nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Pedro Kröger]

Hi,

I use offlineimap to get my email from a  gmail account. It downloads
it to ~/Maildir (for instance, the directory ~/Maildir/inbox is a
proper maildir directory). I have the following setup in my .gnus: (no
mail-sources)

(setq gnus-select-method '(nnnil))

(setq gnus-secondary-select-methods
      '((nnmaildir ""
         (directory "~/Maildir")
         (directory-files nnheader-directory-files-safe)
         (expire-age never)
         (get-new-mail t))))

and it works fine (gnus can read the groups at ~/Maildir). But if I
update the mail folders with offlineimap and type g at the group
buffer (gnus-group-get-new-news), gnus doesn't show the new emails.
The manual says it should re-scan the directory:

    The directory is scanned when you first start Gnus, and
    each time you type `g' in the group buffer; if any maildirs
    have been removed or added, `nnmaildir' notices at these
    times.

Am I missing something?

Pedro

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Richard Riley]

Pedro Kröger <pedro.kroger@gmail.com> writes:

> Hi,
>
> I use offlineimap to get my email from a  gmail account. It downloads
> it to ~/Maildir (for instance, the directory ~/Maildir/inbox is a
> proper maildir directory). I have the following setup in my .gnus: (no
> mail-sources)
>
> (setq gnus-select-method '(nnnil))
>
> (setq gnus-secondary-select-methods
>       '((nnmaildir ""
>          (directory "~/Maildir")
>          (directory-files nnheader-directory-files-safe)
>          (expire-age never)
>          (get-new-mail t))))
>
> and it works fine (gnus can read the groups at ~/Maildir). But if I
> update the mail folders with offlineimap and type g at the group
> buffer (gnus-group-get-new-news), gnus doesn't show the new emails.
> The manual says it should re-scan the directory:
>
>     The directory is scanned when you first start Gnus, and
>     each time you type `g' in the group buffer; if any maildirs
>     have been removed or added, `nnmaildir' notices at these
>     times.
>
> Am I missing something?
>
> Pedro

One (possibly unrelated) thing to be aware of is that Maildir
directories (at least for dovecot) need to start with a period "."

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Pedro Kröger]

On Nov 4, 1:31 pm, Richard Riley <rileyrg...@gmail.com> wrote:

> One (possibly unrelated) thing to be aware of is that Maildir
> directories (at least for dovecot) need to start with a period "."

that doesn't seem to be the case if offlineimap+gmail (it works fine)
and it is not the case with gnus (it ignores directories starting with
a period).

pedro

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Ted Zlatanov]

On Tue, 4 Nov 2008 08:43:02 -0800 (PST) Pedro Kröger <pedro.kroger@gmail.com> wrote: 

PK> On Nov 4, 1:31 pm, Richard Riley <rileyrg...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> One (possibly unrelated) thing to be aware of is that Maildir
>> directories (at least for dovecot) need to start with a period "."

PK> that doesn't seem to be the case if offlineimap+gmail (it works fine)
PK> and it is not the case with gnus (it ignores directories starting with
PK> a period).

IIUC you expect $MAILDIR/inbox to work as a folder.

Folders are a Maildir++ extension, whose spec is here:
http://www.inter7.com/courierimap/README.maildirquota.html

According to that spec, folder names must start with a period:

'Folders are created as subdirectories under the main Maildir. The name
of the subdirectory always starts with a period. For example, a folder
named "Important" will be a subdirectory called ".Important". You can't
have subdirectories that start with two periods.'

I don't know if there are extensions to this standard, but this is
pretty definitive so I don't think it's a Gnus bug.

Ted

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Richard Riley]

Pedro Kröger <pedro.kroger@gmail.com> writes:

> On Nov 4, 1:31 pm, Richard Riley <rileyrg...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> One (possibly unrelated) thing to be aware of is that Maildir
>> directories (at least for dovecot) need to start with a period "."
>
> that doesn't seem to be the case if offlineimap+gmail (it works fine)
> and it is not the case with gnus (it ignores directories starting with
> a period).
>
> pedro

I am surprised. I was under the impression that the official format for
maildir was to start with a period. They certainly are in my
getmail/procmail/dovecot setup.

e.g 

Maildir
 /.inbox
  /cur
  /new
  /temp

regards

richard.

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Pedro Kröger]

On Nov 4, 1:58 pm, Ted Zlatanov <t...@lifelogs.com> wrote:
> I don't know if there are extensions to this standard, but this is
> pretty definitive so I don't think it's a Gnus bug.

So, why gnus ignore directories that start with periods? (from the
manual) and gnus dont have a problem reading the directories I have,
the only problem is to re-read the list of emails. in fact the only
way to update the email list is to re-start emacs.

pedro

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Teemu Likonen]

Pedro Kröger (2008-11-04 08:28 -0800) wrote:

> I use offlineimap to get my email from a gmail account. It downloads
> it to ~/Maildir (for instance, the directory ~/Maildir/inbox is a
> proper maildir directory).

I have very setting: I use "fetchmail" to fetch mail from three
different accounts and then "procmail" automatically divides the mail to
different Maildir directories under ~/Maildir. The last rule in my
~/.procmailrc happens to be

    :0
    inbox/

So all my mails get delivered somewhere under ~/Maildir.

> I have the following setup in my .gnus: (no
> mail-sources)
>
> (setq gnus-select-method '(nnnil))
>
> (setq gnus-secondary-select-methods
>       '((nnmaildir ""
>          (directory "~/Maildir")
>          (directory-files nnheader-directory-files-safe)
>          (expire-age never)
>          (get-new-mail t))))

I don't know why but for some reason I need to have "nnml" method too
even though I don't actually use it. With that the mail system works. I
use customize system for configuration but basically my
gnus-secondary-select-methods is just this:

    '((nnml "")
      (nnmaildir ""
                 (directory "~/Maildir")))

> Am I missing something?

I don't know but I think it's quite easy to miss many things with Gnus
configuration. :-)

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Teemu Likonen]

Teemu Likonen (2008-11-04 17:53 +0000) wrote:

> I have very setting: I use "fetchmail" to fetch mail from three
             ^
             "similar"

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Ted Zlatanov]

On Tue, 4 Nov 2008 09:05:42 -0800 (PST) Pedro Kröger <pedro.kroger@gmail.com> wrote: 

PK> On Nov 4, 1:58 pm, Ted Zlatanov <t...@lifelogs.com> wrote:
>> I don't know if there are extensions to this standard, but this is
>> pretty definitive so I don't think it's a Gnus bug.

PK> So, why gnus ignore directories that start with periods? (from the
PK> manual) and gnus dont have a problem reading the directories I have,
PK> the only problem is to re-read the list of emails. in fact the only
PK> way to update the email list is to re-start emacs.

I don't know.  So you have mails like this:

~/Maildir -> top level
~/Maildir/inbox -> fetched mail

And Gnus, using nnmaildir, is not refreshing the list of articles in the
inbox?

I have a very similar setup and it works fine, without offlineimap.
Could offlineimap be doing something to the article flags or moving them
around that would confuse Gnus?

As far as the directory/folder names, I guess Gnus is not conformant
with the Maildir++ format.  I didn't realize that earlier, sorry, but I
see the problem now.  I don't know how to fix it, though it seems like a
simple matter of accepting directory names that start with a period
except for ".nnmaildir".

Since nnmaildir accepts symlinks, you could just link every folder name
from .ABC to ABC after running offlineimap.  That might be a good
compromise.

Ted

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Pedro Kröger]

On Nov 4, 6:07 pm, Ted Zlatanov <t...@lifelogs.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 4 Nov 2008 09:05:42 -0800 (PST) Pedro Kröger <pedro.kro...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> PK> On Nov 4, 1:58 pm, Ted Zlatanov <t...@lifelogs.com> wrote:
>
> >> I don't know if there are extensions to this standard, but this is
> >> pretty definitive so I don't think it's a Gnus bug.
>
> PK> So, why gnus ignore directories that start with periods? (from the
> PK> manual) and gnus dont have a problem reading the directories I have,
> PK> the only problem is to re-read the list of emails. in fact the only
> PK> way to update the email list is to re-start emacs.
>
> I don't know.  So you have mails like this:
>
> ~/Maildir -> top level
> ~/Maildir/inbox -> fetched mail
>
> And Gnus, using nnmaildir, is not refreshing the list of articles in the
> inbox?

yes, that's what I have. I discovered now that gnus *is* refreshing
the list of articles, but there is a delay. that is, if I just
finished syncing with offlineimap, gnus will refresh the list of
articles after some time (say, 30 seconds). I don't have any idea why
the delay, thought.

Pedro

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Ted Zlatanov]

On Tue, 4 Nov 2008 13:55:14 -0800 (PST) Pedro Kröger <pedro.kroger@gmail.com> wrote: 

PK> On Nov 4, 6:07 pm, Ted Zlatanov <t...@lifelogs.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 4 Nov 2008 09:05:42 -0800 (PST) Pedro Kröger <pedro.kro...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
PK> On Nov 4, 1:58 pm, Ted Zlatanov <t...@lifelogs.com> wrote:
>> 
>> >> I don't know if there are extensions to this standard, but this is
>> >> pretty definitive so I don't think it's a Gnus bug.
>> 
PK> So, why gnus ignore directories that start with periods? (from the
PK> manual) and gnus dont have a problem reading the directories I have,
PK> the only problem is to re-read the list of emails. in fact the only
PK> way to update the email list is to re-start emacs.
>> 
>> I don't know.  So you have mails like this:
>> 
>> ~/Maildir -> top level
>> ~/Maildir/inbox -> fetched mail
>> 
>> And Gnus, using nnmaildir, is not refreshing the list of articles in the
>> inbox?

PK> yes, that's what I have. I discovered now that gnus *is* refreshing
PK> the list of articles, but there is a delay. that is, if I just
PK> finished syncing with offlineimap, gnus will refresh the list of
PK> articles after some time (say, 30 seconds). I don't have any idea why
PK> the delay, thought.

You mean Gnus won't notice the changes for 30 seconds?  That seems odd.
I hope someone that knows nnmaildir can explain what's happening...  I
looked at the code briefly and it seems that nnmaildir--scan is the
important function, but it's pretty tightly written and not easy to
understand at a glance.

Ted

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Pedro Kröger]

On Nov 4, 8:21 pm, Ted Zlatanov <t...@lifelogs.com> wrote:

> You mean Gnus won't notice the changes for 30 seconds?

that's what I thought, but I was wrong. the problem is that gnus is
not reading the files in the 'new' directory. the emails only show up
in the group buffer when the email is moved to 'cur'. I thought there
was a delay because I checked a directory with mutt and it moved the
files from new to cur. any ideas of what it can be? to sumarize:

I download emails with offlineimap and new emails go to directories
like ~/Maildir/inbox/new/ but gnus only notice them when they are
moved to the cur directory. (gnus is not moving then from new to cur)

pedro

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Pedro Kröger]

On Nov 4, 8:21 pm, Ted Zlatanov <t...@lifelogs.com> wrote:

> You mean Gnus won't notice the changes for 30 seconds?  That seems odd.
> I hope someone that knows nnmaildir can explain what's happening...  I
> looked at the code briefly and it seems that nnmaildir--scan is the
> important function, but it's pretty tightly written and not easy to
> understand at a glance.

I discovered the problem (but not the solution): gnus is not reading
emails that are in the 'new' directory. only when they are moved to
the 'cur' directory gnus will show then in the group buffer. And gnus
itself is not moving files from new to cur. I used mutt to check if
things where working and it moved the files to cur.

any idea why this is happening?

Pedro

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Ted Zlatanov]

On Wed, 5 Nov 2008 06:36:58 -0800 (PST) Pedro Kröger <pedro.kroger@gmail.com> wrote: 

PK> that's what I thought, but I was wrong. the problem is that gnus is
PK> not reading the files in the 'new' directory. the emails only show up
PK> in the group buffer when the email is moved to 'cur'. I thought there
PK> was a delay because I checked a directory with mutt and it moved the
PK> files from new to cur. any ideas of what it can be? to sumarize:

PK> I download emails with offlineimap and new emails go to directories
PK> like ~/Maildir/inbox/new/ but gnus only notice them when they are
PK> moved to the cur directory. (gnus is not moving then from new to cur)

Check if mutt will work right after the offlineimap run, in case there's
a system timer somewhere or offlineimap is keeping the files locked.

Otherwise, I have no idea.

Ted

Re: nnmaildir don't get new email with gnus-group-get-new-news

[Pedro Kröger]

On Nov 5, 1:14 pm, Ted Zlatanov <t...@lifelogs.com> wrote:

> Check if mutt will work right after the offlineimap run, in case there's
> a system timer somewhere or offlineimap is keeping the files locked.

yes, mutt works fine.

pedro