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* Should nnatom default to offline when unplugged?
@ 2024-07-13  4:55 James Thomas
  2024-07-15 20:21 ` Daniel Semyonov
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: James Thomas @ 2024-07-13  4:55 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: ding; +Cc: Daniel Semyonov

Hi all,

Right now I use something like this for 'nnatom-read-feed-function':

(defun my/nnatom-read-feed-function (url &rest args)
  (if gnus-plugged (nnatom--read-feed url nil)
      '(title nil nil subtitle nil nil)))

...for when I start with 'gnus-unplugged' for offline reading. I was
wondering if something like this could/should be made the default -
anyone wanting the existing behavior (why?) could let-bind gnus-plugged
in a similar function. But it could have interactions if agentization is
ever needed...

Regards,
James


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread

* Re: Should nnatom default to offline when unplugged?
  2024-07-13  4:55 Should nnatom default to offline when unplugged? James Thomas
@ 2024-07-15 20:21 ` Daniel Semyonov
  2024-07-15 21:19   ` James Thomas
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Daniel Semyonov @ 2024-07-15 20:21 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: James Thomas; +Cc: ding

>>>>> James Thomas writes:

    > Hi all,
    > Right now I use something like this for 'nnatom-read-feed-function':

    > (defun my/nnatom-read-feed-function (url &rest args)
    >   (if gnus-plugged (nnatom--read-feed url nil)
    >       '(title nil nil subtitle nil nil)))

    > ...for when I start with 'gnus-unplugged' for offline reading. I was
    > wondering if something like this could/should be made the default -
    > anyone wanting the existing behavior (why?) could let-bind gnus-plugged
    > in a similar function. But it could have interactions if agentization is
    > ever needed...

I honestly never use Gnus unplugged so I may be misunderstanding
something, but AFAICT only agentized servers are supposed to
be affected by it (according to my brief usage and the manual).

I think I'd find this behavior surprising (and difficult to change) if I
encountered it as a new user, while the inconvenience of marking every
nnatom server as agentized seems pretty minor.

Daniel


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread

* Re: Should nnatom default to offline when unplugged?
  2024-07-15 20:21 ` Daniel Semyonov
@ 2024-07-15 21:19   ` James Thomas
  2024-07-16 11:28     ` James Thomas
  2024-07-16 12:23     ` Daniel Semyonov
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: James Thomas @ 2024-07-15 21:19 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Daniel Semyonov; +Cc: ding

Daniel Semyonov wrote:

>>>>>> James Thomas writes:
>
>     > Hi all,
>     > Right now I use something like this for 'nnatom-read-feed-function':
>
>     > (defun my/nnatom-read-feed-function (url &rest args)
>     >   (if gnus-plugged (nnatom--read-feed url nil)
>     >       '(title nil nil subtitle nil nil)))
>
>     > ...for when I start with 'gnus-unplugged' for offline reading. I was
>     > wondering if something like this could/should be made the default -
>     > anyone wanting the existing behavior (why?) could let-bind gnus-plugged
>     > in a similar function. But it could have interactions if agentization is
>     > ever needed...
>
> I honestly never use Gnus unplugged so I may be misunderstanding
> something, but AFAICT only agentized servers are supposed to
> be affected by it (according to my brief usage and the manual).

Well, one other place I know where the plugged status is used is in
queueing sent messages for later mass dispatch.

> I think I'd find this behavior surprising (and difficult to change) if I
> encountered it as a new user, while the inconvenience of marking every
> nnatom server as agentized seems pretty minor.

Yes, but IIUC that would make the agent store a twin copy of the
headers, and every article; the latter unless maybe one fiddles with
gnus-agent-eagerly-store-articles - but right now I can't set that per
server.

Anyway it was just a thought. I'm perfectly fine with my current setup.

Regards,
James


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread

* Re: Should nnatom default to offline when unplugged?
  2024-07-15 21:19   ` James Thomas
@ 2024-07-16 11:28     ` James Thomas
  2024-07-16 12:23     ` Daniel Semyonov
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: James Thomas @ 2024-07-16 11:28 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Daniel Semyonov; +Cc: ding

James Thomas wrote:

> Daniel Semyonov wrote:
>
>>>>>>> James Thomas writes:
>>
>>     > Hi all,
>>     > Right now I use something like this for 'nnatom-read-feed-function':
>>
>>     > (defun my/nnatom-read-feed-function (url &rest args)
>>     >   (if gnus-plugged (nnatom--read-feed url nil)
>>     >       '(title nil nil subtitle nil nil)))
>>
>>     > ...for when I start with 'gnus-unplugged' for offline reading. I was
>>     > wondering if something like this could/should be made the default -
>>     > anyone wanting the existing behavior (why?) could let-bind gnus-plugged
>>     > in a similar function. But it could have interactions if agentization is
>>     > ever needed...
>>
>> I honestly never use Gnus unplugged so I may be misunderstanding
>> something, but AFAICT only agentized servers are supposed to
>> be affected by it (according to my brief usage and the manual).
>
> Well, one other place I know where the plugged status is used is in
> queueing sent messages for later mass dispatch.

Well, one more: maybe this should have an option such as the ':plugged'
in (info "(gnus) Mail Source Specifiers").

Regards,
James


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread

* Re: Should nnatom default to offline when unplugged?
  2024-07-15 21:19   ` James Thomas
  2024-07-16 11:28     ` James Thomas
@ 2024-07-16 12:23     ` Daniel Semyonov
  2024-07-16 20:46       ` James Thomas
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Daniel Semyonov @ 2024-07-16 12:23 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: James Thomas; +Cc: ding

>>>>> James Thomas writes:

    > Daniel Semyonov wrote:
    >>>>>>> James Thomas writes:
    >> 
    >> > Hi all,
    >> > Right now I use something like this for
    >> > 'nnatom-read-feed-function':
    >> 
    >> > (defun my/nnatom-read-feed-function (url &rest args)
    >> >   (if gnus-plugged (nnatom--read-feed url nil)
    >> >       '(title nil nil subtitle nil nil)))
    >> 
    >> > ...for when I start with 'gnus-unplugged' for offline
    >> > reading. I was
    >> > wondering if something like this could/should be made the
    >> > default -
    >> > anyone wanting the existing behavior (why?) could let-bind
    >> > gnus-plugged
    >> > in a similar function. But it could have interactions if
    >> > agentization is
    >> > ever needed...
    >> 
    >> I honestly never use Gnus unplugged so I may be misunderstanding
    >> something, but AFAICT only agentized servers are supposed to
    >> be affected by it (according to my brief usage and the manual).

    > Well, one other place I know where the plugged status is used is in
    > queueing sent messages for later mass dispatch.

Yeah you're right, I actually found that out when I replied to you as I
was testing Gnus unplugged :)
Do you know if any other backends default to being offline when
unplugged regardless of the server being agentized?

    >> I think I'd find this behavior surprising (and difficult to change)
    >> if I
    >> encountered it as a new user, while the inconvenience of marking
    >> every
    >> nnatom server as agentized seems pretty minor.

    > Yes, but IIUC that would make the agent store a twin copy of the
    > headers, and every article; the latter unless maybe one fiddles with
    > gnus-agent-eagerly-store-articles - but right now I can't set that per
    > server.

I think a better way to solve this particular issue would be to teach
Gnus to get this information from the backend (for backends which store
their data locally).
I wonder if the same happens with nnrss, for example.

    > Anyway it was just a thought. I'm perfectly fine with my current
    > setup.

While I have your attention, can you tell me if you encountered any bugs
while using nnatom with the agent?
I'm trying to fix any issues I can find with it before Emacs 30 is
released, but as I don't use Gnus unplugged I only did some basic
testing with it.

Daniel


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread

* Re: Should nnatom default to offline when unplugged?
  2024-07-16 12:23     ` Daniel Semyonov
@ 2024-07-16 20:46       ` James Thomas
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: James Thomas @ 2024-07-16 20:46 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Daniel Semyonov; +Cc: ding

Daniel Semyonov wrote:

>>>>>> James Thomas writes:
>
>     > Daniel Semyonov wrote:
>     >>>>>>> James Thomas writes:
>     >>
>     >> > Hi all,
>     >> > Right now I use something like this for
>     >> > 'nnatom-read-feed-function':
>     >>
>     >> > (defun my/nnatom-read-feed-function (url &rest args)
>     >> >   (if gnus-plugged (nnatom--read-feed url nil)
>     >> >       '(title nil nil subtitle nil nil)))
>     >>
>     >> > ...for when I start with 'gnus-unplugged' for offline
>     >> > reading. I was
>     >> > wondering if something like this could/should be made the
>     >> > default -
>     >> > anyone wanting the existing behavior (why?) could let-bind
>     >> > gnus-plugged
>     >> > in a similar function. But it could have interactions if
>     >> > agentization is
>     >> > ever needed...
>     >>
>     >> I honestly never use Gnus unplugged so I may be misunderstanding
>     >> something, but AFAICT only agentized servers are supposed to
>     >> be affected by it (according to my brief usage and the manual).
>
>     > Well, one other place I know where the plugged status is used is in
>     > queueing sent messages for later mass dispatch.
>
> Yeah you're right, I actually found that out when I replied to you as I
> was testing Gnus unplugged :)
> Do you know if any other backends default to being offline when
> unplugged regardless of the server being agentized?

Yes, now. Perhaps you got my follow-up mail, with this info:

  ... the ':plugged' in (info "(gnus) Mail Source Specifiers").

>     >> I think I'd find this behavior surprising (and difficult to change)
>     >> if I
>     >> encountered it as a new user, while the inconvenience of marking
>     >> every
>     >> nnatom server as agentized seems pretty minor.
>
>     > Yes, but IIUC that would make the agent store a twin copy of the
>     > headers, and every article; the latter unless maybe one fiddles with
>     > gnus-agent-eagerly-store-articles - but right now I can't set that per
>     > server.
>
> I think a better way to solve this particular issue would be to teach
> Gnus to get this information from the backend (for backends which store
> their data locally).

Yes (cf. the one case above). Though (info "(gnus) Browsing the Web")
recommends the agent.

> I wonder if the same happens with nnrss, for example.

It doesn't; OOTB anyway.

>     > Anyway it was just a thought. I'm perfectly fine with my current
>     > setup.
>
> While I have your attention, can you tell me if you encountered any bugs
> while using nnatom with the agent?
> I'm trying to fix any issues I can find with it before Emacs 30 is
> released, but as I don't use Gnus unplugged I only did some basic
> testing with it.

With my custom setup? Not really, no. But btw I did find a wanton 'cons'
in nnfeed.el#L317 while I was trying to figure that out:

  (while-let ((cg (or (and name (cons data)) ; `data' is a single group

Regards,
James


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2024-07-29 16:00 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 6+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2024-07-13  4:55 Should nnatom default to offline when unplugged? James Thomas
2024-07-15 20:21 ` Daniel Semyonov
2024-07-15 21:19   ` James Thomas
2024-07-16 11:28     ` James Thomas
2024-07-16 12:23     ` Daniel Semyonov
2024-07-16 20:46       ` James Thomas

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