Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning

Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning

[Lloyd Zusman]

I'm making use of several nnimap groups, each of which being defined
within `gnus-secondary-select-methods'.  As far as I can tell, each one
is defined identically, the only difference being their names.

However, only the first of these three gets updated during
`gnus-group-get-new-news'.  I need to enter the other two and
specifically invoke `gnus-summary-rescan-group' in order for them to
notice any new mail that might have arrived.

I suspect that ages ago, I might have set some sort of variable which
prevents all but the first nnimap group from being scanned during
`gnus-group-get-new-news', but I can't for the life of me recall what I
might have done, nor have I been able to find anything within my setup
that seems to affect this behavior.

Could any of you suggest some possible variables or settings that might
control this?

Thanks in advance.

-- 
 Lloyd Zusman
 ljz@asfast.com

Re: Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning

[Xavier Maillard]

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On 23 jui 2003, Lloyd Zusman outgrape:

>  I'm making use of several nnimap groups, each of which being defined
>  within `gnus-secondary-select-methods'.  As far as I can tell, each
>  one is defined identically, the only difference being their names.
>  
>  However, only the first of these three gets updated during
>  `gnus-group-get-new-news'.  I need to enter the other two and
>  specifically invoke `gnus-summary-rescan-group' in order for them to
>  notice any new mail that might have arrived.
>  
>  I suspect that ages ago, I might have set some sort of variable which
>  prevents all but the first nnimap group from being scanned during
>  `gnus-group-get-new-news', but I can't for the life of me recall what
>  I might have done, nor have I been able to find anything within my
>  setup that seems to affect this behavior.
>  
>  Could any of you suggest some possible variables or settings that
>  might control this?

Maybe a clue : do you take advantage of (*the so cool*) (un)plug
feature ?

Ok forget about that it can't be the source of your problems ;)

Maybe you have defined an alist of servers not to be checked during a
g-g-g-n-n ? (at least automatically) 

Last but not least how do you call the function ? 
This is the relevant info section for g-g-g-n-n :

,----[ C-h f gnus-group-get-new-news RET ]
| gnus-group-get-new-news is an interactive compiled Lisp function in `gnus-group'.
| (gnus-group-get-new-news &optional ARG)
| 
| Get newly arrived articles.
| If ARG is a number, it specifies which levels you are interested in
| re-scanning.  If ARG is non-nil and not a number, this will force
| "hard" re-reading of the active files from all servers.
| 
| [back]
`----

Maybe your groups are not on the same level ? Maybe you inhibit some
hooks such as gnus-get-top-news-hook or gnus-get-new-news-hook ?

Sorry if I am not clear but I am still a n00b at trying to help people
getting out of their problems :)

>  Thanks in advance.

zeDek
-- 
"Breaking Windows isn't just for kids anymore..."

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Re: Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning

[Lloyd Zusman]

Xavier Maillard <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:

> On 23 jui 2003, Lloyd Zusman outgrape:
>
>>  I'm making use of several nnimap groups, each of which being defined
>>  within `gnus-secondary-select-methods'.  As far as I can tell, each
>>  one is defined identically, the only difference being their names.
>>  
>>  However, only the first of these three gets updated during
>>  `gnus-group-get-new-news'.  [ ... ]
>>  
>>  [ ... ]
>>
>>  Could any of you suggest some possible variables or settings that
>>  might control this?
>
> Maybe a clue : do you take advantage of (*the so cool*) (un)plug
> feature ?
>
> Ok forget about that it can't be the source of your problems ;)
>
> Maybe you have defined an alist of servers not to be checked during a
> g-g-g-n-n ? (at least automatically) 

Not that I know of.  Is there such an alist that's a standard part of
gnus?  I did not define my own.


> Last but not least how do you call the function ? 
> This is the relevant info section for g-g-g-n-n :
>
> ,----[ C-h f gnus-group-get-new-news RET ]
> | gnus-group-get-new-news is an interactive compiled Lisp function in `gnus-group'.
> | (gnus-group-get-new-news &optional ARG)
> | 
> | Get newly arrived articles.
> | If ARG is a number, it specifies which levels you are interested in
> | re-scanning.  If ARG is non-nil and not a number, this will force
> | "hard" re-reading of the active files from all servers.
> | 
> | [back]
> `----
>
> Maybe your groups are not on the same level ? Maybe you inhibit some
> hooks such as gnus-get-top-news-hook or gnus-get-new-news-hook ?

Nope ... all of them are at the same level.  And I invoke the
function with no argument.


> Sorry if I am not clear but I am still a n00b at trying to help people
> getting out of their problems :)

You are quite clear, and I thank you sincerely.  This just turns out to
still be a mystery to me.



-- 
 Lloyd Zusman
 ljz@asfast.com

Re: Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning

[Xavier Maillard]

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On 25 jui 2003, Lloyd Zusman stated:

>  Xavier Maillard <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:
>  
> >  On 23 jui 2003, Lloyd Zusman outgrape:
> >  
> > >  I'm making use of several nnimap groups, each of which being
> > >  defined within `gnus-secondary-select-methods'.  As far as I can
> > >  tell, each one is defined identically, the only difference being
> > >  their names.
> > >  
> > >  However, only the first of these three gets updated during
> > >  `gnus-group-get-new-news'.  [ ... ]
> > >  
> > >  [ ... ]
> > >  
> > >  Could any of you suggest some possible variables or settings that
> > >  might control this?
> >  
> >  Maybe a clue : do you take advantage of (*the so cool*) (un)plug
> >  feature ?
> >  
> >  Ok forget about that it can't be the source of your problems ;)
> >  
> >  Maybe you have defined an alist of servers not to be checked during
> >  a g-g-g-n-n ? (at least automatically)
>  
>  Not that I know of.  Is there such an alist that's a standard part of
>  gnus?  I did not define my own.

I don't think so.

> > [...]
  
> >  Maybe your groups are not on the same level ? Maybe you inhibit
> >  some hooks such as gnus-get-top-news-hook or gnus-get-new-news-hook
> >  ?
>  
>  Nope ... all of them are at the same level.  And I invoke the
>  function with no argument.

Hmmm...
  
> >  Sorry if I am not clear but I am still a n00b at trying to help
> >  people getting out of their problems :)
>  
>  You are quite clear, and I thank you sincerely.  This just turns out
>  to still be a mystery to me.

It is also a mystery to me. I really don't see why this happens. Did you
check the availability of your servers ? Maybe only one is activated at
a time ? Or there is a problem with gnus-slave ?

If you find out the solution, would you mine to post it here ? I am
quite interested in having it just in case it happens to me ;)

Regards,

zeDek
-- 
"Most people deserve each other."

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Re: Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning

[Lloyd Zusman]

Xavier Maillard <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:

> On 25 jui 2003, Lloyd Zusman stated:
>
> [ ... ]
>
>> >  Sorry if I am not clear but I am still a n00b at trying to help
>> >  people getting out of their problems :)
>>  
>>  You are quite clear, and I thank you sincerely.  This just turns out
>>  to still be a mystery to me.
>
> It is also a mystery to me. I really don't see why this happens. Did you
> check the availability of your servers ? Maybe only one is activated at
> a time ? Or there is a problem with gnus-slave ?

All servers are available.  I can access the IMAP servers from the
command line (i.e., "telnet host 143" with no problem), and I can
also get to them via other IMAP clients.

Also ... recall that I mentioned that if I go directly into the group
and invoke `gnus-summary-rescan-group', I see all the new messages.
This problem only occurs with `gnus-group-get-new-news'.


> If you find out the solution, would you mine to post it here ? I am
> quite interested in having it just in case it happens to me ;)

Yes, I will indeed post my solution, once I find it.

Thanks again.



-- 
 Lloyd Zusman
 ljz@asfast.com

Re: Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning

[Kai Großjohann]

Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:

> I suspect that ages ago, I might have set some sort of variable which
> prevents all but the first nnimap group from being scanned during
> `gnus-group-get-new-news', but I can't for the life of me recall what I
> might have done, nor have I been able to find anything within my setup
> that seems to affect this behavior.

Maybe the groups have different levels?  Hit `S l' on them to find
out (and correct).
-- 
~/.signature

Re: Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning

[Lloyd Zusman]

kai.grossjohann@gmx.net (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:
>
>> I suspect that ages ago, I might have set some sort of variable which
>> prevents all but the first nnimap group from being scanned during
>> `gnus-group-get-new-news', but I can't for the life of me recall what I
>> might have done, nor have I been able to find anything within my setup
>> that seems to affect this behavior.
>
> Maybe the groups have different levels?  Hit `S l' on them to find
> out (and correct).

Well, I mentioned in a subsequent message (that you probably didn't get
to yet) that the groups are all at the same level).

I _think_ I originally mentioned that these are nnimap groups (did I?).
Could this be a factor?


-- 
 Lloyd Zusman
 ljz@asfast.com

Re: Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning

[Kai Großjohann]

Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:

> Well, I mentioned in a subsequent message (that you probably didn't get
> to yet) that the groups are all at the same level).

Ah, hm.  So you have several nnimap groups, all from the same server,
and they behave differently?  Weird.

You could also try `G e' on those groups to see if the select method
is the same.  Sometimes, people have "nnimap:foo" (including the
quotes) for some groups and (nnimap "foo" ...) (including the
parentheses) for others.  Please convert them all to the "nnimap:foo"
variant.

Does `G E' show a difference?
-- 
~/.signature

Re: Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning

[Lloyd Zusman]

kai.grossjohann@gmx.net (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:
>
>> Well, I mentioned in a subsequent message (that you probably didn't get
>> to yet) that the groups are all at the same level).
>
> Ah, hm.  So you have several nnimap groups, all from the same server,
> and they behave differently?  Weird.

Yep.


> You could also try `G e' on those groups to see if the select method
> is the same.  Sometimes, people have "nnimap:foo" (including the
> quotes) for some groups and (nnimap "foo" ...) (including the
> parentheses) for others.  Please convert them all to the "nnimap:foo"
> variant.
>
> Does `G E' show a difference?

I checked `G e' and `G E', and all look equivalent.  And in each case,
it's "nnimap:foo" and not (nnimap "foo" ...).

And did I mention that when I'm in the summary buffer for any of these
groups, invoking `gnus-summary-rescan-group' will always correctly
detect new messages for each nnimap server?  It's only
`gnus-group-get-new-news' that fails to do that for the 2nd through n-th
imap groups.


-- 
 Lloyd Zusman
 ljz@asfast.com

Re: Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning

[Xavier Maillard]

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Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:

>  kai.grossjohann@gmx.net (Kai Großjohann) writes:
>  
> >  Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:
> >  
> > >  Well, I mentioned in a subsequent message (that you probably
> > >  didn't get to yet) that the groups are all at the same level).
> >  
> >  Ah, hm.  So you have several nnimap groups, all from the same
> >  server, and they behave differently?  Weird.
>  
>  Yep.
>  
> >  You could also try `G e' on those groups to see if the select
> >  method is the same.  Sometimes, people have "nnimap:foo" (including
> >  the quotes) for some groups and (nnimap "foo" ...) (including the
> >  parentheses) for others.  Please convert them all to the
> >  "nnimap:foo" variant.
> >  
> >  Does `G E' show a difference?
>  
>  I checked `G e' and `G E', and all look equivalent.  And in each
>  case, it's "nnimap:foo" and not (nnimap "foo" ...).
>  
>  And did I mention that when I'm in the summary buffer for any of
>  these groups, invoking `gnus-summary-rescan-group' will always
>  correctly detect new messages for each nnimap server?  It's only
>  `gnus-group-get-new-news' that fails to do that for the 2nd through
>  n-th imap groups.

You may have hit a bug in that function then or you have a special
setup that prevents it from doing its job the right way. 

zeDek
-- 
"Now you're not going to say anything of sense or that is worthwhile to
 read... but you're going to post it anyways, as usual, right?"
       	  	..neulich in d.o.l.a. - er muss ueber Jost gestolpert sein....

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Re: Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning

[Lloyd Zusman]

Xavier Maillard <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:
>
> [ ... ]
>
> You may have hit a bug in that function then or you have a special
> setup that prevents it from doing its job the right way. 

Well, in my original message in this thread I mentioned that there is
very likely something about my setup which is causing this.  Upon
re-reading that post, you'll see that my purpose in posting was to see
if any of you could suggest the kinds of things that might appear in my
setup which could control this behavior, since I haven't found anything
obvious, myself.

As for the case where it might be a bug, I've been planing to do some
serious investigation/debugging as soon as I have some time.

-- 
 Lloyd Zusman
 ljz@asfast.com

Re: Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning

[Xavier Maillard]

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Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:

>  Xavier Maillard <zedek@gnu-rox.org> writes:
> >  
> >  [ ... ]
> >  
> >  You may have hit a bug in that function then or you have a special
> >  setup that prevents it from doing its job the right way. 
>  
>  Well, in my original message in this thread I mentioned that there is
>  very likely something about my setup which is causing this.  Upon
>  re-reading that post, you'll see that my purpose in posting was to
>  see if any of you could suggest the kinds of things that might appear
>  in my setup which could control this behavior, since I haven't found
>  anything obvious, myself.
>  
>  As for the case where it might be a bug, I've been planing to do some
>  serious investigation/debugging as soon as I have some time.

In fact it is your latest solution to track out what is going on with
this ;) Good luck in this optic :)

zeDek
-- 
 alt.luser.recovery         Getting over the trauma of using computers.

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Solved! (was: Looking for the variable that controls newsgroup scanning)

[Lloyd Zusman]

Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:

> I'm making use of several nnimap groups, each of which being defined
> within `gnus-secondary-select-methods'.  As far as I can tell, each one
> is defined identically, the only difference being their names.
>
> However, only the first of these three gets updated during
> `gnus-group-get-new-news'.  I need to enter the other two and
> specifically invoke `gnus-summary-rescan-group' in order for them to
> notice any new mail that might have arrived.
>
> I suspect that ages ago, I might have set some sort of variable which
> prevents all but the first nnimap group from being scanned during
> `gnus-group-get-new-news', but I can't for the life of me recall what I
> might have done, nor have I been able to find anything within my setup
> that seems to affect this behavior.
>
> Could any of you suggest some possible variables or settings that might
> control this?

I found it: I need to set `nnimap-need-unselect-to-notice-new-mail' in
the select methods for each of my nnimap servers.  It doesn't seem to be
needed with a single nnimap server, but it has to be there for the sake
of the 2nd through nth servers.  I put it on all three select methods,
although perhaps it isn't needed on the first one.  But it doesn't seem
to hurt being there, so I'll leave it.

I'm using Courier IMAP, which the documentation states is a server that
probably needs this setting.

Thanks to all for your help when I was trying to diagnose this.

-- 
 Lloyd Zusman
 ljz@asfast.com

Re: Solved!

[Simon Josefsson]

Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:

> I'm using Courier IMAP, which the documentation states is a server that
> probably needs this setting.

Just for reference, which version of Courier IMAP is this?  Look at
the first line it writes when you telnet to the IMAP server port.

Re: Solved!

[Lloyd Zusman]

Simon Josefsson <jas@extundo.com> writes:

> Lloyd Zusman <ljz@asfast.com> writes:
>
>> I'm using Courier IMAP, which the documentation states is a server
>> that probably needs this setting.
>
> Just for reference, which version of Courier IMAP is this?  Look at
> the first line it writes when you telnet to the IMAP server port.

I'm using the IMAP that comes with the latest release of Courier MTA,
the one named "courier-0.42.2.20030721".  This is the entire IMAP
welcome message:

* OK [CAPABILITY IMAP4rev1 UIDPLUS CHILDREN NAMESPACE
  THREAD=ORDEREDSUBJECT THREAD=REFERENCES SORT QUOTA IDLE STARTTLS]
  Courier-IMAP ready. Copyright 1998-2003 Double Precision, Inc.  See
  COPYING for distribution information.


-- 
 Lloyd Zusman
 ljz@asfast.com