Problem with lost marks

Problem with lost marks

[Niklas Morberg]

Using a CVS gnus from last week I loose marks so often that
it is annoying, but not often enough to be reproducible...

It seems like I loose expireable marks, but things
concerning readedness is still there. The unseen mark also
shows up. I might not be making much sense, so here is an
example:

In an nnimap group some messages are read, some are unread
and some are ticked. I mark some as expireable and exit the
group. If I immediately enter the group again, all is well,
but sooner or later something[1] happens that makes all
messages be marked as unseen and the messages previously
marked as expireable are now only marked as read. The read,
unread and ticked messages have the correct marks (but the
additional incorrect unseen mark).

Is this happening to anybody else? What can I do to try to
shed more light on the problem in order to solve it?

Niklas

Footnotes: 
[1]  I really don't know what this is; it could be passage
     of time, entering and exiting other groups, catching up
     in another group or something else...

Re: Problem with lost marks

[Kai Großjohann]

Niklas Morberg <niklas.morberg@axis.com> writes:

> Using a CVS gnus from last week I loose marks so often that
> it is annoying, but not often enough to be reproducible...

I also lose E marks, and it happens when I apply some E marks and
also move messages out of the group.  Then reentering the group loses
the E marks.

I think is only applies to nnimap, though, not to nnml.

kai
-- 
~/.signature is: umop 3p!sdn    (Frank Nobis)

Re: Problem with lost marks

[Kai Großjohann]

grossjoh@lothlorien.cs.uni-dortmund.de (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> I also lose E marks, and it happens when I apply some E marks and
> also move messages out of the group.  Then reentering the group loses
> the E marks.

I just tried to reproduce it, and it works.  I had an empty group
nnimap:INBOX.  I created a message:

    Newsgroups: INBOX
    Subject: test

and posted it to that group.  I created another message:

    Newsgroups: INBOX
    Subject: test 2

I entered the group, seeing these two articles.  I marked `E' the
first message and used `B m nnml:inbox RET' on the second one.  Then
I used `q' to quit the nnimap:INBOX group.  Then I re-entered the
group.

There should be the "test" message marked `E', but the `E' mark was
gone.

Could those of you using nnimap try this simple sequence of commands
and tell me if you see the same thing?  It could be that this happens
only for nnimap:INBOX, but I'm not sure.  (The group does not have to
be empty for you to try it -- the important part is that you mark a
message `E' and move another, then quit and reenter the group.)

kai
-- 
~/.signature is: umop 3p!sdn    (Frank Nobis)

Re: Problem with lost marks

[Niklas Morberg]

grossjoh@lothlorien.cs.uni-dortmund.de (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> Could those of you using nnimap try this simple sequence of commands
> and tell me if you see the same thing?  

Sorry, no. Marks are lost when moving messages, but not as
predictably as you describe it (at least not when I do it in
my "live" mailboxes with more than two messages).

> It could be that this happens only for nnimap:INBOX, but
> I'm not sure.

I see problems in other folders as well.

I probably won't have time to find a reproducible error case
on my machine during this week, but hopefully during the
next.

Niklas

Re: Problem with lost marks

[Kai Großjohann]

Niklas Morberg <niklas.morberg@axis.com> writes:

> grossjoh@lothlorien.cs.uni-dortmund.de (Kai Großjohann) writes:
>
>> Could those of you using nnimap try this simple sequence of commands
>> and tell me if you see the same thing?  
>
> Sorry, no. Marks are lost when moving messages, but not as
> predictably as you describe it (at least not when I do it in
> my "live" mailboxes with more than two messages).

Hm.  It happens for me every time.  (At least in nnimap:INBOX, I'm
not so sure about the other groups.)

kai
-- 
~/.signature is: umop 3p!sdn    (Frank Nobis)

Re: Problem with lost marks

[Niklas Morberg]

grossjoh@lothlorien.cs.uni-dortmund.de (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> Hm. It happens for me every time. (At least in nnimap:INBOX,
> I'm not so sure about the other groups.)

For me it only seems to happen if the messages are unseen.

If I have two unseen messages, mark one as E and move the
other one, exit and enter the group, then the E mark is
lost.

If I do the same thing with two seen messages, I can't
repeat this behaviour...

Hm. Hang on, I'll do some more permutations of this...

Ok. I give up. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't,
I can't find a pattern... Sorry.

Niklas

Re: Problem with lost marks

[Kai Großjohann]

Niklas Morberg <niklas.morberg@axis.com> writes:

> grossjoh@lothlorien.cs.uni-dortmund.de (Kai Großjohann) writes:
>
>> Hm. It happens for me every time. (At least in nnimap:INBOX,
>> I'm not so sure about the other groups.)
>
> For me it only seems to happen if the messages are unseen.

Right.  Me, too.

kai
-- 
~/.signature is: umop 3p!sdn    (Frank Nobis)

Re: Problem with lost marks

[Danny Siu]

My experience with IMAP/Agent is similar to Niklas: I lost marks from time
to time and as far as I can recall, those marks would be gone if I moved
articles between my IMAP groups.  However, Kai's test didn't reproduce the
problem with SEEN or UNSEEN articles.

Niklas Morberg writes:

  Niklas> grossjoh@lothlorien.cs.uni-dortmund.de (Kai Großjohann) writes:
  >> Could those of you using nnimap try this simple sequence of commands
  >> and tell me if you see the same thing?

  Niklas> Sorry, no. Marks are lost when moving messages, but not as
  Niklas> predictably as you describe it (at least not when I do it in my
  Niklas> "live" mailboxes with more than two messages).

  >> It could be that this happens only for nnimap:INBOX, but I'm not sure.

  Niklas> I see problems in other folders as well.

-- 
Danny Siu

Re: Problem with lost marks

[Simon Josefsson]

Niklas Morberg <niklas.morberg@axis.com> writes:

> In an nnimap group some messages are read, some are unread
> and some are ticked. I mark some as expireable and exit the
> group. If I immediately enter the group again, all is well,
> but sooner or later something[1] happens that makes all
> messages be marked as unseen and the messages previously
> marked as expireable are now only marked as read. The read,
> unread and ticked messages have the correct marks (but the
> additional incorrect unseen mark).
>
> Is this happening to anybody else? What can I do to try to
> shed more light on the problem in order to solve it?

I think I'm seeing this too, but only sometimes.  When it has happened
in a reproducable way, it always went away when I tried to edebug it.

Try to remember if you were moving or copying articles across
mailboxes when it happened, I think there is a bug in that code.  I
rarely copy or move articles though, and still think I'm seeing this
sometimes.

Re: Problem with lost marks

[Robert Epprecht]

Simon Josefsson <jas@extundo.com> writes:

> Try to remember if you were moving or copying articles across
> mailboxes when it happened, I think there is a bug in that code.

I'm not clear what exactly you mean when you say 'mailbox' here.
I *did* move, ( and maybe copy or even delete ) messages between
different mmnl groups before I lost all my marks in a nnml group. 
(It is not clear, if the peculiar group was involved or not).

> I rarely copy or move articles though, and still think I'm seeing
> this sometimes.

I do move messages quite often.

I lost all kinds of marks including dormant and ticked.

Robert Epprecht

Re: Problem with lost marks

[Wes Hardaker]

>>>>> On Mon, 23 Sep 2002 12:34:09 +0200, Simon Josefsson <jas@extundo.com> said:

Simon> I think I'm seeing this too, but only sometimes.  When it has
Simon> happened in a reproducable way, it always went away when I
Simon> tried to edebug it.

Simon> Try to remember if you were moving or copying articles across
Simon> mailboxes when it happened, I think there is a bug in that
Simon> code.  I rarely copy or move articles though, and still think
Simon> I'm seeing this sometimes.

I'd be very suspicious that it might have to do with agent/imap
interactions with article and flag caching.  I've always had nasty and
similar problems trying to read imap folders off-line that are almost
identical to what is being described.

-- 
"The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will
 insist on coming along and trying to put things in it."   -- Terry Pratchett

Re: Problem with lost marks

[Christoph Rohland]

Hi Simon,

On Mon, 23 Sep 2002, Simon Josefsson wrote:
> I think I'm seeing this too, but only sometimes.  When it has
> happened in a reproducable way, it always went away when I tried to
> edebug it.

I see it regularly with my agentized imap Inbox and the exirable mark
in ognus 0.0.7.

Greetings
		Christoph

Re: Problem with lost marks

[Robert Epprecht]

Niklas Morberg <niklas.morberg@axis.com> writes:

> Using a CVS gnus from last week I loose marks so often that
> it is annoying, but not often enough to be reproducible...

> Is this happening to anybody else?

Yes, I have lost *all* marks in a nnml group.
It is a high traffic mailing list with a lot of dormant, ticked
and whatever marks. Quite annoing to have lost then all.
No idea why, I did not do anything special.

> What can I do to try to shed more light on the problem in order
> to solve it?

Somebody?

Robert Epprecht