From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 19935 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2023 15:58:59 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 3 Jan 2023 15:58:59 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 89ED8424F4; Wed, 4 Jan 2023 01:58:58 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-ed1-f53.google.com (mail-ed1-f53.google.com [209.85.208.53]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DD155424F3 for ; Wed, 4 Jan 2023 01:58:54 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-ed1-f53.google.com with SMTP id c17so44332355edj.13 for ; Tue, 03 Jan 2023 07:58:54 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20210112.gappssmtp.com; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=bUoO0ip2lVz07I0Rj4CiGBw3X3J++SL3Z0Z6pDuW8xA=; b=uw+Thc/07hds5LPme/elIi1mLVfpb2gBWcXXnr21Y4gZZ1jGvBdye7/aJIC8NSGdUI 4HBjCXZ72Bu+00D0VNv9u+japoQ1Cx+I7oI8bdmdfHodzJuuDGQYWX6RCYVsqixzfhTu WlcXvUWgzc7qasVXdsSalBdtITc20Z/R4Yx++eJ3Tub6MoV6lddgV5GEgsafOeXdWEX/ Uqe0dbiHRs6bU/gYFeKR/Q7QvN3eAQhTXxKG/ARq0C/jmbRIOu/ZUbi31J32RfzdUOCW ud+33PwWjLoyU8NmwoarfZxn/olkJna28PR146D8lYPpkCQl1pD2qCBB7Qh6vWFqyUvl v0uw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=bUoO0ip2lVz07I0Rj4CiGBw3X3J++SL3Z0Z6pDuW8xA=; b=agSAbXzy4feEPALEdUdiu97X5Oo7CZZrxau8PZYYoVwOlRd+mvKAAHAML/Ds2Jf+BU 38zz147tnSNNlqFEUo+geJ4k+AoH8PgevOcxnkJBVSg/2km5WqJr+u66rnzSAfjLKc6Y 0MAmrvD8yz662KYuWtsdgOnHcavWOAC6KJZvtCi2ztD+1hbFVJO4EiXOSenkoOdyLkmb SGPybnvjDMB/CzD8ahwSUQthMvPDbGI2pyiDbX6fVMGsJpTxMez/2d0WPdkpTnn4B7Ey U7VVn8dMy/OGpLkxKhzEftzgKBu/FF1XKwa43BRMYF2aF58MHSs6I9oRKu4QwMJMKe7S zHdg== X-Gm-Message-State: AFqh2kq1KX2EJGK/+eN0co0bSBPxjPGWFkK15eeFAoEXoXFPwbEeQyyG Dul3YWM4qjmowyhE1NwzPM/TRrCoPNEbbAjcn0FNUg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMrXdXvD25j+6TKaEKn/jS15Bq/O30GrVZJwg7LfkrKEfNsgRq/5OagHb5D0xWuOQKhefPucWZ3azN9rR7ufhwzZ2/w= X-Received: by 2002:aa7:d7c6:0:b0:486:9f80:8fbc with SMTP id e6-20020aa7d7c6000000b004869f808fbcmr3152015eds.421.1672761473329; Tue, 03 Jan 2023 07:57:53 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20230102203646.GT25547@mcvoy.com> <7AC50DD1-DAB2-443A-B275-E3FB08031167@gmail.com> <20230103025836.GZ25547@mcvoy.com> In-Reply-To: <20230103025836.GZ25547@mcvoy.com> From: Warner Losh Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2023 08:57:42 -0700 Message-ID: To: Larry McVoy Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000069822d05f15e2113" Message-ID-Hash: ZSIWLDVDB3OQGIKQC7KTN5ZPTQDFQNQJ X-Message-ID-Hash: ZSIWLDVDB3OQGIKQC7KTN5ZPTQDFQNQJ X-MailFrom: wlosh@bsdimp.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: COFF X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [COFF] Re: [TUHS] Interview question List-Id: Computer Old Farts Forum Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --00000000000069822d05f15e2113 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Mon, Jan 2, 2023 at 7:59 PM Larry McVoy wrote: > On Mon, Jan 02, 2023 at 02:13:45PM -0700, Adam Thornton wrote: > > Which of these, if any, do you count? > > Any of them that are entirely done by you. > With due respect, this seems like an impossible thing to have done. I think it's an arbitrary question. "No man is an Island" John Donne. Nobody on this list can claim to have anything they did entirely by themselves. Everybody used tools built by others. Everybody used an OS built by others. Even people that did a full OS + all the tools used other tools to boostrap that were done by others. They used hardware that was designed by others, made from chips made by others from raw materials mined by others. We all "stand on the shoulders of giants"[*]. While I get the connection to looking for someone that's independent, self sufficient, etc, it seems a bit arbitrary. I've done a ton of work on the FreeBSD kernel, for example, but it isn't all 100% me. Others have contributed to it, others have reviewed my work, others have given me (or the project) bug fixes. That project, as with so many others, are so much better due to the collaboration that happened between people. In many ways that's more important than doing something 100% yourself. Warner [*] "If I have seen further it is by standing on the sholders[sic] of others" -- Isaac Newton in a 1675 letter to his rival Robert Hooke --00000000000069822d05f15e2113 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


=
On Mon, Jan 2, 2023 at 7:59 PM Larry = McVoy <lm@mcvoy.com> wrote:
On Mon, Jan 02, 2023 = at 02:13:45PM -0700, Adam Thornton wrote:
> Which of these, if any, d= o you count?

Any of them that are entirely done by you.=C2=A0

<= /div>
With due respect, this seems like an impossible thing to have don= e. I think it's an arbitrary question.

"N= o man is an Island" John Donne.

Nobody on thi= s list can claim to have anything they did entirely by themselves. Everybod= y used tools built by others. Everybody used an OS built by others. Even pe= ople that did a full OS=C2=A0+ all the tools used other tools to boostrap t= hat were done by others. They used hardware that was designed by others, ma= de from chips made by others=C2=A0from raw materials mined by others.
=

We all "stand on the shoulders of giants"[*].= While I get the connection to looking for someone that's independent, = self sufficient, etc, it seems a bit arbitrary. I've done a ton of work= on the FreeBSD kernel, for example, but it isn't all 100% me. Others h= ave contributed to it, others have reviewed my work, others have given me (= or the project) bug fixes. That project, as with so many others, are so muc= h better due to the collaboration that happened between people. In many way= s that's more important than doing something 100% yourself.
<= br>
Warner

[*] "If I have seen furt= her it is by standing on the sholders[sic] of others" -- Isaac Newton = in a 1675 letter to his rival Robert Hooke


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