admin-adress purpose ?

admin-adress purpose ?

[Xavier MAILLARD]

Hi,

I don't know if it's the right place to ask for this but I am
questionning myself on what the gnus-parameter admin-adress is usefull.

Does anybody know it ? How can it be use ? ,etc...

Cheers,

--zeDek

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Kai Großjohann]

Xavier MAILLARD <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:

> I don't know if it's the right place to ask for this but I am
> questionning myself on what the gnus-parameter admin-adress is usefull.

For the foo@frob.org mailing list, you can put the
foo-request@frob.org address there.  It's a convenient place to stuff
this information in case you need it later (to unsubscribe from the
list).

kai
-- 
~/.signature is: umop ap!sdn    (Frank Nobis)

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Xavier MAILLARD]

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) disait récemment que :

> Xavier MAILLARD <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:
>
>> I don't know if it's the right place to ask for this but I am
>> questionning myself on what the gnus-parameter admin-adress is usefull.
>
> For the foo@frob.org mailing list, you can put the
> foo-request@frob.org address there.  It's a convenient place to stuff
> this information in case you need it later (to unsubscribe from the
> list).
>

I know it can be usefull for later use but is there any keybinding or
any functions to take advantage of this ??

--zeDek

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Kai Großjohann]

Xavier MAILLARD <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:

> I know it can be usefull for later use but is there any keybinding or
> any functions to take advantage of this ??

I don't think so.

kai
-- 
~/.signature is: umop ap!sdn    (Frank Nobis)

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Xavier MAILLARD]

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) disait récemment que :

> Xavier MAILLARD <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:
>
>> I know it can be usefull for later use but is there any keybinding or
>> any functions to take advantage of this ??
>
> I don't think so.

Grmbl. Why not add unsub-adress and/or help-adress in the
gnus-parameters and then bind this on different keys such as 'u' and
'h'.

Doing this will allow users to type 'u' in the group buffer and this
would set the 'To' field to the unsub-adress etc...

What do you think of this ?

If it seems interesting for someone, I would add it and post my patch in
here (or directly append it into the CVS).

Cheers,

zeDek

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Kai Großjohann]

Xavier MAILLARD <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:

> If it seems interesting for someone, I would add it and post my patch in
> here (or directly append it into the CVS).

Okay.  Maybe you could integrate this in some fashion with the
mailing list mode (which looks at email headers for these addresses).

kai
-- 
~/.signature is: umop ap!sdn    (Frank Nobis)

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Xavier MAILLARD]

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) disait récemment que :

> [...]
> Okay.  Maybe you could integrate this in some fashion with the
> mailing list mode (which looks at email headers for these addresses).

What do you mean by 'in some fashion' ?? Why not add a gnus-parameters
in gnus.el ? I mean we could add something like this :

,----
| 
| (gnus-define-group-parameter
|  unsubscribe-adress
|  :function-document
|  "Return GROUP's unsubscribe-adress."
|  :variable-document
|  "Adress to send unsubscribe order."
|  :parameter-type '(gnus-email-address :tag "Unsubscribe")
|  :parameter-document "\
| 
| This address will be used when doing a `u' in the group.
| It will then send an unsubscirbe message to this adress.
`----

Why do you want to check the right 'list-' header ? We can just add it
when customizing the group, can't we ?

The gnus-ml module contains interesting features but IMHO nobody (or almost)is
using them.


Cheers,

zeDek

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Kai Großjohann]

Xavier MAILLARD <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:

> Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) disait récemment que :
>
>> [...]
>> Okay.  Maybe you could integrate this in some fashion with the
>> mailing list mode (which looks at email headers for these addresses).
>
> What do you mean by 'in some fashion' ??

I mean that it should take advantage of the headers as before, if
headers are present.  Maybe some gnus-ml commands could look at both
headers and group parameters.

> Why not add a gnus-parameters in gnus.el ? I mean we could add
> something like this :
>
> ,----
> | 
> | (gnus-define-group-parameter
> |  unsubscribe-adress
> |  :function-document
> |  "Return GROUP's unsubscribe-adress."
> |  :variable-document
> |  "Adress to send unsubscribe order."
> |  :parameter-type '(gnus-email-address :tag "Unsubscribe")
> |  :parameter-document "\
> | 
> | This address will be used when doing a `u' in the group.
> | It will then send an unsubscirbe message to this adress.
> `----

This is a good idea.

> Why do you want to check the right 'list-' header ? We can just add it
> when customizing the group, can't we ?
>
> The gnus-ml module contains interesting features but IMHO nobody (or almost)is
> using them.

How do you know it's not being used?  Did you make a poll?

If the headers are present, the users don't need to frob group
parameters manually.  So the old gnus-ml functionality should
continue to exist.

Maybe _you_ don't use it, but how about others?

kai
-- 
~/.signature is: umop ap!sdn    (Frank Nobis)

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Xavier MAILLARD]

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) disait récemment que :

> [...]
> I mean that it should take advantage of the headers as before, if
> headers are present.  Maybe some gnus-ml commands could look at both
> headers and group parameters.

That is a good idea but I think it's a pain in the a** to have redundant
things. It's my opinion even if I know that not everybody is customizing
its group. 

> [...]
> This is a good idea.

This is how I imagine the things should be implemented.

>> Why do you want to check the right 'list-' header ? We can just add it
>> when customizing the group, can't we ?
>>
>> The gnus-ml module contains interesting features but IMHO nobody (or almost)is
>> using them.
>
> How do you know it's not being used?  Did you make a poll?

My own opinion :) It's almost sure that this is wrong but ... ;)

> If the headers are present, the users don't need to frob group
> parameters manually.  So the old gnus-ml functionality should
> continue to exist.

Why not. It's not my problem as I will only try to get gnus-parameter
play nice with unsub & co :)

> Maybe _you_ don't use it, but how about others?

Agree. Sorry if I offenced someone ;)

Cheers,

zeDek

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Kai Großjohann]

Xavier MAILLARD <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:

> Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) disait récemment que :
>
>> [...]
>> I mean that it should take advantage of the headers as before, if
>> headers are present.  Maybe some gnus-ml commands could look at both
>> headers and group parameters.
>
> That is a good idea but I think it's a pain in the a** to have redundant
> things. It's my opinion even if I know that not everybody is customizing
> its group. 

The difference is that the headers are done by the list management
software.  So all recipients automatically get the headers and they
don't have to configure anything.

With gnus-parameters, each recipient has to configure their Gnus.

I think it is better if one person configures something, instead of
hundreds of people.  Therefore I believe that the headers should be
used, if present.

Is this clear?  Is it clear why I think that ditching the headers in
favor of group parameters is stupid?

kai
-- 
~/.signature is: umop ap!sdn    (Frank Nobis)

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Xavier MAILLARD]

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) disait récemment que :

> [...]
> I think it is better if one person configures something, instead of
> hundreds of people.  Therefore I believe that the headers should be
> used, if present.

No problem :)

> Is this clear?  Is it clear why I think that ditching the headers in
> favor of group parameters is stupid?

Sure I understand :) 
>
> kai

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Steve Youngs]

|--==> "KG" == Kai Großjohann <Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE> writes:

  KG> Xavier MAILLARD <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:
  >>The gnus-ml module contains interesting features but IMHO nobody
  >>(or almost)is using them.

  KG> How do you know it's not being used?  Did you make a poll?

  KG> If the headers are present, the users don't need to frob group
  KG> parameters manually.  So the old gnus-ml functionality should
  KG> continue to exist.

  KG> Maybe _you_ don't use it, but how about others?

I use it. :-)

-- 
|---<Steve Youngs>---------------<GnuPG KeyID: 10D5C9C5>---|
|            XEmacs - It's not just an editor.             |
|                    It's a way of life.                   |
|------------------------------------<youngs@xemacs.org>---|

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Andreas Fuchs]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 424 bytes --]

Today, Kai Großjohann <Kai.Grossjohann@cs.uni-dortmund.de> wrote:
>> I know it can be usefull for later use but is there any keybinding or
>> any functions to take advantage of this ??
> I don't think so.

Doesn't gnus-mailing-list-mode use it? Load up gnus-ml and find out (-:

-- 
Andreas Fuchs, <asf@acm.org>, asf@jabber.at, antifuchs
Was I helpful?  Let others know:
http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=antifuchs

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Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Xavier MAILLARD]

Andreas Fuchs <asf@void.at> disait récemment que :

> [...]
> Doesn't gnus-mailing-list-mode use it? Load up gnus-ml and find out (-:

I don't think that gnus-ml is the solution. I konw it embedds the
unsuscribe command but it doesn't take advantage of any gnus-parameters.

I think gnus-ml is useless nevertheless some of its features would be
usefull if they could take advantage of the gnus-parameter internals.

Another thing I've seen in gnus-ml, in what the subscribe function would
be helpfull ?? ;) There is another function to post into the ML. To be
brief I think many things into gnus-ml are unneeded and some should be
developed and integrated into the gnus internals.

Cheers,

zeDek

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Kai Großjohann]

Xavier MAILLARD <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:

> I think gnus-ml is useless nevertheless some of its features would be
> usefull if they could take advantage of the gnus-parameter internals.

gnus-ml is not useless at all: for groups which have the right
headers, it can be quite useful!

kai
-- 
~/.signature is: umop ap!sdn    (Frank Nobis)

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Xavier MAILLARD]

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) disait récemment que :

> gnus-ml is not useless at all: for groups which have the right
> headers, it can be quite useful!

I agree with that but we'd rather centralize all this stuff and be more
consistent. So why not centralize all the gnus-ml stuff in the
gnus-parameter ?? I think this is where it should be located within to
have to check for the headers or something else.

Cheers,

zeDek

Re: admin-adress purpose ?

[Xavier MAILLARD]

Xavier MAILLARD <zedek@gnu-rox.org> disait récemment que :

> [...]

DO NOT PAY ATTENTION to my previous post :)

zeDek