Spam quation : procmail v spam.el using spamassassin.

Spam quation : procmail v spam.el using spamassassin.

[Hadron Quark]

Since procmail settings are causing my mail to be "split" into spam
folders (nnmaildir) after processing by spamassassin, would the split
functons in spam.el have any purpose?

I'm really going around in circles trying to figure out the best way of
configuring spamassassin with procmail and then gnus. Any help greatly
appreciated.

-- 

Re: Spam quation : procmail v spam.el using spamassassin.

[Ted Zlatanov]

On 19 Jun 2006, hadronquark@gmail.com wrote:

> Since procmail settings are causing my mail to be "split" into spam
> folders (nnmaildir) after processing by spamassassin, would the split
> functons in spam.el have any purpose?

Sure.  You could apply additional filters to the SA run.

> I'm really going around in circles trying to figure out the best way of
> configuring spamassassin with procmail and then gnus. Any help greatly
> appreciated.

The delivery for that setup should be:

incoming mail
to
procmail
to
SA
to
nnmaildir
to
spam.el (if you want) for extra splitting

Then the read cycle would be

1)

enter SPAM group
(all unread messages are spam by default)
mark any messages as ham
exit SPAM group
(spam and ham processing and destinations are applied here)

2)

enter non-SPAM group
(same as above, except unread messages are not spam by default, so you
mark messages as spam manually)

So the setup consists of:

a) set up SPAM and non-SPAM groups (this is done with `G c' or `G p'
or gnus-parameters)
b) set up spam and ham processing (these are functions to be run on
spam and ham, e.g. sa-learn for SA), if wanted
c) set up spam and ham destinations (for spam/ham messages on group
exit), if wanted

I personally prefer destinations to processing, because I have a slow
IMAP server so it's faster to move messages and then batch-process
them, but it's up to you.

I hope that helps.  More introductory information can be found at
http://lifelogs.com/spam and in the Gnus manual.

Ted

Re: Spam quation : procmail v spam.el using spamassassin.

[Hadron Quark]

Ted Zlatanov <tzz@lifelogs.com> writes:

> On 19 Jun 2006, hadronquark@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Since procmail settings are causing my mail to be "split" into spam
>> folders (nnmaildir) after processing by spamassassin, would the split
>> functons in spam.el have any purpose?
>
> Sure.  You could apply additional filters to the SA run.
>
>> I'm really going around in circles trying to figure out the best way of
>> configuring spamassassin with procmail and then gnus. Any help greatly
>> appreciated.
>
> The delivery for that setup should be:
>
> incoming mail
> to
> procmail
> to
> SA
> to
> nnmaildir
> to
> spam.el (if you want) for extra splitting
>
> Then the read cycle would be
>
> 1)
>
> enter SPAM group
> (all unread messages are spam by default)
> mark any messages as ham
> exit SPAM group
> (spam and ham processing and destinations are applied here)
>
> 2)
>
> enter non-SPAM group
> (same as above, except unread messages are not spam by default, so you
> mark messages as spam manually)
>
> So the setup consists of:
>
> a) set up SPAM and non-SPAM groups (this is done with `G c' or `G p'
> or gnus-parameters)
> b) set up spam and ham processing (these are functions to be run on
> spam and ham, e.g. sa-learn for SA), if wanted
> c) set up spam and ham destinations (for spam/ham messages on group
> exit), if wanted
>
> I personally prefer destinations to processing, because I have a slow
> IMAP server so it's faster to move messages and then batch-process
> them, but it's up to you.
>
> I hope that helps.  More introductory information can be found at
> http://lifelogs.com/spam and in the Gnus manual.
>
> Ted

It is a help : if only to calm me down and think more logically -
sometimes it can all be a bit confusing :( Especially with this new
default spam process which has replaced spamassassin - it wasnt
immediately clear to me wither this spam.el was compatible with
spamassassins x-headers etc etc.

Maybe one last answer (which may or may not be in manuals) : I use
posting styles to maintain different email folders - is it trivial (before I
start wasting time trying) to configure spam.el to move the "mark as NOT
spam" to the correct procmail populated maildirs in gnus?

Thanks again for taking the time to reply.

Re: Spam quation : procmail v spam.el using spamassassin.

[Ted Zlatanov]

On 19 Jun 2006, hadronquark@gmail.com wrote:

> It is a help : if only to calm me down and think more logically -
> sometimes it can all be a bit confusing :( Especially with this new
> default spam process which has replaced spamassassin - it wasnt
> immediately clear to me wither this spam.el was compatible with
> spamassassins x-headers etc etc.

It's meant to be general (with SA support among others), and the
manual tries to explain that.  Did you find the manual section about
spam.el hard to follow?  If so, it would be helpful if you pointed out
problems or gave us suggestions so we can improve it.

> Maybe one last answer (which may or may not be in manuals) : I use
> posting styles to maintain different email folders - is it trivial (before I
> start wasting time trying) to configure spam.el to move the "mark as NOT
> spam" to the correct procmail populated maildirs in gnus?

[ ham == NOT spam ]

You can move ham articles automatically out of spam groups.  You need
to classify that group as a spam group with `G c' and the rest is
automatic.

There can be multiple ham destinations per group.  When you exit the
group, ham messages will be copied or moved to the ham destinations
(moved to the last one and copied to all the others) and processed
with the ham processors you've defined (none by default).

You can also define a ham destination of nil (leave in place) or
'respool (send back to the split-fancy process).  All of this can be
customized with `G c'.

Ted

Re: Spam quation : procmail v spam.el using spamassassin.

[Hadron Quark]

Ted Zlatanov <tzz@lifelogs.com> writes:

> On 19 Jun 2006, hadronquark@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> It is a help : if only to calm me down and think more logically -
>> sometimes it can all be a bit confusing :( Especially with this new
>> default spam process which has replaced spamassassin - it wasnt
>> immediately clear to me wither this spam.el was compatible with
>> spamassassins x-headers etc etc.
>
> It's meant to be general (with SA support among others), and the
> manual tries to explain that.  Did you find the manual section about
> spam.el hard to follow?  If so, it would be helpful if you pointed out
> problems or gave us suggestions so we can improve it.
>
>> Maybe one last answer (which may or may not be in manuals) : I use
>> posting styles to maintain different email folders - is it trivial (before I
>> start wasting time trying) to configure spam.el to move the "mark as NOT
>> spam" to the correct procmail populated maildirs in gnus?
>
> [ ham == NOT spam ]
>
> You can move ham articles automatically out of spam groups.  You need
> to classify that group as a spam group with `G c' and the rest is
> automatic.

Unfortunately, G c brings up a emacs customization page which doesnt
work : it doesnt repsond to any selections. I have no idea why as
everything else I run works fine.

>
> There can be multiple ham destinations per group.  When you exit the
> group, ham messages will be copied or moved to the ham destinations
> (moved to the last one and copied to all the others) and processed
> with the ham processors you've defined (none by default).
>
> You can also define a ham destination of nil (leave in place) or
> 'respool (send back to the split-fancy process).  All of this can be
> customized with `G c'.

Again thanks : if I can get to the bottom of why the Gc page doesnt work
I can proceed. If you have any hints, please let me know.

>
> Ted

-- 

Re: Spam quation : procmail v spam.el using spamassassin.

[Ted Zlatanov]

On 21 Jun 2006, hadronquark@gmail.com wrote:

> Unfortunately, G c brings up a emacs customization page which doesnt
> work : it doesnt repsond to any selections. I have no idea why as
> everything else I run works fine.

On the left, there should be a checkbox next to each configurable
entry.  You have to click that before you modify the entry itself, to
mark it as configured.  Then hit 'done' at the top.

`G c' is a front-end to `G p' (I'm oversimplifying, but it's mostly
true).  Hit `G p' after `G c' to see the actual parameters generated
by your configuration.

Ted

Re: Spam quation : procmail v spam.el using spamassassin.

[Hadron Quark]

Ted Zlatanov <tzz@lifelogs.com> writes:

> On 21 Jun 2006, hadronquark@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Unfortunately, G c brings up a emacs customization page which doesnt
>> work : it doesnt repsond to any selections. I have no idea why as
>> everything else I run works fine.
>
> On the left, there should be a checkbox next to each configurable
> entry.  You have to click that before you modify the entry itself, to
> mark it as configured.  Then hit 'done' at the top.

So it is different than other config screens such as cutstomize-group mail?

>
> `G c' is a front-end to `G p' (I'm oversimplifying, but it's mostly
> true).  Hit `G p' after `G c' to see the actual parameters generated
> by your configuration.

I am unable to alter any settings. Hitting "done" does nothing. Pressing
"q" does nothing. I get a page of settings when I hit G c alright but
they seem uneditable and G p does nothing too.

As an example, I am on a group in summary and hit G c. Up comes the
Group Pamaters for that group. First one is "Address" which has a check
box thingy (just a bullet point I think) on the left, but set or unset I
am unable to type into the Address edit field and emacs report that the
"widget here is not active".

from messages : "widget-overlay-inactive: The widget here is not active"

clicking on "more" or "done" does nothing.

G p on the group produces:
=============================
;;; Editing the group parameters for `gnu.emacs.gnus'.
;; Type `C-c C-c' after you've finished editing.

nil
=============================

if you have any ideas they would be much appreciated.

>
> Ted

Re: Spam quation : procmail v spam.el using spamassassin.

[Ted Zlatanov]

On 21 Jun 2006, hadronquark@gmail.com wrote:

> Ted Zlatanov <tzz@lifelogs.com> writes:
>
>> On 21 Jun 2006, hadronquark@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> Unfortunately, G c brings up a emacs customization page which doesnt
>>> work : it doesnt repsond to any selections. I have no idea why as
>>> everything else I run works fine.
>>
>> On the left, there should be a checkbox next to each configurable
>> entry.  You have to click that before you modify the entry itself, to
>> mark it as configured.  Then hit 'done' at the top.
>
> So it is different than other config screens such as
> cutstomize-group mail?

Yes, the `G c' interface is different although it uses the same
widgets in the end.

> I am unable to alter any settings. Hitting "done" does nothing. Pressing
> "q" does nothing. I get a page of settings when I hit G c alright but
> they seem uneditable and G p does nothing too.
>
> As an example, I am on a group in summary and hit G c. Up comes the
> Group Pamaters for that group. First one is "Address" which has a check
> box thingy (just a bullet point I think) on the left, but set or unset I
> am unable to type into the Address edit field and emacs report that the
> "widget here is not active".
>
> from messages : "widget-overlay-inactive: The widget here is not active"
>
> clicking on "more" or "done" does nothing.

I can't help you further here, because the customization buffer has
always worked for me and I don't know much about the code that
generates it.  Could you please do M-x gnus-bug and submit a bug
regarding this problem?

> G p on the group produces:
> =============================
> ;;; Editing the group parameters for `gnu.emacs.gnus'.
> ;; Type `C-c C-c' after you've finished editing.
>
> nil
> =============================

You can manually add parameters in the `G p' buffer.  For example, you
can say 

((ham-marks
  (gnus-ticked-mark))
 (ham-process-destination "nnimap+lifelogs.com:INBOX.mail" "nnimap+lifelogs.com:INBOX.trainham")
 (spam-process-destination . "nnimap+lifelogs.com:INBOX.train"))

This says that the ham-marks should be just the `!' mark, that ham
should go to two groups, and spam should go to one group.  All the
parameters can be customized this way.

An important one is to set up a group to be the spam group.  Try this:

(setq
 gnus-spam-newsgroup-contents '(("spam$"
 gnus-group-spam-classification-spam)))

This will make every group name that ends with "spam" a spam group.

Also, these may help (my preferred settings):

(setq
 spam-process-ham-in-nonham-groups t
 spam-move-spam-nonspam-groups-only nil
 spam-mark-only-unseen-as-spam t
 spam-mark-ham-unread-before-move-from-spam-group t)

You may not want these settings; for an explanation of each one, see
the manual or M-x customize-group spam

Hope this helps...
Ted

Re: Spam quation : procmail v spam.el using spamassassin.

[Leandro su janni]

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Hadron Quark <hadronquark@gmail.com> writes:


[...]

> I am unable to alter any settings. Hitting "done" does nothing. Pressing
> "q" does nothing. I get a page of settings when I hit G c alright but
> they seem uneditable and G p does nothing too.
>
> As an example, I am on a group in summary and hit G c. Up comes the
> Group Pamaters for that group. First one is "Address" which has a check
> box thingy (just a bullet point I think) on the left, but set or unset I
> am unable to type into the Address edit field and emacs report that the
> "widget here is not active".
>
> from messages : "widget-overlay-inactive: The widget here is not active"

[...]

This is an "old" bug I found: I did not find any solution. Only changing
emacs version brings away this bug.

You can find something in the archive of this group.

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