[Eli Zaretskii <eliz@is.elta.co.il>] Gnus setup with non-ASCII characters

[Eli Zaretskii <eliz@is.elta.co.il>] Gnus setup with non-ASCII characters

[Kai Großjohann]

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I have (set-language-environment "Latin-1").  And, well, you can see
my own From header.

Apparently, some clients (Gnus included) don't seem to take the hint
that the From header is Latin-1, if

  - the default language environment is something other than Latin-1,
    and
  - the body is ASCII-only (there is no CTE header or it says ASCII
    rather than iso-8859-1).

I'm not sure what's supposed to happen.  Maybe Gnus should take a look
at the headers, and if there is a non-ASCII part in it, the body
should at least be encoded in the same non-ASCII encoding.

I'm not at all sure, however, what's going to happen if the header is
iso-8859-1, say, and the body iso-8859-5.

Does somebody know what should happen?

kai
-- 
Life is hard and then you die.


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Date: Tue, 20 Jul 1999 12:05:36 +0300 (IDT)
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@is.elta.co.il>
X-Sender: eliz@is
To: Kai Grossjohann <Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE>
Subject: Gnus setup with non-ASCII characters
In-Reply-To: <vafso6krak8.fsf@petty.cs.uni-dortmund.de>
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.91.990720120432.4115L-100000@is>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE


Kai, I hate to bother you, but there's one problem with your Gnus
setup: it lies about the character set your messages are using.  The
headers say:

  Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

However, your name, Kai Großjohann, in the From: header uses Latin-1
characters.  This might go unnoticed by people whose Mule setup is the
default one, where Latin-1 is the default non-ASCII character set, but
my setup uses ISO 8859-8 set as the default, and therefore I see funny
characters in your name.

Could you please tell Gnus to say "charset=iso-8859-1" in the headers?


From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@is.elta.co.il>
To: Kai Grossjohann <Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE>
Subject: Gnus setup with non-ASCII characters
Date: Tue, 20 Jul 1999 12:05:36 +0300 (IDT)
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.91.990720120432.4115L-100000@is>


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From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@is.elta.co.il>
To: Kai Grossjohann <Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE>
Subject: Gnus setup with non-ASCII characters
Date: Tue, 20 Jul 1999 12:05:36 +0300 (IDT)
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.91.990720120432.4115L-100000@is>


Kai, I hate to bother you, but there's one problem with your Gnus
setup: it lies about the character set your messages are using.  The
headers say:

  Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

However, your name, Kai Großjohann, in the From: header uses Latin-1
characters.  This might go unnoticed by people whose Mule setup is the
default one, where Latin-1 is the default non-ASCII character set, but
my setup uses ISO 8859-8 set as the default, and therefore I see funny
characters in your name.

Could you please tell Gnus to say "charset=iso-8859-1" in the headers?

Re: [Eli Zaretskii <eliz@is.elta.co.il>] Gnus setup with non-ASCII characters

[Rupa Schomaker (list)]

Kai Großjohann <Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE> writes:

> I have (set-language-environment "Latin-1").  And, well, you can see
> my own From header.

I run w/out mule on xemacs 21.1..   When I reply to your messages I
get asked what Charset to use twice.

For both I use iso-8859-1 but... I wonder why I have to answer twice
and not just once.  I suppose if you get your other problem solved
(the charset specified in the headers) then I won't have to bother
specifying the charset since gnus will "do the right thing."

Anyone know why gnus makes me type in iso-8859-1 twice and how to get
it to only ask once?

-- 
Rupa (rupa@rupa.com for normal email)
Please don't email duplicate replies.

Re: [Eli Zaretskii <eliz@is.elta.co.il>] Gnus setup with non-ASCII characters

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Kai Großjohann <Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE> writes:

> I'm not at all sure, however, what's going to happen if the header is
> iso-8859-1, say, and the body iso-8859-5.

That should be OK.

> Kai, I hate to bother you, but there's one problem with your Gnus
> setup: it lies about the character set your messages are using.  The
> headers say:
> 
>   Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> However, your name, Kai Großjohann, in the From: header uses Latin-1
> characters.

That should also be OK.  The Content-Type talks about the content of
the message -- that is, the body.  If the body is ascii, then this is
correct. 

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: [Eli Zaretskii <eliz@is.elta.co.il>] Gnus setup with non-ASCII characters

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

"Rupa Schomaker (list)" <rupa-list@rupa.com> writes:

> Anyone know why gnus makes me type in iso-8859-1 twice and how to get
> it to only ask once?

In non-Mule Emacsen you have to tell Message what charset you use by
setting `message-default-charset'.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: [Eli Zaretskii <eliz@is.elta.co.il>] Gnus setup with non-ASCII characters

[Kai Großjohann]

Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org> writes:

> Eli writes:
> 
> > However, your name, Kai Großjohann, in the From: header uses Latin-1
> > characters.
> 
> That should also be OK.  The Content-Type talks about the content of
> the message -- that is, the body.  If the body is ascii, then this is
> correct. 

No, no.  ß is a non-ASCII character, and Eli was talking about this
character appearing _literally_ in the From header.  I think.  It's
been some time ago...

So, for the body we have the Content-type header which can specify the
charset used.  But what if there's a non-ASCII character in the
_header_?  What charset should we assume there?

Does Gnus ever produce non-ASCII characters in the headers?

kai
-- 
I like BOTH kinds of music.

Re: [Eli Zaretskii <eliz@is.elta.co.il>] Gnus setup with non-ASCII characters

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> No, no.  ß is a non-ASCII character, and Eli was talking about this
> character appearing _literally_ in the From header.  I think.  It's
> been some time ago...

Oh -- but your ß is beautifully encoded, isn't it?  :-)

> So, for the body we have the Content-type header which can specify the
> charset used.  But what if there's a non-ASCII character in the
> _header_?  What charset should we assume there?

We should only have ascii there (in mail), since anything else is
invalid.

I used to waffle on this point, but I think that virtually all mail
readers people use now grok at least a subset of rfc2047.  And you
never know what charset the recipient is using, so you can't "just
send 8bit", because then the recipient can't display the message
properly.  (For instance, when sending mail from Norway to Israel, the
"default charset" on each side is likely to be different, and it is
necessary to mark what charset one has used.)

> Does Gnus ever produce non-ASCII characters in the headers?

In mail, no, in news, yes.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: [Eli Zaretskii <eliz@is.elta.co.il>] Gnus setup with non-ASCII characters

[Steinar Bang]

>>>>> Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org>:

> Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:

...
>> Does Gnus ever produce non-ASCII characters in the headers?

> In mail, no, in news, yes.

...because not doing it in news would seem to break things in news
hierarchies that have a tradition for using a particular 8bit charset
in the headers (eg. no.* and ISO-8859-1).

Re: [Eli Zaretskii <eliz@is.elta.co.il>] Gnus setup with non-ASCII characters

[Kai Großjohann]

Steinar Bang <sb@metis.no> writes:

> ...because not doing it in news would seem to break things in news
> hierarchies that have a tradition for using a particular 8bit charset
> in the headers (eg. no.* and ISO-8859-1).

The de.* people don't want straight Latin 1 characters in the
headers.  Can you make it so that Gnus always encodes headers for de.*
groups? 

kai
-- 
I like BOTH kinds of music.