Changes After Ubuntu Upgrade

Changes After Ubuntu Upgrade

[Kenneth Jacker]

I recently upgraded my office machine from Ubuntu Breezy to Dapper.

Though I can still read my mail and post, some things don't look right
and have even "broken".

Using the `V' command in the "*Group*" buffer displays:

   No Gnus v0.4

Is that right?


Looking in /usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/gnus/gnus.el I find:

   (defconst gnus-version-number "5.9.0"
     "Version number for this version of Gnus.")


I first noticed something "wasn't right" when I could no longer sort
my groups by unread articles using "gnus-group-sort-groups-by-unread".
Invoking this now does nothing ... :-(

Does anyone know what's going on?

Thanks,
-- 
Prof Kenneth H Jacker       khj@cs.appstate.edu
Computer Science Dept       www.cs.appstate.edu/~khj
Appalachian State Univ
Boone, NC  28608  USA        

Re: Changes After Ubuntu Upgrade

[Glyn Millington]

Kenneth Jacker <khj@be.cs.appstate.edu> writes:

> I recently upgraded my office machine from Ubuntu Breezy to Dapper.
>
> Though I can still read my mail and post, some things don't look right
> and have even "broken".
>
> Using the `V' command in the "*Group*" buffer displays:
>
>    No Gnus v0.4
>
> Is that right?
>
>
> Looking in /usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/gnus/gnus.el I find:
>
>    (defconst gnus-version-number "5.9.0"
>      "Version number for this version of Gnus.")
>
>
> I first noticed something "wasn't right" when I could no longer sort
> my groups by unread articles using "gnus-group-sort-groupsgnus-group-sort-groups-by-unread".
> Invoking this now does nothing ... :-(
>
> Does anyone know what's going on?

"User-Agent: Gnus/5.110004 (No Gnus v0.4) Emacs/21.4 (gnu/linux)" 

Yes - you have No Gnus v0.4 installed somewhere on your system.  That is
not, of itself, bad news :-) 

Ubuntu must install this somewhere for you, but I've no idea where, not
being an Ubuntu/Debian user. Distant memories of using Debian suggest
there may be a site-lisp directory somewhere .....  Try 'locate gnus' ?

Good luck ...
atb


Glyn

Re: Changes After Ubuntu Upgrade

[Reiner Steib]

On Tue, Jun 20 2006, Kenneth Jacker wrote:

> Using the `V' command in the "*Group*" buffer displays:
>
>    No Gnus v0.4
>
> Is that right?
>
> Looking in /usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/gnus/gnus.el I find:
>
>    (defconst gnus-version-number "5.9.0"
>      "Version number for this version of Gnus.")

Probably the latter is not used because you have a separate Gnus
package installed, cf. `M-x list-load-path-shadows RET'.

> I first noticed something "wasn't right" when I could no longer sort
> my groups by unread articles using "gnus-group-sort-groups-by-unread".
> Invoking this now does nothing ... :-(

I can reproduce this problem with current CVS trunk.  It doesn't
happen using the v5-10 (stable) branch.  (I don't have time to debug
this further ATM.  Anyone?)

Bye, Reiner.
-- 
       ,,,
      (o o)
---ooO-(_)-Ooo---  |  PGP key available  |  http://rsteib.home.pages.de/

Re: Changes After Ubuntu Upgrade

[Kenneth Jacker]

[ Warning:  long posting!  -khj]

  rs> Probably the latter is not used because you have a separate Gnus
  rs> package installed, cf. `M-x list-load-path-shadows RET'.

OK, I had time to look into this more ...

It is a "load path" issue.  Here is the value of my default
'load-path' (sorry for the length!):

       ("/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/oneliner-el"
       "/usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/html-helper-mode"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/html-helper-mode"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/gnuserv"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/dictionaries-common"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/chess"
       "/usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/chess/"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/bbdb"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/auctex/images"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/auctex"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/x-face-el"
       "/usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/remember-el"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/planner-el"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/debian-el"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/w3m"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/w3m/shimbun"
       "/usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/mailcrypt/"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/mailcrypt/"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/gnus-bonus-el"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/flim"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/emacs-wiki"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/emacs-goodies-el"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/dictionaries-common"
       "/usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/auctex/"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/auctex/"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/mule-ucs"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/apel"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/gnuplot-mode"
       "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/yacas"    "/etc/emacs21"    "/etc/emacs"
       "/usr/local/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp"
       "/usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp"    "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/apel"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/auctex"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/bbdb"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/chess"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/debian-el"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/dictionaries-common"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/emacs-goodies-el"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/emacs-wiki"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/flim"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/gnuplot-mode"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/gnus"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/gnus-bonus-el"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/gnuserv"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/html-helper-mode"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/mailcrypt"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/mule-ucs"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/oneliner-el"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/planner-el"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/w3m"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/x-face-el"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/yacas"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/w3m/shimbun"
       "/usr/share/emacs/site-lisp"               "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/leim"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp"       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/toolbar"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/textmodes"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/progmodes"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/play"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/obsolete" "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/net"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/mail"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/language"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/international"
 ==>   "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/gnus"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/eshell"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/emulation"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/emacs-lisp"
       "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/calendar")

       
Once I added "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/gnus" to the front, I was
able to use the 5.9.0 version of 'gnus'.  (Note a copy of that path
*is* in the fifth-to-the-last entry above).

Some questions:

  o Where is 'load-path' initialized?  

  o Should the "/usr/share/emacs21/*" entries precede the
    "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/*" ones?

  o Both "/etc/emacs" and "/etc/emacs21" exist ... is that correct?

  o Might the problem have something to do with the contents of
    /etc/{emacs,emacs21}/* ?

  o Am I using older versions of *other* things, too (e.g., 'eshell')?


Finally, here are all relevant installed Dapper packages:

       emacs-goodies-el/dapper uptodate 26.4-1
       emacs21/dapper uptodate 21.4a-3ubuntu2
       emacs21-bin-common/dapper uptodate 21.4a-3ubuntu2
       emacs21-common/dapper uptodate 21.4a-3ubuntu2
       emacs21-el/dapper uptodate 21.4a-3ubuntu2
       emacsen-common/dapper uptodate 1.4.17


Thanks for the help!

  -Kenneth

Re: Changes After Ubuntu Upgrade

[Reiner Steib]

On Mon, Jun 26 2006, Kenneth Jacker wrote:

>   rs> Probably the latter is not used because you have a separate Gnus
>   rs> package installed, cf. `M-x list-load-path-shadows RET'.
>
> OK, I had time to look into this more ...
>
> It is a "load path" issue.  Here is the value of my default
> 'load-path' (sorry for the length!):
>
>        ("/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/oneliner-el"
[...]
>        "/usr/share/emacs21/site-lisp/yacas"
>        "/etc/emacs21" "/etc/emacs"
>        "/usr/local/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp"
>        "/usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp"
>        "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp"
[...]
>        "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/site-lisp/gnus"

Is this "No Gnus v0.4"?

[...]
>        "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/international"
>  ==>   "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/gnus"
>        "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/eshell"
>        "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/emulation"
>        "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/emacs-lisp"
>        "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/calendar")
>
> Once I added "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/gnus" to the front, I was
> able to use the 5.9.0 version of 'gnus'.  (Note a copy of that path
> *is* in the fifth-to-the-last entry above).

Note that 5.9 is quite old.  I'd recommend to use 5.10.8 ("No Gnus" is
the development version).

> Some questions:
>
>   o Where is 'load-path' initialized?  

IIRC the initial value is already set at compile time on GNU/Linux.
Then, on startup, subdirectories of load-path directories are added if
the directory contains `subdirs.el' (see the function
`normal-top-level-add-subdirs-to-load-path' for details).

In Emacs 22, this results in the following `load-path':

 "$PREFIX/share/emacs/$VERSION/site-lisp"
 "$PREFIX/share/emacs/site-lisp"
 "$PREFIX/share/emacs/site-lisp/..." (-> subdirs.el)
 [...]
 "$PREFIX/share/emacs/$VERSION/leim"
 "$PREFIX/share/emacs/$VERSION/lisp"
 "$PREFIX/share/emacs/$VERSION/lisp/..." (-> subdirs.el)
 [...]

>   o Should the "/usr/share/emacs21/*" entries precede the
>     "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/*" ones?
>
>   o Both "/etc/emacs" and "/etc/emacs21" exist ... is that correct?
>
>   o Might the problem have something to do with the contents of
>     /etc/{emacs,emacs21}/* ?

All this is specific to Ubuntu (or probably Debian).  It should be
documented in distribution's Emacs policy document (I seem to recall
that several Emacs developers don't like the directory layout of
Debian).

>   o Am I using older versions of *other* things, too (e.g., 'eshell')?

Lookup "eshell" in the output of `M-x list-load-path-shadows RET'.

> Finally, here are all relevant installed Dapper packages:
>
>        emacs-goodies-el/dapper uptodate 26.4-1
>        emacs21/dapper uptodate 21.4a-3ubuntu2
>        emacs21-bin-common/dapper uptodate 21.4a-3ubuntu2
>        emacs21-common/dapper uptodate 21.4a-3ubuntu2
>        emacs21-el/dapper uptodate 21.4a-3ubuntu2
>        emacsen-common/dapper uptodate 1.4.17

Bye, Reiner.
-- 
       ,,,
      (o o)
---ooO-(_)-Ooo---  |  PGP key available  |  http://rsteib.home.pages.de/

Re: Changes After Ubuntu Upgrade

[Kenneth Jacker]

  >> Once I added "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/gnus" to the front, I
  >> was able to use the 5.9.0 version of 'gnus'.  (Note a copy of
  >> that path *is* in the fifth-to-the-last entry above).

  rs> Note that 5.9 is quite old.  I'd recommend to use 5.10.8 ("No
  rs> Gnus" is the development version).

OK.  I went ahead and removed the Ubuntu 'gnus' package, and changed
to gnus-5.10.8 from the 'tar' file.

When I first started the newest version, it asked if I wanted to
convert my files to 5.10.8.  After first backing up ;-), I said 'y'.

Everything seems OK except for one thing:  many, many of my previous
read files showed up again as unread.  Not sure why that happened ...

Might there be *other* conversion "issues" that haven't yet appeared?


Anyway, I'm going to go with this version for now.  If I still have
problems, I'll post again.

Thanks for all the help,

  -Kenneth

PS One other thing.  I'm using emacs-21.4.1 ... is that fully
   compatible with gnus-5.10.8?

Re: Changes After Ubuntu Upgrade

[Reiner Steib]

On Sat, Jul 01 2006, Kenneth Jacker wrote:

>   >> Once I added "/usr/share/emacs/21.4/lisp/gnus" to the front, I
>   >> was able to use the 5.9.0 version of 'gnus'.  (Note a copy of
>   >> that path *is* in the fifth-to-the-last entry above).
>
>   rs> Note that 5.9 is quite old.  I'd recommend to use 5.10.8 ("No
>   rs> Gnus" is the development version).
>
> OK.  I went ahead and removed the Ubuntu 'gnus' package, and changed
> to gnus-5.10.8 from the 'tar' file.
>
> When I first started the newest version, it asked if I wanted to
> convert my files to 5.10.8.  After first backing up ;-), I said 'y'.
>
> Everything seems OK except for one thing:  many, many of my previous
> read files showed up again as unread.  Not sure why that happened ...

This shouldn't happen when upgrading.  Downgrading isn't save in
general, though.

> PS One other thing.  I'm using emacs-21.4.1 ... is that fully
>    compatible with gnus-5.10.8?

Yes, Gnus 5.10.8 is supposed to be compatible with Emacs 21 (and even
20.7).

Bye, Reiner.
-- 
       ,,,
      (o o)
---ooO-(_)-Ooo---  |  PGP key available  |  http://rsteib.home.pages.de/