From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Msuck: nntp://news.gmane.io/gmane.emacs.gnus.user/18639 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Harry Putnam Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.gnus.user Subject: Re: how can I keep gnus from Hiding All Threads when open a group Date: Sat, 17 Jun 2017 14:24:44 -0400 Organization: Still searching... Message-ID: <86y3sq8ob7.fsf@local.lan> References: <87tw3xrabh.fsf@ericabrahamsen.net> <8660gdgegb.fsf@local.lan> <871sr0v8qt.fsf@ericabrahamsen.net> <87fuez2y6k.fsf@ericabrahamsen.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1497723903 22684 195.159.176.226 (17 Jun 2017 18:25:03 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 17 Jun 2017 18:25:03 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.4 (gnu/linux) To: info-gnus-english@gnu.org Original-X-From: info-gnus-english-bounces+gegu-info-gnus-english=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jun 17 20:24:58 2017 Return-path: Envelope-to: gegu-info-gnus-english@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1dMIP4-0005cZ-6A for gegu-info-gnus-english@m.gmane.org; Sat, 17 Jun 2017 20:24:58 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:35933 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dMIP9-0004NB-GI for gegu-info-gnus-english@m.gmane.org; Sat, 17 Jun 2017 14:25:03 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:41256) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dMIP3-0004N6-2t for info-gnus-english@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Jun 2017 14:24:58 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dMIOz-0004pD-VE for info-gnus-english@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Jun 2017 14:24:57 -0400 Original-Received: from [195.159.176.226] (port=49548 helo=blaine.gmane.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dMIOz-0004oh-Nr for info-gnus-english@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Jun 2017 14:24:53 -0400 Original-Received: from list by blaine.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1dMIOr-0004vv-Op for info-gnus-english@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Jun 2017 20:24:45 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 142 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org Cancel-Lock: sha1:n7ACSH9dkKlCgUr58OrT2ytAMN8= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 195.159.176.226 X-BeenThere: info-gnus-english@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Announcements and discussions for GNUS, the GNU Emacs Usenet newsreader \(in English\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: info-gnus-english-bounces+gegu-info-gnus-english=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "info-gnus-english" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.gnus.user:18639 Archived-At: Eric Abrahamsen writes: > Harry Putnam writes: > > [...] > >>> No matter what, I think the main recommendation would be to try to open >>> group buffers with fewer messages! Is it really necessary to display >>> tens of thousands of messages each time? > > [...] > >> (The effort to acquire postings is preparatory to try to learn how to >> use the new search possibilities that yourself, Andrew C and others >> have been working on currently as noted in several continuing threads >> on `gmane.emacs.gnus.general') >> >> The problem is that if I asked gnus to just download whatever is on >> the gmane or enews.newsguy.com spools for a group..., in the most >> interesting ones there may be several hundred thousand msgs going back >> to early 2000, in some cases I've gotten clear into the late 90s. >> >> So I set about acquiring around 50,000 or so where possible. Ended up >> with 8 grps or so, but most are between 10 and 40 thousand with a few >> above 70,000. >> >> Hence the spate of time spent opening many many headers to be able to >> mark and download 50,000 or so in bunches of 5,000 or so, and over >> time, so as not to get blackballed off gmane for abusive downloading. >> >> Maybe some kind of trickery with agent categories could have made this >> a bit or even a lot easier... I just set the predicate to `true' on >> all agentized groups and did the downloading manually >> >> I have 38 groups agentized over three servers .. quite minor league >> compared to a real news spool... >> >> I ended up with 1,033,195 posts but now only have to keep up with what >> is newly posted. > > Yeesh... At this point it might make more sense just to install your own > local LeafNode server and do nntp yourself, don't you think? Yes, my thoughts exactly... I was just studying up on slrnpull. Something I used a bit long ago... never really fiddled with leafnode.. maybe its a little simpler? The stumbling block with either is probably how to slurp the database gnus has already generated. But also, how would I fit news pulled that way, into the search features being coded in gnus lately? > I'm sorry I can't speak to your specific questions about the agent -- I > only use the agent with my gmane backend (all the other backends are > local), and there I just agentize the whole server, I haven't tried > anything finer-grained than that. I'm sorry to be bending your ear so extensively but not getting much input on ... gnus.user Perhaps if you knew the depths of my ignorance you might know you probably can fill in a few things. Do you know if there is supposed to be (in orginal intent) a difference between having groups under an agentized server... and having not just the server agentized but also specific groups agentized under that server as well? I do know that the list of agentized groups (by category) in News/agent/lib/categories does not appear to include any of my gmane groups that have not been agentized, even though the gmane server is agentized. Not sure one could even use a category if the group itself was not agentized. For example... With the server agentized... Do you use either `J s' (gnus-agent-fetch-session) (Fetch all articles and headers that are eligible for fetching) OR `J u (gnus-agent-fetch-groups N) (Put all new articles in the current groups into the Agent) in group buffer, after a scan for new news, to download the new messages? The `J u' doc string is pretty easy to understand ... all NEW msgs in CURRENT group But for some reason Larsi (who writes really good documentation) or someone else felt it was necessary to use a slightly different description for `J s' 'articles and headers that are eligible for fetching' I'm guessing the description uses different language because the action is different in some way... That is, not just `New' msgs but maybe something more inclusive. Maybe something like all un-downloaded msgs that conform to a specific category, which might be something of a disaster in groups with well over 100.000 msgs that have not been downloaded yet. I ask because the times I tried `J s' or `J u' (Even on just the current group) it produces a massive lengthy read of something.. I'm not sure if the visible count being shown is characters or lines but it gets up to over 120,000 eventually but I've never let it finish... I was afraid it was trying to start from the very oldest posts on the gmane spool and start downloading from there. Which might be a good way to loose access to the new gmane. I'd like to know what is being read in that case above? You say, you do nothing finer grained with the agent than an agentized server.. so do you mean that you download all groups you have subscribed to on that server? Unless you only subscribe to a few groups, that seems like it would become a very lot of messages at some point. How do you handle the downloading? In terms of cmds used? Do you do batching to keep up with new posts and actually go unplugged at times? I noticed in my one attempt (recently) at using the batch command shown in the manual: You can run a complete batch command from the command line with the following incantation: #!/bin/sh emacs -batch -l ~/.emacs -l ~/.gnus.el -f gnus-agent-batch >/dev/null 2>&1 that gnus started downloading from groups under an agentized server that were not themselves agentized as well as groups that were. I ask all this because it is really time consuming and somewhat difficult to set up real experimenting to discover the basic actions one should expect when using the agent.