From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Msuck: nntp://news.gmane.io/gmane.emacs.gnus.general/34804 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Per Abrahamsen Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.gnus.general Subject: Re: mail-{followup,copies}-to on this list Date: 15 Feb 2001 14:14:56 +0100 Organization: The Church of Emacs Sender: owner-ding@hpc.uh.edu Message-ID: References: <87d7clvvth.fsf@lovi.inf.elte.hu> NNTP-Posting-Host: coloc-standby.netfonds.no Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: main.gmane.org 1035170659 32178 80.91.224.250 (21 Oct 2002 03:24:19 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 03:24:19 +0000 (UTC) Return-Path: Original-Received: from karazm.math.uh.edu (karazm.math.uh.edu [129.7.128.1]) by mailhost.sclp.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F16E0D049D for ; Thu, 15 Feb 2001 08:15:49 -0500 (EST) Original-Received: from sina.hpc.uh.edu (lists@Sina.HPC.UH.EDU [129.7.3.5]) by karazm.math.uh.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAC07820; Thu, 15 Feb 2001 07:15:28 -0600 (CST) Original-Received: by sina.hpc.uh.edu (TLB v0.09a (1.20 tibbs 1996/10/09 22:03:07)); Thu, 15 Feb 2001 07:14:43 -0600 (CST) Original-Received: from mailhost.sclp.com (postfix@66-209.196.61.interliant.com [209.196.61.66] (may be forged)) by sina.hpc.uh.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAA13513 for ; Thu, 15 Feb 2001 07:14:33 -0600 (CST) Original-Received: from sheridan.dina.kvl.dk (sheridan.dina.kvl.dk [130.225.40.227]) by mailhost.sclp.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B2A6D049D for ; Thu, 15 Feb 2001 08:14:58 -0500 (EST) Original-Received: from ssv2.dina.kvl.dk (ssv2.dina.kvl.dk [130.225.40.226]) by sheridan.dina.kvl.dk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id OAA02436; Thu, 15 Feb 2001 14:14:56 +0100 Original-Received: from abraham by ssv2.dina.kvl.dk with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 14TOFM-00043M-00; Thu, 15 Feb 2001 14:14:56 +0100 Original-To: ding@gnus.org X-Face: +kRV2]2q}lixHkE{U)mY#+6]{AH=yN~S9@IFiOa@X6?GM|8MBp/ In-Reply-To: <87d7clvvth.fsf@lovi.inf.elte.hu> (NAGY Andras's message of "14 Feb 2001 21:44:26 +0100") User-Agent: Gnus/5.090001 (Oort Gnus v0.01) Emacs/20.7 Precedence: list X-Majordomo: 1.94.jlt7 Original-Lines: 58 Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.gnus.general:34804 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.gnus.general:34804 NAGY Andras writes: > (http://www.newsreaders.com/misc/mail-copies-to.html) says > > If the header is not present the agent SHOULD NOT set the message to > be both posted and mailed. > > Please correct me if I interpret this wrong, or stop sending me > personal followups. The document is irrelevant, as the document in question only covers the use of the header on Usenet, not email. The situation for email are very different than Usenet, both for cultural and technical reasons. However, while the issue is not covered by any standards, there is the much more important question of politeness. Of course, in general it is silly to send multiple copies of the same message by different paths to the same receiver. Unfortunately, when only using the common headers, there is no machanical way an agent can determine whether the receivers of foo@bar.org is a subset of the receivers of baz@foobar.net. Or more specifically, without more information there is no way Gnus can know that nagya@inf.elte.hu is a member of the mailing list ding@gnus.org. To be safe, the default action have to be to send to both addresses. There are several solutions to this problem. Here are some of the ones the sender can use: 1. He can setup Gnus to sort away duplicates. This is the one I use, and I haven't been bothered by duplicates since that. 2. He can use "mail-copies-to: nobody", in order to tell the receiver that he already read one of the to or cc addresses, so it can ignore the from address. 3. He can use "mail-followup-to: list@address", to indicate which of the adresses in question that is most appropriate for wide replies. 4. He can try flaming on the list, and hope the receivers will make it their problem. I strongly discourage selecting this option. The reciecer can also do something, even if he has fewer options. 1. IF the list is closed, i.e. only subscribers send to it, and IF he read it from a Gnus folder, and IF there are no crossmailed messages (i.e. messages mailed to multiple lists), he can set the 'to-address' group parameter. I do this for some lists, e.g. ding, but not others like auctex (which is open for non-subscribers) or xemacs-beta (which has lots of crossmailings). 2. The can manually for each message try to guess who is on which lists. I do not recommend this, it is way more unreliable and takes a lot more work for the receiver, than it would take for the sender to solve the problem from his side.