Unable to delete "References:" lines

Unable to delete "References:" lines

[Lloyd Zusman]

I'm writing about something I first noticed in the CVS of ognus several
months ago, and that I have kept forgetting to mention here until now.

I don't keep much of an address book on line, and if I want to send an
email to someone to whom I've corresponded before, I often will just
take a copy of an old message from that person, respond to it via
`gnus-summary-reply-{wide-}with-original', change the subject, delete
the "References:" line, and continue with my new message to him or her.

But what I've been noticing over the past few months is that when I send
the outgoing message, the deleted "References:" line reappears.  I
assume that this was done for a good reason, probably to help maintain
the integrity of message threads, but in cases such as these, I'd like
to disable this behavior and send the message out with no "References:"
header at all.

Is there a variable or hook which controls this behavior?

Thanks in advance.

-- 
 Lloyd Zusman
 ljz@asfast.com

Re: Unable to delete "References:" lines

[Lloyd Zusman]

One more detail: in the case I mentioned below, the exact behavior is
this: I see the deleted "References:" line reappear if I save the
message (C-x C-s) before sending.  I therefore believe that this
behavior has something to do with saving drafts.


Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:

> I'm writing about something I first noticed in the CVS of ognus several
> months ago, and that I have kept forgetting to mention here until now.
>
> I don't keep much of an address book on line, and if I want to send an
> email to someone to whom I've corresponded before, I often will just
> take a copy of an old message from that person, respond to it via
> `gnus-summary-reply-{wide-}with-original', change the subject, delete
> the "References:" line, and continue with my new message to him or her.
>
> But what I've been noticing over the past few months is that when I send
> the outgoing message, the deleted "References:" line reappears.  I
> assume that this was done for a good reason, probably to help maintain
> the integrity of message threads, but in cases such as these, I'd like
> to disable this behavior and send the message out with no "References:"
> header at all.
>
> Is there a variable or hook which controls this behavior?
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> -- 
>  Lloyd Zusman
>  ljz@asfast.com
>

-- 
 Lloyd Zusman
 ljz@asfast.com

Re: Unable to delete "References:" lines

[Mark Thomas]

Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:

> I don't keep much of an address book on line, and if I want to send an
> email to someone to whom I've corresponded before, I often will just
> take a copy of an old message from that person, respond to it via
> `gnus-summary-reply-{wide-}with-original', change the subject, delete
> the "References:" line, and continue with my new message to him or her.
>
> But what I've been noticing over the past few months is that when I send
> the outgoing message, the deleted "References:" line reappears.

Yeah, I complained about this when the change was made.

The solution is to make the References and/or In-Reply-To headers
empty, e.g., change

  References: <m365iv537b.fsf@asfast.com>

to

  References:

in your draft.

-Mark

Re: Unable to delete "References:" lines

[Katsumi Yamaoka]

Hi,

By a similar reason, I also feel it is inconvenient that I can't
edit the References header.  Then I use the following hook:

(add-hook
 'message-setup-hook
 (lambda nil
   ;; Generate the References header and clear the corresponding
   ;; elements in the `message-reply-headers' buffer-local variable.
   (let ((references (message-make-references))
	 reference)
     (if references
	 (progn
	   (mail-header-set-message-id message-reply-headers nil)
	   (mail-header-set-references message-reply-headers nil)
	   (setq references (split-string references))
	   (goto-char (point-min))
	   (insert "References: ")
	   (while references
	     (setq reference (car references)
		   references (cdr references))
	     (if (> (+ (current-column) (length reference)) 78)
		 (progn
		   (delete-char -1)
		   (insert "\n ")))
	     (insert reference (if references
				   " "
				 "\n")))
	   (message-sort-headers))))))

>>>>> In <m3u16fvp4p.fsf@asfast.com>
>>>>>	Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> wrote:

> One more detail: in the case I mentioned below, the exact behavior is
> this: I see the deleted "References:" line reappear if I save the
> message (C-x C-s) before sending.  I therefore believe that this
> behavior has something to do with saving drafts.

> Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:

>> I'm writing about something I first noticed in the CVS of ognus several
>> months ago, and that I have kept forgetting to mention here until now.
>>
>> I don't keep much of an address book on line, and if I want to send an
>> email to someone to whom I've corresponded before, I often will just
>> take a copy of an old message from that person, respond to it via
>> `gnus-summary-reply-{wide-}with-original', change the subject, delete
>> the "References:" line, and continue with my new message to him or her.
>>
>> But what I've been noticing over the past few months is that when I send
>> the outgoing message, the deleted "References:" line reappears.  I
>> assume that this was done for a good reason, probably to help maintain
>> the integrity of message threads, but in cases such as these, I'd like
>> to disable this behavior and send the message out with no "References:"
>> header at all.
>>
>> Is there a variable or hook which controls this behavior?
>>
>> Thanks in advance.

Re: Unable to delete "References:" lines

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Mark Thomas <swoon@bellatlantic.net> writes:

> Yeah, I complained about this when the change was made.
>
> The solution is to make the References and/or In-Reply-To headers
> empty, e.g., change
>
>   References: <m365iv537b.fsf@asfast.com>
>
> to
>
>   References:
>
> in your draft.

It's a bit difficult to determine what the user wants, really.  For
instance, if the user removes the From header, a new one has to be
generated, and is probably what the user wants.  If the user removes
the References header, the user probably doesn't want to have the
header re-generated.

Perhaps the fix would be to not re-generate the optional headers if
they are removed?

I've now done so.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: Unable to delete "References:" lines

[Lloyd Zusman]

> Hi,
>
> By a similar reason, I also feel it is inconvenient that I can't
> edit the References header.  Then I use the following hook:

Thank you for this (and I apologize for not replying sooner).

I presume this works because deleting the existing references causes
Gnus to assume that there are none to preserve, correct?


> (add-hook
>  'message-setup-hook
>  (lambda nil
>    ;; Generate the References header and clear the corresponding
>    ;; elements in the `message-reply-headers' buffer-local variable.
>    (let ((references (message-make-references))
> 	 reference)
>      (if references
> 	 (progn
> 	   (mail-header-set-message-id message-reply-headers nil)
> 	   (mail-header-set-references message-reply-headers nil)
> 	   (setq references (split-string references))
> 	   (goto-char (point-min))
> 	   (insert "References: ")
> 	   (while references
> 	     (setq reference (car references)
> 		   references (cdr references))
> 	     (if (> (+ (current-column) (length reference)) 78)
> 		 (progn
> 		   (delete-char -1)
> 		   (insert "\n ")))
> 	     (insert reference (if references
> 				   " "
> 				 "\n")))
> 	   (message-sort-headers))))))
>
>>>>>> In <m3u16fvp4p.fsf@asfast.com>
>>>>>>	Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> wrote:
>
>> One more detail: in the case I mentioned below, the exact behavior is
>> this: I see the deleted "References:" line reappear if I save the
>> message (C-x C-s) before sending.  I therefore believe that this
>> behavior has something to do with saving drafts.
>
>> Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:
>
>>> I'm writing about something I first noticed in the CVS of ognus several
>>> months ago, and that I have kept forgetting to mention here until now.
>>>
>>> I don't keep much of an address book on line, and if I want to send an
>>> email to someone to whom I've corresponded before, I often will just
>>> take a copy of an old message from that person, respond to it via
>>> `gnus-summary-reply-{wide-}with-original', change the subject, delete
>>> the "References:" line, and continue with my new message to him or her.
>>>
>>> But what I've been noticing over the past few months is that when I send
>>> the outgoing message, the deleted "References:" line reappears.  I
>>> assume that this was done for a good reason, probably to help maintain
>>> the integrity of message threads, but in cases such as these, I'd like
>>> to disable this behavior and send the message out with no "References:"
>>> header at all.
>>>
>>> Is there a variable or hook which controls this behavior?
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance.

-- 
 Lloyd Zusman
 ljz@asfast.com

Re: Unable to delete "References:" lines

[Lloyd Zusman]

Mark Thomas <swoon@bellatlantic.net> writes:

> Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:
>
>> [ ... ]
>>
>> But what I've been noticing over the past few months is that when I send
>> the outgoing message, the deleted "References:" line reappears.
>
> Yeah, I complained about this when the change was made.
>
> The solution is to make the References and/or In-Reply-To headers
> empty, e.g., change
>
>   References: <m365iv537b.fsf@asfast.com>
>
> to
>
>   References:
>
> in your draft.

Yes, that works.  Thank you (and I'm sorry for taking so long to reply).


-- 
 Lloyd Zusman
 ljz@asfast.com

Re: Unable to delete "References:" lines

[Katsumi Yamaoka]

>>>>> In <m3r80m6hc2.fsf@asfast.com>
>>>>>	Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> wrote:

> I presume this works because deleting the existing references causes
> Gnus to assume that there are none to preserve, correct?

Exactly.  You can edit them (for example, delete except the last ID)
and can also delete the header whole.

>> (add-hook
>>  'message-setup-hook
>>  (lambda nil
>>    ;; Generate the References header and clear the corresponding
>>    ;; elements in the `message-reply-headers' buffer-local variable.
>>    (let ((references (message-make-references))
>> 	 reference)
>>      (if references
>> 	 (progn
>> 	   (mail-header-set-message-id message-reply-headers nil)
>> 	   (mail-header-set-references message-reply-headers nil)
>> 	   (setq references (split-string references))
>> 	   (goto-char (point-min))
>> 	   (insert "References: ")
>> 	   (while references
>> 	     (setq reference (car references)
>> 		   references (cdr references))
>> 	     (if (> (+ (current-column) (length reference)) 78)
>> 		 (progn
>> 		   (delete-char -1)
>> 		   (insert "\n ")))
>> 	     (insert reference (if references
>> 				   " "
>> 				 "\n")))
>> 	   (message-sort-headers))))))
-- 
Katsumi Yamaoka <yamaoka@jpl.org>

Re: Unable to delete "References:" lines

[Lloyd Zusman]

Katsumi Yamaoka <yamaoka@jpl.org> writes:

>>>>>> In <m3r80m6hc2.fsf@asfast.com>
>>>>>>	Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> wrote:
>
>> I presume this works because deleting the existing references causes
>> Gnus to assume that there are none to preserve, correct?
>
> Exactly.  You can edit them (for example, delete except the last ID)
> and can also delete the header whole.

I understand.  And I find it interesting that the message ID also has to
be removed, or else this doesn't seem to work.




>>> (add-hook
>>>  'message-setup-hook
>>>  (lambda nil
>>>    ;; Generate the References header and clear the corresponding
>>>    ;; elements in the `message-reply-headers' buffer-local variable.
>>>    (let ((references (message-make-references))
>>> 	 reference)
>>>      (if references
>>> 	 (progn
>>> 	   (mail-header-set-message-id message-reply-headers nil)
>>> 	   (mail-header-set-references message-reply-headers nil)
>>> 	   (setq references (split-string references))
>>> 	   (goto-char (point-min))
>>> 	   (insert "References: ")
>>> 	   (while references
>>> 	     (setq reference (car references)
>>> 		   references (cdr references))
>>> 	     (if (> (+ (current-column) (length reference)) 78)
>>> 		 (progn
>>> 		   (delete-char -1)
>>> 		   (insert "\n ")))
>>> 	     (insert reference (if references
>>> 				   " "
>>> 				 "\n")))
>>> 	   (message-sort-headers))))))
> -- 
> Katsumi Yamaoka <yamaoka@jpl.org>

-- 
 Lloyd Zusman
 ljz@asfast.com