From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Msuck: nntp://news.gmane.io/gmane.emacs.gnus.general/23486 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Jaap-Henk Hoepman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.gnus.general Subject: Re: some mail annoyances [renumbering] Date: 23 Jun 1999 10:18:18 +0200 Sender: owner-ding@hpc.uh.edu Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: coloc-standby.netfonds.no Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: main.gmane.org 1035161209 2221 80.91.224.250 (21 Oct 2002 00:46:49 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 00:46:49 +0000 (UTC) Cc: ding@gnus.org Return-Path: Original-Received: from farabi.math.uh.edu (farabi.math.uh.edu [129.7.128.57]) by sclp3.sclp.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA01276 for ; Wed, 23 Jun 1999 04:19:19 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: from sina.hpc.uh.edu (lists@Sina.HPC.UH.EDU [129.7.3.5]) by farabi.math.uh.edu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id DAB13453; Wed, 23 Jun 1999 03:18:47 -0500 (CDT) Original-Received: by sina.hpc.uh.edu (TLB v0.09a (1.20 tibbs 1996/10/09 22:03:07)); Wed, 23 Jun 1999 03:19:36 -0500 (CDT) Original-Received: from sclp3.sclp.com (root@sclp3.sclp.com [204.252.123.139]) by sina.hpc.uh.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id DAA22887 for ; Wed, 23 Jun 1999 03:19:25 -0500 (CDT) Original-Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by sclp3.sclp.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA01270 for ; Wed, 23 Jun 1999 04:18:24 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: from hypnos.cs.utwente.nl (hypnos.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.15.9]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA00719; Wed, 23 Jun 1999 10:18:20 +0200 (MET DST) Original-Received: from utip151.cs.utwente.nl by hypnos.cs.utwente.nl (8.8.8+Sun/csrelay-Sol1.4/RB) id KAA19233; Wed, 23 Jun 1999 10:18:19 +0200 (MET DST) Original-Received: (from hoepman@localhost) by utip151.cs.utwente.nl (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA02640; Wed, 23 Jun 1999 10:18:18 +0200 Original-To: Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE In-Reply-To: Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE's message of "23 Jun 1999 09:44:56 +0200" X-Face: #U;T;~,y.iVz7!wB(gVzSj:j}x-tZr\v-PQU}''7h^>jaAM'vw1KA83N5/gN~kcktG%,>Q>""S?Fg`&U80!Vg=)El,s/W)W^ Original-Lines: 43 User-Agent: Gnus/5.070088 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.88) XEmacs/20.4 (Emerald) Precedence: list X-Majordomo: 1.94.jlt7 Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.gnus.general:23486 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.gnus.general:23486 On 23 Jun 1999 09:44:56 +0200 Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE writes: > Jaap-Henk Hoepman writes: > > > Actually there is another quite fundamental difference between > > mail and news (which makes using gnus - by origin a news reader- > > harder to configure to read mail ): > > news is stored somewhere else: it's volatile; if you want > > to keep it you have to do something > > mail is stored locally by you: it's permanent; if you want > > to delete it you have to do something > > This is how most newsreaders and mail programs work; this is also > > what people expect them to do. Therefore transport class (or at > > least `storage class') does matter. > > This fundamental difference is quite blurred with Gnus. You can even > set it up such that the "in news, you have to do something to keep it, > in mail, you have to do something to delete it" is reversed! Right. And that's exactly why gnus is hard to set up to handle mail with. By default, it does `the right thing' for news, but not for mail. Just a thought: how difficult would it be to introduce group parameters this-is-a-mail-group and this-is-a-news-group, and to let gnus do it `the news way' for newsgroups and do it `the mail way' for mail groups. This way, installing gnus to read both news and mail becomes easy; and once people get the hang of it maybe they will expirment to do it `the gnus way'. > And with IMAP, mail isn't stored locally. Well, maybe Per's suggestion to distinguish user-controlled vs. admin-controlled information better captures the situation. > kai > -- > Life is hard and then you die. -- Jaap-Henk Hoepman | Come sail your ships around me Dept. of Computer Science | And burn these bridges down University of Twente | Nick Cave - "Ship Song" Email: hoepman@cs.utwente.nl === WWW: www.cs.utwente.nl/~hoepman Phone: +31 53 4893795 === Secr: +31 53 4893770 === Fax: +31 53 4894590 PGP ID: 0xF52E26DD Fingerprint: 1AED DDEB C7F1 DBB3 0556 4732 4217 ABEF