From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Msuck: nntp://news.gmane.io/gmane.emacs.gnus.user/11760 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Richard Riley Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.gnus.user Subject: Re: gnus and pine Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 16:27:02 +0100 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Message-ID: References: <85tz8z7kwq.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1229960458 25985 80.91.229.12 (22 Dec 2008 15:40:58 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 15:40:58 +0000 (UTC) To: info-gnus-english@gnu.org Original-X-From: info-gnus-english-bounces+gegu-info-gnus-english=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Dec 22 16:42:01 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: gegu-info-gnus-english@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1LEmub-0006Dq-Ll for gegu-info-gnus-english@m.gmane.org; Mon, 22 Dec 2008 16:41:41 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40913 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LEmtP-0006P3-1n for gegu-info-gnus-english@m.gmane.org; Mon, 22 Dec 2008 10:40:27 -0500 Original-Path: news.stanford.edu!headwall.stanford.edu!news.glorb.com!news2!multikabel.net!newsfeed20.multikabel.net!newsfeed.freenet.de!newsfeed0.kamp.net!newsfeed.kamp.net!news.motzarella.org!motzarella.org!rileyrgdev.motzarella.org!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.gnus Original-Lines: 44 Original-X-Trace: news.eternal-september.org U2FsdGVkX1/aw4RfgF82WSV5I992zb+JscIeuFhHf9VsASpRGTXl8ke16qdwjaT3LSeMfpXnvW/isqH3KGTkd1rqJzFzJwxb7rV8/m52FhRJWTLkByb2B+iqD66Spqn1tdb1GgemHV3yaPy6/FzU1Q== Original-X-Complaints-To: Please send complaints to abuse@motzarella.org with full headers Original-NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 15:28:55 +0000 (UTC) X-Auth-Sender: U2FsdGVkX1/UQEjnGngA+ttnlX0osenO80mmtgf9PNbvaeP7vbdQsg== Cancel-Lock: sha1:5US+YPxxRVskpeLSAhPs1aiNkSI= User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.60 (gnu/linux) Original-Xref: news.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.gnus:82019 X-BeenThere: info-gnus-english@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Announcements and discussions for GNUS, the GNU Emacs Usenet newsreader \(in English\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: info-gnus-english-bounces+gegu-info-gnus-english=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: info-gnus-english-bounces+gegu-info-gnus-english=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.gnus.user:11760 Archived-At: Xavier Maillard writes: > Richard Riley writes: > >>>> I would be interested to know if there are statistics about the gnus userbase. >>> >>> Gnus is popular but I am pretty comfident there are not that much >>> users. >> >> A few tens of thousands? And possibly diminishing as emacs loses share >> with the plethora of alternatives available unfortunately. > > Do you mean people leaving Emacs for a "modern" alternative or > people choosing an alternative without even knowing emacs exists > ? That's not the same: we can't loose something we never had ;) I think the more alternatives then the less chance of them even attempting to use Emacs which we, being the elite ....., know to be superior to all those alternatives :-; So we do indeed lose new adopters as a result of alternatives. (And I do care about Emacs maintaining a large user base since that guarantees continued support and expansion) I also know of people leaving emacs because its way behind in the IDE sense - Eclipse (for example) is much "better" (*) for project management, debugging, development for many people since it works out of the box. People need to share their setups and get the word out! http://richardriley.net/default/projects/emacs/dotprogramming (*) Better here being "ready to run" and meeting a core common need in addition to being infinitely customisable though Java. Things like "just working" context help, refactoring, debugging, rebuilding etc are there and ready. Compare that to emacs and the need to add compile commands, add hooks for devhelp, man pages etc and its quite obvious what is the easiest to set up even if it is not, ultimately, the most powerful solution. -- important and urgent problems of the technology of today are no longer the satisfactions of the primary needs or of archetypal wishes, but the reparation of the evils and damages by the technology of yesterday. ~Dennis Gabor, Innovations: Scientific, Technological and Social, 1970