From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: bakul at iitbombay.org (Bakul Shah) Date: Thu, 17 Dec 2020 17:25:49 -0800 Subject: [COFF] Algol68 (was Re: [TUHS] Were cron and at done at the same time? Or one before the other? In-Reply-To: References: <88E7F8CE-DC08-44AB-BF12-EFD4C5958950@iitbombay.org> <7e66e5eb-6cea-5403-a2cc-e8d93f038e66@gmail.com> <8D8E8160-F6F9-461A-BDFD-0E0A0E4C1A2B@iitbombay.org> Message-ID: <3E1EB4E6-DC67-4FD9-A9DF-41568854205D@iitbombay.org> On Dec 17, 2020, at 4:31 PM, John Cowan wrote: > > > > On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 11:35 AM Bakul Shah > wrote: > Funny how we seem to rehash the same things over the years! > > Ars longa, vita brevis. > In a 1988 comp.lang.misc thread when I expressed hope that "a major > subset of Algol 68 with a new and concise syntax (sort of like C's) > can make a very elegant, type safe and well rounded language.", > > Thanks. The URL is >. > Piet > van Oostrum[1] commented the combination of dynamic arrays *and* > unions forced the use of GC in Algol68. Either feature by themselves > wouldn't have required GC! > > I can't find this anywhere in the thread or elsewhere in comp.lang.misc. Do you have a reference? Here's the link: https://groups.google.com/g/comp.lang.misc/c/qkmB_3zuC7Y/m/erN_TfDF38IJ > In any case, I don't understand how a safe language with pointers can avoid the need for *some* kind of GC. Note that I was talking about a "type safe" subset as opposed to as stricter "safe" subset. One can argue that Pascal was type safe even with new() / dispose() for pointers. [Referencing a dead pointer is a runtime error, just like divide by zero] I think his point was more that each of dynamic arrays by themselves wouldn't require GC and the same for unions. Remember I was talking about a vague typesafe subset. So the question is which features to remove? Rmoving pointers would certainly be under consideration. > [My exposure to Algol68 was when I had stumbled upon Brailsford and > Walker's wonderful "Introductory Algol 68 programming" > > Alas, I can only find this at one shady site, or in hardback at Amazon for USD 20 which is a lot for a pig in a poke (no preview). I think it was less useful as an introduction to programming but was just right for me! There are other introductory books/articles including one by Andrew Tanenbaum: https://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.83.4668&rep=rep1&type=pdf Lindsey and van der Muellen's Informal Introduction to Algol 68: http://www.softwarepreservation.org/projects/ALGOL/book/Lindsey_van_der_Meulen-IItA68-Revised.pdf J.E.L.Peck's Algol Companion may also be of help: http://www.softwarepreservation.org/projects/ALGOL/paper/An%20Algol%2068%20Companion.pdf I have heard good things about Frank Pagan's A Practical Guide to Algol 68... -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: