Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Harry Putnam]

Ooops... sorry Per and Kai.  Didn't mean to nail everyone with one of
those extra messages, it was intended to go to ding only.

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> On 31 Jan 2001, Per Abrahamsen wrote:
> 
> > It would make the form interface, which I assume most people use,
> > more complex for very little gain.
> 
> I wish people were using `G c' rather than `G p', but it appears they
> don't.  At least there are a lot of questions due to hosed group
> parameters, which could have been avoided using `G c'.
> 
> Why are people using `G p' and not `G c'?  Do they not know about `G
> c'?  Or was the explanation not promising enough?

Butting in here a bit... I think `G c' is a good way to learn how to
edit Group params since you can do `G c' then look with `G p' at what was
written.  Soon you have an idea how it is done.  

Once you know how its done, then `G c' is really pretty cumbersome
compared to a quick hand edit.  However, this will no doubt lead to
more errors.

I even find myself looking at groups with `G p' for  something
similar to what I'm currently after, rather than use `G c'.  

`G c' is very nice but in fact is slow and cumbersome.

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Per Abrahamsen]

Harry Putnam <reader@newsguy.com> writes:

> Ooops... sorry Per and Kai.  Didn't mean to nail everyone with one of
> those extra messages, it was intended to go to ding only.

I have this split rule:

        ("gnus-warning" "duplicat.* of message" "duplicate")

so I don't care.  I only see it once anyway.

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Harry Putnam]

Per Abrahamsen <abraham@dina.kvl.dk> writes:

> Harry Putnam <reader@newsguy.com> writes:
> 
> > Ooops... sorry Per and Kai.  Didn't mean to nail everyone with one of
> > those extra messages, it was intended to go to ding only.
> 
> I have this split rule:
> 
>         ("gnus-warning" "duplicat.* of message" "duplicate")
> 
> so I don't care.  I only see it once anyway.

Per, That syntax is unfamiliar for a split rule.  What does the extra
string "duplicate" do?

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Paul Stevenson]

Harry Putnam <reader@newsguy.com> writes:

> Per Abrahamsen <abraham@dina.kvl.dk> writes:
> > 
> > I have this split rule:
> > 
> >         ("gnus-warning" "duplicat.* of message" "duplicate")
> > 
> > so I don't care.  I only see it once anyway.
> 
> Per, That syntax is unfamiliar for a split rule.  What does the extra
> string "duplicate" do?

I guess Per is a fancy-splitter. "duplicate" is the group name,
"gnus-warning" is the header, and the middle one is the regexp.

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Per Abrahamsen]

Harry Putnam <reader@newsguy.com> writes:

> Per, That syntax is unfamiliar for a split rule. 

It is the simplest form for a `nnmail-split-fancy' split rule.

> What does the extra string "duplicate" do?

Directs the matching message to a folder named "duplicate".

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Simon Josefsson]

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> >> Side note: is it possible for backends to receive notification when
> >> the user changes group parameters, so that they could be stored in
> >> the backend, like marks?  Or is there some reason why this would be
> >> a bad idea?
> > 
> > Nnimap used to send flags to server when they were set
> 
> flags != group parameters

Oops!   Vocabulary overflow.

> Did nnimap ever store group parameters on the server?

No.  I'm not sure I want that in all cases, I'm using different group
parameters on all three of my Gnus configurations (laptop, work,
school).

But it would be nice to somehow put things on the server, group
parameters and other stuff.  It's really boring to synchronize Gnus
configs.  Pine puts config in a IMAP mailbox.  I think it's ugly, but
ACAP and similar doesn't seem to get much deployment, so I guess it's
the only solution right now...

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Kai Großjohann]

On 07 Feb 2001, Simon Josefsson wrote:
> prj@po.cwru.edu (Paul Jarc) writes:
> 
>> Side note: is it possible for backends to receive notification when
>> the user changes group parameters, so that they could be stored in
>> the backend, like marks?  Or is there some reason why this would be
>> a bad idea?
> 
> Nnimap used to send flags to server when they were set

flags != group parameters

Did nnimap ever store group parameters on the server?

kai
-- 
Be indiscrete.  Do it continuously.

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Kai Großjohann]

On 07 Feb 2001, Paul Jarc wrote:

> Side note: is it possible for backends to receive notification when
> the user changes group parameters, so that they could be stored in
> the backend, like marks?  Or is there some reason why this would be
> a bad idea?

Hm.  I guess it's a nice idea.  Never thought about this.  Hm.  Might
be nifty to allow this.

kai
-- 
Be indiscrete.  Do it continuously.

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Kai Großjohann]

On Wed, 07 Feb 2001, Jesper Harder wrote:
> Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:
> 
>> Why are people using `G p' and not `G c'?  Do they not know about
>> `G c'?
> 
> Probably not -- only 'G p' is mentioned in the "Group Parameters"
> info node.

Eeek.  I'll add it right away.  Thanks!

kai
-- 
Be indiscrete.  Do it continuously.

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Harry Putnam]

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> On 31 Jan 2001, Per Abrahamsen wrote:
> 
> > It would make the form interface, which I assume most people use,
> > more complex for very little gain.
> 
> I wish people were using `G c' rather than `G p', but it appears they
> don't.  At least there are a lot of questions due to hosed group
> parameters, which could have been avoided using `G c'.
> 
> Why are people using `G p' and not `G c'?  Do they not know about `G
> c'?  Or was the explanation not promising enough?

Butting in here a bit... I think `G c' is a good way to learn how to
edit Group params since you can do `G c' then look with `G p' at what was
written.  Soon you have an idea how it is done.  

Once you know how its done, then `G c' is really pretty cumbersome
compared to a quick hand edit.  However, this will no doubt lead to
more errors.

I even find myself looking at groups with `G p' for  something
similar to what I'm currently after, rather than use `G c'.  

`G c' is very nice but in fact is slow and cumbersome.

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Simon Josefsson]

prj@po.cwru.edu (Paul Jarc) writes:

> Side note: is it possible for backends to receive notification when
> the user changes group parameters, so that they could be stored in the
> backend, like marks?  Or is there some reason why this would be a bad
> idea?

Nnimap used to send flags to server when they were set (in a ad-hoc
way), but it was changed to mimic all other backends -- flags are only
saved when you `q' a group.  `Q' or `C-k' simply forgets about what
you've been doing in a mailbox (modulo `B DEL's and similar).

Changing this now would probably be confusing..

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Steven E. Harris]

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> Why are people using `G p' and not `G c'?  Do they not know about `G
> c'?  Or was the explanation not promising enough?

I usually use `G p' because I'm almost always *copying* a parameter
from one group to another. Once I find a setting I like on one group,
I'll copy it around and modify it as necessary, possibly promoting it
to a Topic parameter. `G c' just seems a little too heavyweight for
this purpose, as my copy-and-paste keystrokes aren't as fast.

-- 
Steven E. Harris        :: steven.harris@tenzing.com
Tenzing                 :: http://www.tenzing.com

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Paul Jarc]

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:
> Why are people using `G p' and not `G c'?  Do they not know about `G
> c'?  Or was the explanation not promising enough?

I didn't know about 'G c'.  (But I do now, thanks.)  I expect I'll
still use 'G p' when I want to find out what's really in there, but if
I remember, I'll use 'G c' to make changes.

Side note: is it possible for backends to receive notification when
the user changes group parameters, so that they could be stored in the
backend, like marks?  Or is there some reason why this would be a bad
idea?


paul

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Jesper Harder]

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> Why are people using `G p' and not `G c'?  Do they not know about `G
> c'?

Probably not -- only 'G p' is mentioned in the "Group Parameters" info
node.

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Kai Großjohann]

On 31 Jan 2001, Per Abrahamsen wrote:

> It would make the form interface, which I assume most people use,
> more complex for very little gain.

I wish people were using `G c' rather than `G p', but it appears they
don't.  At least there are a lot of questions due to hosed group
parameters, which could have been avoided using `G c'.

Why are people using `G p' and not `G c'?  Do they not know about `G
c'?  Or was the explanation not promising enough?

kai
-- 
Be indiscrete.  Do it continuously.

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[ShengHuo ZHU]

Toby Speight <streapadair@gmx.net> writes:

> I'm not sure whether I remembered to say that my solution was a Lisp
> expression that must be evaluated and the *result* entered in the
> Group parameters as
> 
> ( ;; group parameters
>  (banner . "<long result string>"))
> 
> I used `concat' to split it over several lines for clarity and
> line-length, but unfortunately the group parameter is not evaluated
> (Lars, ShengHuo, feature request?).

You can use concat in gnus-article-banner-alist (since 5.8.8), then
put a simple symbol instead of long result string in group parameters.

ShengHuo

-- 
(setq gnus-posting-styles '((".*" (signature-file "~/.signature"))))

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Per Abrahamsen]

Toby Speight <streapadair@gmx.net> writes:

> I used `concat' to split it over several lines for clarity and
> line-length, but unfortunately the group parameter is not evaluated
> (Lars, ShengHuo, feature request?).

It would make the form interface, which I assume most people use, more
complex for very little gain.

Re: Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Toby Speight]

0> In article <deathsquad.m31ytlsymc.fsf@socha.net>,
0> Robin S. Socha <URL:mailto:robin@socha.net> ("Robin") wrote:

Robin> OK. So I edited the Group paramaters (no keyboard shortcut for that
Robin> one?)

G p  in the *Group* buffer.

Robin> - and as soon as I had said C-c C-c: *pooof* gone. What gives?

I'm not sure whether I remembered to say that my solution was a Lisp
expression that must be evaluated and the *result* entered in the
Group parameters as

( ;; group parameters
 (banner . "<long result string>"))

I used `concat' to split it over several lines for clarity and
line-length, but unfortunately the group parameter is not evaluated
(Lars, ShengHuo, feature request?).

Am I stupid? (was: Banner Orgy)

[Robin S. Socha]

* Toby Speight <streapadair@gmx.net> writes:
>  Robin S. Socha <URL:mailto:robin@socha.net> ("Robin") wrote:

>>  OK, so how do I get rid of /this/?

[unspeakable horror]

> With a regexp something like

[potential solution]

OK. So I edited the Group paramaters (no keyboard shortcut for that
one?) - and as soon as I had said C-c C-c: *pooof* gone. What gives?
-- 
Robin S. Socha  <http://socha.net/Gnus/>