From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Msuck: nntp://news.gmane.io/gmane.emacs.gnus.general/44931 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Bj=F8rn?= Mork Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.gnus.general Subject: Re: Who sets Sender:? Date: Wed, 22 May 2002 19:38:40 +0200 Organization: Diffuse of Detonation Sender: owner-ding@hpc.uh.edu Message-ID: References: <87bsbak1ws.fsf@nwalsh.com> <87d6vqtqnv.fsf@squeaker.lickey.com> <02May21.105936edt.119176@gateway.intersystems.com> <02May21.122206edt.119093@gateway.intersystems.com> <02May21.142858edt.119269@gateway.intersystems.com> <02May21.154121edt.119281@gateway.intersystems.com> <02May21.171141edt.119208@gateway.intersystems.com> <02May22.114919edt.119312@gateway.intersystems.com> <02May22.125928edt.119302@gateway.intersystems.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: localhost.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: main.gmane.org 1022089152 16237 127.0.0.1 (22 May 2002 17:39:12 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 22 May 2002 17:39:12 +0000 (UTC) Return-path: Original-Received: from malifon.math.uh.edu ([129.7.128.13]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1 (Debian)) id 17Aa4t-0004Dm-00 for ; Wed, 22 May 2002 19:39:11 +0200 Original-Received: from sina.hpc.uh.edu ([129.7.128.10] ident=lists) by malifon.math.uh.edu with esmtp (Exim 3.20 #1) id 17Aa4r-0007ta-00; Wed, 22 May 2002 12:39:09 -0500 Original-Received: by sina.hpc.uh.edu (TLB v0.09a (1.20 tibbs 1996/10/09 22:03:07)); Wed, 22 May 2002 12:39:28 -0500 (CDT) Original-Received: from sclp3.sclp.com (qmailr@sclp3.sclp.com [209.196.61.66]) by sina.hpc.uh.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA14748 for ; Wed, 22 May 2002 12:39:11 -0500 (CDT) Original-Received: (qmail 2561 invoked by alias); 22 May 2002 17:38:43 -0000 Original-Received: (qmail 2556 invoked from network); 22 May 2002 17:38:42 -0000 Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org (80.91.224.244) by gnus.org with SMTP; 22 May 2002 17:38:42 -0000 Original-Received: from news by quimby.gnus.org with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17AaIr-00026z-00 for ; Wed, 22 May 2002 19:53:37 +0200 Original-To: ding@gnus.org Original-Path: not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnus.ding Original-Lines: 52 Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: rasputin.mork.no Original-X-Trace: quimby.gnus.org 1022090017 8120 148.122.252.5 (22 May 2002 17:53:37 GMT) Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@quimby.gnus.org Original-NNTP-Posting-Date: 22 May 2002 17:53:37 GMT User-Agent: Gnus/5.090007 (Oort Gnus v0.07) Emacs/21.2 (i386-debian-linux-gnu) Cancel-Lock: sha1:pdv9bJ+qex3nHWIsxHiih4fbkn0= Precedence: list X-Majordomo: 1.94.jlt7 Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.gnus.general:44931 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.gnus.general:44931 Stainless Steel Rat writes: > * prj@po.cwru.edu (Paul Jarc) on Wed, 22 May 2002 > | You're answering this question: "in what cases should the MUA guess > | whether Sender is needed?" That isn't the question I asked. > > I answered -that- question in one of my earliest posts: if the From field > is not user@host.domain. That was right before I pointed out that this is > a religious debate. And the reason for this being a religious debate is such strong beliefs for no apparent reason. There is nothing other than a religiously confused mind that can make "originator", "author" or "transmitter" become "user@host.domain". If I were to state my beliefs, I would say that the intented meaning of this section is that a Sender never should be added as long as the _person_ writing the message and the _person_ entering the message into the mail transport are the same: If the originator of the message can be indicated by a single mailbox and the author and transmitter are identical, the "Sender:" field SHOULD NOT be used. Otherwise, both fields SHOULD appear. Which would make the current Gnus default a violation of RFC2822. > [...] > | Will that incorrectness ever cause problems? > > Potentially, yes. Received headers will tell you the route a message has > taken, but it will not necessarilly tell you anything about the humans > involved. Which is a problem for whom/what? > | A wrong guess in the other direction can cause problems. "Correct" isn't > | always the best thing to be. > > A wrong guess in the other direction will not cause problems unless someone > violates RFC 2822 and misuses Sender. Which I hope everybody can agree is a real problem today. Buggy MUAs use the Sender for replies, and buggy mailing list software refuse messages unless the Sender is subscribed. One can either be a religious fanatic, or try to adapt as much as possible within the _actual_ RFC requirements. Bjørn -- I mean, most Nicaraguan people have computers .