this is used in other areas of mathematics to mean "is approximately
> equal to", but as far as I know it hasn't yet been used by category-
> theorists. Perhaps we could use it to mean "is canonically
> isomorphic to"?
>
> I'd also like to use it (or something like it) between pairs of
> morphisms, meaning that (they are not equal but) they become equal
> when composed with the appropriate canonical isomorphisms (to which
> I can't be bothered to give names) in order to match up their domains
> and codomains. (Of course, this is simply saying that they are
> canonically isomorphic as objects of the functor category [2,C],
> where C is the category in which they live.)
>
> Peter Johnstone
Dear Peter,
Isn't this very dangerous?
1. First, I think you are referring to some (specified) *coherent*
(contractible) system of isomorphisms,
otherwise you can easily prove that 1 = - 1 (see an example below).
2. Even in that case, we know that coherence can be a delicate thing.
Let us take the cartesian product in Set (or the tensor product in a
symmetric monoidal category).
Would you write XxY =. YxX for the symmetry isomorphism s?
Then by XxX =. XxX do you mean s or the identity?
For XxXxX =. XxXxX we have six permutations of variables, generated
by sxX and Xxs; and so on.
I hope nobody will suggest some complicated trick to account for this;
transpositions and permutations are already there, known to
everybody; but we have to name them.
3. Coming back to point 1, "canonical" isomorphisms need not be
coherent.
There are a lot of such situations; I like to refer to the induced
isomorphisms in homological algebra,
because much of my early work was linked with that.
...
[For admin and other information see: http://www.mta.ca/~cat-dist/ ]
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2010-06-01 14:38 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 34+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2010-05-19 10:38 Re terminology: Ronnie Brown
2010-05-20 7:58 ` soloviev
2010-05-20 19:53 ` terminology Eduardo J. Dubuc
2010-05-20 22:15 ` Re terminology: Joyal, Andre
2010-05-20 11:58 ` Urs Schreiber
[not found] ` <AANLkTikre9x4Qikw0mqOl1qZs9DDSkcBu3CXWA05OTQT@mail.gmail.com>
2010-05-21 17:00 ` Ronnie Brown
2010-05-22 19:40 ` Joyal, André
[not found] ` <B3C24EA955FF0C4EA14658997CD3E25E370F5827@CAHIER.gst.uqam.ca>
2010-05-22 21:43 ` terminology Ronnie Brown
[not found] ` <4BF84FF3.7060806@btinternet.com>
2010-05-22 22:44 ` terminology Joyal, André
2010-05-23 15:39 ` terminology Colin McLarty
2010-05-24 13:42 ` equivalence terminology Paul Taylor
2010-05-24 15:53 ` we do meet isomorphisms of categories Marco Grandis
2010-05-26 15:21 ` Toby Bartels
2010-05-27 9:29 ` Prof. Peter Johnstone
[not found] ` <alpine.LRH.2.00.1005271007240.11352@siskin.dpmms.cam.ac.uk>
2010-05-27 10:08 ` Marco Grandis
2010-05-30 12:05 ` Joyal, André
2010-05-24 18:04 ` terminology Vaughan Pratt
2010-05-26 3:08 ` terminology Toby Bartels
2010-05-24 23:06 ` Equality again Joyal, André
2010-05-26 2:27 ` Patrik Eklund
2010-05-27 11:30 ` Prof. Peter Johnstone
2010-06-01 6:36 ` Marco Grandis
2010-06-01 14:38 ` Joyal, André [this message]
2010-05-25 14:08 ` terminology John Baez
2010-05-25 19:39 ` terminology Colin McLarty
2010-05-29 21:47 ` terminology Toby Bartels
2010-05-30 19:15 ` terminology Thorsten Altenkirch
[not found] ` <A46C7965-B4E7-42E6-AE97-6C1D930AC878@cs.nott.ac.uk>
2010-05-30 20:51 ` terminology Toby Bartels
2010-06-01 7:39 ` terminology Thorsten Altenkirch
2010-06-01 13:33 ` terminology Peter LeFanu Lumsdaine
[not found] ` <7BF50141-7775-4D3C-A4AF-D543891666B9@cs.nott.ac.uk>
2010-06-01 18:22 ` terminology Toby Bartels
2010-05-26 8:03 ` terminology Reinhard Boerger
[not found] ` <4BF6BC2C.2000606@btinternet.com>
2010-05-21 18:48 ` Re terminology: Urs Schreiber
[not found] ` <AANLkTilG69hcX7ZV8zrLpQ_nf1pCmyktsnuE0RyJtQYF@mail.gmail.com>
2010-05-26 8:28 ` terminology John Baez
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