various nnml questions, many about cross-posted mail messages

various nnml questions, many about cross-posted mail messages

[Joe Wells]

GNU Emacs 19.31.1 (sparc-sun-solaris2.4, X toolkit) of Wed Jun  5 1996 on csb
Gnus v5.1; nntp 4.0; nnml 1.0; nnmh 1.0; nndir 1.0; nndoc 1.0

I want to switch to using the "nnml" back end to read my e-mail.
(setq gnus-secondary-select-methods '((nnml "")))

I have a number of questions about Gnus in this configuration.  These may
reflect problems which have been fixed in the most recent version of Gnus,
which I do not have now since I am using the version in the latest
standard Emacs distribution.  I am interested in knowing whether my
difficulties have been fixed.

1. An article is cross-posted to two mail groups:
   
     Xref: csb.bu.edu mail.emacs.bbdb:1 mail.to-jbw:3

   I am in the Summary buffer for mail.emacs.bbdb on the line for this
   article.  I type "B DEL".  The file ~/Mail/mail/emacs/bbdb/1 is
   unlinked.  The file ~/Mail/mail/to-jbw/3 is untouched.  In particular,
   it still has the old "Xref:" header, which is incorrect because the
   article is no longer in mail.emacs.bbdb.

   Questions:

     A: Is this fixed?
     B: Is there a command that will remove the article from all of the
        mail groups to which it is cross-posted?

2. In the Summary buffer, the "B m" command asks for a target group.  I
   type in a name.  It complains that the group doesn't exist.  (The group
   does indeed not exist yet.  I don't care.  I want the message in that
   group.)

   Question:

     * Is there a command that will just create the group instead of
       failing?

3. An article is cross-posted to two mail groups:

     Xref: csb.bu.edu mail.emacs.bbdb:2 mail.list.info-bbdb:1

   I am in the Summary buffer for mail.emacs.bbdb on the line for this
   article.  I type "B m" and specify the group "mail.misc".  The file
   ~/Mail/mail/emacs/bbdb/2 is unlinked.  The file ~/Mail/list/info-bbdb/1
   is untouched.  In particular, it still has the old "Xref:" header,
   which is incorrect because the other copy for the article is no longer
   in mail.emacs.bbdb, but is instead in mail.misc.  The new file in
   mail.misc has the following wrong "Xref:" header:

     Xref: csb.bu.edu mail.misc:48

   This is wrong because the message is cross-posted to
   "mail.list.info-bbdb".

   Questions:

     A: Is this fixed?
     B: Is there a command that will take an article which is cross-posted
        to groups A and B and make it cross-posted to A, B, and C?  The "B
        c" command does not seem to preserve cross-posting links.

4. Question: How do people keep track of whether they have edited a
   message or forwarded it?

5. An article is cross-posted to multiple mail groups:

     Xref: csb.bu.edu mail.emacs.bbdb:4 mail.emacs.mail-extr:1 mail.to-jbw:22

   I am in the Summary buffer for mail.emacs.bbdb on the line for this
   article.  I type "!" to tick the article.  I exit this summary and
   enter the Summary buffer for mail.emacs.mail-extr.  There is no tick
   mark for this article in the group mail.emacs.mail-extr.

   Question:

     * Is there a variable setting so that any mark change (adding or
       removing a mark) I apply to a message in one group is immediately
       applied to the same message in any other groups to which it is
       cross-posted?  Right now only the "R" marks seem to be propagated.

6. I am importing some mailboxes from VM.  Question: How do I arrange that
   articles to which I have replied in VM get the "A" mark?

7. Question: What is the difference between the "%g" and "%G" format
   specifications for the Group buffer?

8. Question: How do I assign group descriptions to mail groups?

9. Question: Is there a command to burst a digest or encapsulated message,
   handling the contained messages as though they had arrived via the mail
   spool?

10. Question: Is there a command to resend a message using the
    "Resent-To:", "Resent-From:", "Resent-Date:", and "Resent-Message-ID:"
    headers? 

-- 
Thanks,

Joe Wells <jbw@cs.bu.edu>

Re: various nnml questions, many about cross-posted mail messages

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

jbw@cs.bu.edu (Joe Wells) writes:

> 1. An article is cross-posted to two mail groups:
>    
>      Xref: csb.bu.edu mail.emacs.bbdb:1 mail.to-jbw:3
> 
>    I am in the Summary buffer for mail.emacs.bbdb on the line for this
>    article.  I type "B DEL".  The file ~/Mail/mail/emacs/bbdb/1 is
>    unlinked.  The file ~/Mail/mail/to-jbw/3 is untouched.  In particular,
>    it still has the old "Xref:" header, which is incorrect because the
>    article is no longer in mail.emacs.bbdb.
> 
>    Questions:
> 
>      A: Is this fixed?

No, but it isn't a bug.  :-)

>      B: Is there a command that will remove the article from all of the
>         mail groups to which it is cross-posted?

Hm.  Nope, but it's trivial to add.  I've now added it to the Red Gnus
todo list.

> 2. In the Summary buffer, the "B m" command asks for a target group.  I
>    type in a name.  It complains that the group doesn't exist.  (The group
>    does indeed not exist yet.  I don't care.  I want the message in that
>    group.)
> 
>    Question:
> 
>      * Is there a command that will just create the group instead of
>        failing?

No, the group has to exist before moving.  I could remove the
restriction; I just thought that requiring a match would lead to fewer
problems with typos and such.  Whadda y'all say?  Should Gnus just
create the group when the user moves/copies an article to the group?

> 3. An article is cross-posted to two mail groups:
> 
>      Xref: csb.bu.edu mail.emacs.bbdb:2 mail.list.info-bbdb:1
> 
>    I am in the Summary buffer for mail.emacs.bbdb on the line for this
>    article.  I type "B m" and specify the group "mail.misc".  The file
>    ~/Mail/mail/emacs/bbdb/2 is unlinked.  The file ~/Mail/list/info-bbdb/1
>    is untouched.  In particular, it still has the old "Xref:" header,
>    which is incorrect because the other copy for the article is no longer
>    in mail.emacs.bbdb, but is instead in mail.misc.

Well, it's not incorrect -- it just points to a message that no longer
exists.

>    The new file in
>    mail.misc has the following wrong "Xref:" header:
> 
>      Xref: csb.bu.edu mail.misc:48
> 
>    This is wrong because the message is cross-posted to
>    "mail.list.info-bbdb".
> 
>    Questions:
> 
>      A: Is this fixed?
>      B: Is there a command that will take an article which is cross-posted
>         to groups A and B and make it cross-posted to A, B, and C?  The "B
>         c" command does not seem to preserve cross-posting links.

Should it?  I don't know, really.  Again, changing the behavior is
easy enough, but I'm not sure it's the right thing to do...

> 4. Question: How do people keep track of whether they have edited a
>    message or forwarded it?

They have rilly good memories?

> 5. An article is cross-posted to multiple mail groups:
> 
>      Xref: csb.bu.edu mail.emacs.bbdb:4 mail.emacs.mail-extr:1 mail.to-jbw:22
> 
>    I am in the Summary buffer for mail.emacs.bbdb on the line for this
>    article.  I type "!" to tick the article.  I exit this summary and
>    enter the Summary buffer for mail.emacs.mail-extr.  There is no tick
>    mark for this article in the group mail.emacs.mail-extr.
> 
>    Question:
> 
>      * Is there a variable setting so that any mark change (adding or
>        removing a mark) I apply to a message in one group is immediately
>        applied to the same message in any other groups to which it is
>        cross-posted?  Right now only the "R" marks seem to be propagated.

This is a feature.  Propagating marks between groups seems rather
absurd to me.  I can't see what good that would do.  

The only thing the Xref utility is there for is to avoid having to
read any article more than once, and that's all.

> 6. I am importing some mailboxes from VM.  Question: How do I arrange that
>    articles to which I have replied in VM get the "A" mark?

This isn't supported, but may be supported in Red Gnus.

> 7. Question: What is the difference between the "%g" and "%G" format
>    specifications for the Group buffer?

%g is the name the group has in Gnus, %G is the name as the backend
knows it.  (Ie. "nnml:mail.ding" v. "mail.ding".)

> 8. Question: How do I assign group descriptions to mail groups?

Edit the "newsgroups" file for the backend.

> 9. Question: Is there a command to burst a digest or encapsulated message,
>    handling the contained messages as though they had arrived via the mail
>    spool?

`C-d' `M P b' `B r' `q'.  :-)  Assign that to a macro and you're all
set. 

> 10. Question: Is there a command to resend a message using the
>     "Resent-To:", "Resent-From:", "Resent-Date:", and "Resent-Message-ID:"
>     headers? 

`S D r'.

-- 
  "Yes.  The journey through the human heart 
     would have to wait until some other time."

Re: various nnml questions, many about cross-posted mail messages

[Darren/Torin/Who Ever...]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen, in an immanent manifestation of deity, wrote:
>No, the group has to exist before moving.  I could remove the
>restriction; I just thought that requiring a match would lead to fewer
>problems with typos and such.  Whadda y'all say?  Should Gnus just
>create the group when the user moves/copies an article to the group?

How about just asking?  MH will usually say "create folder
/home/torin/.mail/gurb?"

Darren
- -- 
<torin@daft.com> <http://www.daft.com/~torin/>    <tnd@iswp.org> <torin@io.com>
Darren Stalder/2608 Second Ave, @282/Seattle, WA 98121-1212/USA/+1-800-921-4996
@ Do you have your clothes on? I probably don't. Take yours off. Feel better. @
@ Sysadmin, webweaver, postmaster for hire.  C/Perl/CGI programmer and tutor. @

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: 2.6.2
Comment: Processed by Mailcrypt 3.4, an Emacs/PGP interface

iQCVAwUBMbqi4Y4wrq++1Ls5AQHJogP+MOh9efQPmAYL8bM2JWJyXnmkW28pOani
sdxIZK8xcwKl+sjKsecai4Wg9L9AE91xGauIf0sL08JX58ojxDSAvAo5eZzpIiAT
1mOJqnMMAPuH1j6YCT6M3KEF18DFclEgndeHTOs9zY2q/WEDOkCW9zDeyQMTxa2i
PoQhZPH59dU=
=1mVL
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Re: various nnml questions, many about cross-posted mail messages

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

"Darren/Torin/Who Ever..." <torin@daft.com> writes:

> How about just asking?  MH will usually say "create folder
> /home/torin/.mail/gurb?"

Well, that's an idea.  I just don't like programs asking.  I like them
doing.

-- 
  "Yes.  The journey through the human heart 
     would have to wait until some other time."

Re: various nnml questions, many about cross-posted mail messages

[Hallvard B Furuseth]

Darren/Torin/Who Ever... <torin@daft.com> wrote:
>Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen, in an immanent manifestation of deity, wrote:
>>Should Gnus just
>>create the group when the user moves/copies an article to the group?
> 
>How about just asking?  MH will usually say "create folder
>/home/torin/.mail/gurb?"

Yes!


Regards,

Hallvard

Re: various nnml questions, many about cross-posted mail messages

[Mark Eichin]

> Well, that's an idea.  I just don't like programs asking.  I like them
> doing.

In the normal case, it will just "do"; the only change is in the case
where now, it beeps at me because the completion doesn't work (which
doesn't count as "doing" :-) I'd like to see this too, it would make
it a lot easier to toss together new folders in response to a
thread... 

Re: various nnml questions, many about cross-posted mail messages

[Joe Wells]

In article <x64tolr58d.fsf@eyesore.no> Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@ifi.uio.no> writes:

   jbw@cs.bu.edu (Joe Wells) writes:

   > 1. An article is cross-posted to two mail groups:
   >    
   >      Xref: csb.bu.edu mail.emacs.bbdb:1 mail.to-jbw:3
   > 
   >    I am in the Summary buffer for mail.emacs.bbdb on the line for this
   >    article.  I type "B DEL".  The file ~/Mail/mail/emacs/bbdb/1 is
   >    unlinked.  The file ~/Mail/mail/to-jbw/3 is untouched.  In particular,
   >    it still has the old "Xref:" header, which is incorrect because the
   >    article is no longer in mail.emacs.bbdb.
   > 
   >    Questions:
   > 
   >      A: Is this fixed?

   No, but it isn't a bug.  :-)

Hmm.  All it leaves is a dangling pointer, which is okay since newsreaders
have to be prepared to handle this.  So I agree here.

However, I think it would be better if Gnus fixed the Xref header in the
other copies of the message.

   >      B: Is there a command that will remove the article from all of the
   >         mail groups to which it is cross-posted?

   Hm.  Nope, but it's trivial to add.  I've now added it to the Red Gnus
   todo list.

   > 3. An article is cross-posted to two mail groups:
   > 
   >      Xref: csb.bu.edu mail.emacs.bbdb:2 mail.list.info-bbdb:1
   > 
   >    I am in the Summary buffer for mail.emacs.bbdb on the line for this
   >    article.  I type "B m" and specify the group "mail.misc".  The file
   >    ~/Mail/mail/emacs/bbdb/2 is unlinked.  The file ~/Mail/list/info-bbdb/1
   >    is untouched.  In particular, it still has the old "Xref:" header,
   >    which is incorrect because the other copy for the article is no longer
   >    in mail.emacs.bbdb, but is instead in mail.misc.

   Well, it's not incorrect -- it just points to a message that no longer
   exists.

In this case, I disagree with you.  What does it mean when a user types "B
m" in a mail group?  It means they wish to change the result of their
nnmail-split-methods method.  Thus, if a message was put in mail groups A,
B, and C by nnmail-split-methods and the user types "B m D RET" in group
B, then the result should be as though nnmail-split methods put the
message in groups A, D, and C instead.

I also believe that a newsreader, to the greatest extent practically
possible, should treat a message cross posted to several groups as a
single entity.  When I receive a message that gets put in groups A, B, and
C, I do not want it to make a difference in which group I deal with the
message first.  If, while in group B, I read the message, tick it, and
reply to it, I expect it to be annotated with "!A".  If a week later I am
viewing the same message in group C, I want to see the same annotation
there too.

In order for a newsreader to meet the goals I mentioned in the previous
paragraph, it is necessary for that newsreader to do as much as it can to
preserve the semantic integrity of the Xref links.

   >    The new file in
   >    mail.misc has the following wrong "Xref:" header:
   > 
   >      Xref: csb.bu.edu mail.misc:48
   > 
   >    This is wrong because the message is cross-posted to
   >    "mail.list.info-bbdb".
   > 
   >    Questions:
   > 
   >      A: Is this fixed?
   >      B: Is there a command that will take an article which is cross-posted
   >         to groups A and B and make it cross-posted to A, B, and C?  The "B
   >         c" command does not seem to preserve cross-posting links.

   Should it?  I don't know, really.  Again, changing the behavior is
   easy enough, but I'm not sure it's the right thing to do...

See above.

   > 5. An article is cross-posted to multiple mail groups:
   > 
   >      Xref: csb.bu.edu mail.emacs.bbdb:4 mail.emacs.mail-extr:1 mail.to-jbw:22
   > 
   >    I am in the Summary buffer for mail.emacs.bbdb on the line for this
   >    article.  I type "!" to tick the article.  I exit this summary and
   >    enter the Summary buffer for mail.emacs.mail-extr.  There is no tick
   >    mark for this article in the group mail.emacs.mail-extr.
   > 
   >    Question:
   > 
   >      * Is there a variable setting so that any mark change (adding or
   >        removing a mark) I apply to a message in one group is immediately
   >        applied to the same message in any other groups to which it is
   >        cross-posted?  Right now only the "R" marks seem to be propagated.

   This is a feature.  Propagating marks between groups seems rather
   absurd to me.  I can't see what good that would do.  

See above.

   The only thing the Xref utility is there for is to avoid having to
   read any article more than once, and that's all.

First, I disagree about the usefulness of Xref.  Second, the lack of mark
propagation in Gnus prevents achieving the goal of not reading articles
more than once.  Suppose, while in group A, I read an article which was
cross posted to group B and then I tick the article.  Then I go to group
B.  I will see the same article and it will be unmarked (not marked as
read).  Unless I am very careful, I will end up reading it again.

   > 2. In the Summary buffer, the "B m" command asks for a target group.  I
   >    type in a name.  It complains that the group doesn't exist.  (The group
   >    does indeed not exist yet.  I don't care.  I want the message in that
   >    group.)
   > 
   >    Question:
   > 
   >      * Is there a command that will just create the group instead of
   >        failing?

   No, the group has to exist before moving.  I could remove the
   restriction; I just thought that requiring a match would lead to fewer
   problems with typos and such.  Whadda y'all say?  Should Gnus just
   create the group when the user moves/copies an article to the group?

For me, typos are not a problem because I usually use completion to verify
that what I am typing is correct.  Even when I type all of the letters of
a string by hand, I still use TAB or ? to check that it is right.  So if I
type "mail.foo.bar", I really mean "mail.foo.bar".  For me, it can not
possibly be a typo.  Other people might not share this style.

   > 4. Question: How do people keep track of whether they have edited a
   >    message or forwarded it?

   They have rilly good memories?

I asked this question because this is one of the features of VM which I
like quite a bit.

-- 
Joe Wells <jbw@cs.bu.edu>

Re: various nnml questions, many about cross-posted mail messages

[Per Abrahamsen]

>>>>> "JW" == Joe Wells <jbw@cs.bu.edu> writes:

JW> 1. An article is cross-posted to two mail groups:
   
JW>    [ a) Gnus doesn't update xref in other copies when one is deleted. ]

JW> 3. An article is cross-posted to two mail groups:

JW>    [ b) Gnus doesn't update other copies when one is moved.  
JW>      This breaks the crossposting.  c) There is no way to add to a
JW>      crosspost list. ]

The first isn't really a problem since news works this way.  However,
I use crossposting of mail extensively, it was the deciding feature
which made me switch to Gnus.  I often move mail around after they
have been split, and the fact that it breaks crossposting is a big
problem, i.e. it wastes lost of disk space.  So I really would like to
see `B m' and `B c' be crosspost aware.  I.e. `B m' should not break
the crosspost list, and `B c' should just add a new entry to the xref
list (and use a hard link).

JW> 2. In the Summary buffer, the "B m" command asks for a target group.  I
JW>    type in a name.  It complains that the group doesn't exist.  (The group
JW>    does indeed not exist yet.  I don't care.  I want the message in that
JW>    group.)

I'd like a prompt here:  Group does not exist, create it (yes/no)?

It is a good candidate for a prompt, since it is relatively rare.

JW> 4. Question: How do people keep track of whether they have edited a
JW>    message or forwarded it?

JW> 5. An article is cross-posted to multiple mail groups:

JW>   [ Propagate secondary marks to crossposted groups ]

JW> 6. I am importing some mailboxes from VM.  Question: How do I arrange that
JW>    articles to which I have replied in VM get the "A" mark?

I think all three can be solved, once the Gnus backend protocol learns
how to store marks in the server.   This is needed for proper IMAP
support, but it should also allow gnus to maintain the `Status:',
`X-VM-v5-Attribute:' headers, and the BABYL labels.  This should allow
you to do the above.

Re: various nnml questions, many about cross-posted mail messages

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Per Abrahamsen <abraham@dina.kvl.dk> writes:

> So I really would like to see `B m' and `B c' be crosspost aware.

I've now added this to the Red Gnus todo list.

> JW> 2. In the Summary buffer, the "B m" command asks for a target group.  I
> JW>    type in a name.  It complains that the group doesn't exist.  (The group
> JW>    does indeed not exist yet.  I don't care.  I want the message in that
> JW>    group.)
> 
> I'd like a prompt here:  Group does not exist, create it (yes/no)?

I've added this to Gnus 5.2.15.

-- 
  "Yes.  The journey through the human heart 
     would have to wait until some other time."

Re: various nnml questions, many about cross-posted mail messages

[Sten Drescher]

>>>>> Mark Eichin writes:

>> Well, that's an idea.  I just don't like programs asking.  I like
>> them doing.

ME> In the normal case, it will just "do"; the only change is in the
ME> case where now, it beeps at me because the completion doesn't work
ME> (which doesn't count as "doing" :-) I'd like to see this too, it
ME> would make it a lot easier to toss together new folders in
ME> response to a thread...

	I vote for asking, or not doing at all, rather than doing
without asking.  Otherwise, I'm going to end up with lsit.dnig,
mail.msic, mail.mics, mial.grendel...

-- 
+----------------------  Tivoli Customer Support  ----------------------+
|   Sten Drescher                     Tivoli Systems, Inc               |
|   email: sten.drescher@tivoli.com   9442 Capital of Texas Hwy North   |
|   phone: (512) 794-9070             Arboretum Plaza One, Suite 500    |
|   fax  : (512) 345-2784             Austin, Texas 78759               |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+

setting marks for imported mailboxes, adding new mark types

[Joe Wells]

What is the timetable for adding support for storing marks in the server
backends and allowing new mark types?  Per Abrahamsen said this was part
of future IMAP support.  Is work on this already being done?  Is there an
interface specified for this?  What is IMAP?

If I knew how this was going to happen, I could work on code to set the
"answered" mark correctly for messages which are imported from VM
mailboxes and also to support VM's "edited" and "forwarded" marks.

I don't want to switch from VM for reading mail until Gnus can
automatically generate correct "answered" marks for my VM mailboxes.

-- 
Joe Wells <jbw@cs.bu.edu>

Re: setting marks for imported mailboxes, adding new mark types

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

jbw@cs.bu.edu (Joe Wells) writes:

> What is the timetable for adding support for storing marks in the server
> backends and allowing new mark types?  

Timetable?  What's that, then?

It's on the Red Gnus todo list.

> Per Abrahamsen said this was part of future IMAP support.

Well, not really, but sort of.

> Is work on this already being done? 

No.

> Is there an interface specified for this?

And no.  

-- 
  "Yes.  The journey through the human heart 
     would have to wait until some other time."

Re: setting marks for imported mailboxes, adding new mark types

[Joe Wells]

Enclosed below is a piece of code that sets the "answered" marks correctly
for mail imported from VM 5.32 mailboxes.

Instructions for use:

  0. Only tried with these versions: VM 5.32; Gnus v5.1; nnml
     1.0.  I have no idea if it will work with any others.

  1. Set up mail reading with some Gnus backend.  If you are not using
     nnml, you must hack the code by replacing (nnml "") with the
     appropriate method specification.

  2. Snarf the VM mailbox.  I did this by setting nnmail-spool-file to
     point to a copy of the mailbox and then starting Gnus.

  3. Invoke the command "M-x gnus-notice-vm-replied-marks".  Do this
     before answering any of the imported messages.  Your computer will
     explode if any of the messages are already marked as being answered
     in Gnus.

  4. Check if it worked.  If it didn't, fix the code and share the fixed
     version.

-- 
Enjoy,

Joe Wells <jbw@cs.bu.edu>

----------------------------------------------------------------------
;; Created by: Joe Wells, jbw@csb.bu.edu
;; Created on: Thu Jun 13 21:38:36 1996
;; Last modified by: Joe Wells, jbw@csb.bu.edu
;; Last modified on: Thu Jun 13 21:39:38 1996
;; Filename: fixup-mail-reply-marks.el
;; Purpose: import VM replied marks into Gnus

;; Hacked together from various pieces of Gnus.

(defun gnus-notice-vm-replied-marks ()
  (interactive)
  (save-excursion
    (set-buffer nntp-server-buffer)
    
    (let ((newsrc (cdr gnus-newsrc-alist))
          (method '(nnml ""))
          groups)

      ;; Get list of mail groups.
      (while newsrc
        (and (gnus-server-equal 
              (gnus-find-method-for-group 
               (car (car newsrc)) (car newsrc))
              method)
             (setq groups (cons (car (car newsrc)) groups)))
        (setq newsrc (cdr newsrc)))
      
      (while groups
        (let ((group (car groups))
              articles article replied headers)
          (setq groups (cdr groups))

          ;; Find articles in group.
          ;; Raw range possibly including expired articles.
          (setq articles
                (gnus-uncompress-sequence
                 (gnus-gethash group gnus-active-hashtb)))
          ;; Get headers for actual existing articles.
          (or (eq 'nov (gnus-retrieve-headers articles group))
              (error "oops .. not implemented"))
          ;; Bullshit so next step does not go awry.
          (setq gnus-newsgroup-dependencies 
                (gnus-make-hashtable (length articles)))
          ;; Parse the *nntpd* buffer to get article numbers.
          (setq headers (gnus-get-newsgroup-headers-xover articles))
          (setq articles
                (mapcar
                 (function (lambda (header) (mail-header-number header)))
                 headers))
          
          ;; Find sequence of answered messages in group.
          (while articles
            (let ((article (car articles)))
              (setq articles (cdr articles))

              ;; Load article's data.
              (gnus-request-article article group) ; buffer
              
              ;; Determine if article had been replied to in VM.
              ;; X-VM-v5-Data: ([nil nil nil nil t nil nil nil nil] ...
              (goto-char (point-min))
              (narrow-to-region (point-min)
                                (progn (search-forward "\n\n") (point)))
              (let* ((vm-data (read (mail-fetch-field "X-VM-v5-Data")))
                     (vm-flags (if (consp vm-data) (car vm-data)))
                     (replied-flag (if (vectorp vm-flags) (aref vm-flags 4))))
                (if replied-flag
                    (setq replied (cons article replied))))))
        
          ;; Mark sequence as answered.
          ;; The 'reply marks are kept uncompressed (Why!?!?). 
          (setq replied (nreverse replied))
          (gnus-add-marked-articles group 'reply replied))))))

Re: various nnml questions, many about cross-posted mail messages

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

jbw@cs.bu.edu (Joe Wells) writes:

> I also believe that a newsreader, to the greatest extent practically
> possible, should treat a message cross posted to several groups as a
> single entity.  When I receive a message that gets put in groups A, B, and
> C, I do not want it to make a difference in which group I deal with the
> message first.  If, while in group B, I read the message, tick it, and
> reply to it, I expect it to be annotated with "!A".  If a week later I am
> viewing the same message in group C, I want to see the same annotation
> there too.

I don't agree.  I feel that the Xref header should be used for one
thing and one thing only -- it should ensure that a reader never has
to read a crossposted article more than once.  That's all.

> First, I disagree about the usefulness of Xref.  Second, the lack of mark
> propagation in Gnus prevents achieving the goal of not reading articles
> more than once.  Suppose, while in group A, I read an article which was
> cross posted to group B and then I tick the article.  Then I go to group
> B.  I will see the same article and it will be unmarked (not marked as
> read).  Unless I am very careful, I will end up reading it again.

No, if you tick the article in group A it will be marked as read in
group B.  So you'll never see it in group B.

>    > 4. Question: How do people keep track of whether they have edited a
>    >    message or forwarded it?
> 
>    They have rilly good memories?
> 
> I asked this question because this is one of the features of VM which I
> like quite a bit.

Well, I could add new secondary marks for forwarding and editing, but
is it really something we need?  Well, perhaps it would be nice.  I've
added it to the Red Gnus todo list.  (Along with World Peace,
Happiness For Everybody, and Free Word For XEmacs.  :-)

(We need more smileys.  We should really have O:-) and :-=, for
instance.  Anybody feel up to going through that mam(m)ooth list of
smileys and drawing them all?  :-)  Shouldn't be much work.  :-O.)

-- 
  "Yes.  The journey through the human heart 
     would have to wait until some other time."